335i v 330i v 330d

[TW]Fox;18721816 said:
A 57 plate 330d is just 4mpg better on the combined cycle than a 57 plate 330i. 5mpg. Thats it. FIVE miles per gallon.

I agree with everything you've said there and I understand the point you're making, but isn't that slightly misleading?

The petrol was revised in 07, but the diesel in 08, so what you're really (conveniently :p) comparing there is older tech versus new. There's an 11mpg difference between the revised engines. I've no idea what the comparative figures are for the previous engines though.
 
I've spied a quite nice 330d coupé actually... with under 1K miles for £33k. Could easily knock that price down. Funnily enough, the difference between a 330d and a 335d in 0-60MPH timings is 0.1sec... hardly justifies the extra outlay?!
 
I agree with everything you've said there and I understand the point you're making, but isn't that slightly misleading?

No, I don't think its misleading at all.

The petrol was revised in 07, but the diesel in 08, so what you're really (conveniently :p) comparing there is older tech versus new. There's an 11mpg difference between the revised engines. I've no idea what the comparative figures are for the previous engines though.

If you have £20k to spend on a 3 Series Coupe, you cannot afford a 245bhp 330d, but you can afford a 272bhp 330i.

Therefore they are directly comparable - there is a whole year of overlap where they shared the range and its this production window that now makes up the £20kish market, as you well know yourself, driving a 231bhp variant and not the 245..

You need £25k+ for a high spec 245bhp 58 plate onwards 330d.
 
I've spied a quite nice 330d coupé actually... with under 1K miles for £33k. Could easily knock that price down. Funnily enough, the difference between a 330d and a 335d in 0-60MPH timings is 0.1sec... hardly justifies the extra outlay?!

I think you are barking mad spending that sort of money on an E92, personally. Just cannot see the need.
 
[TW]Fox;18721943 said:
I think you are barking mad spending that sort of money on an E92, personally. Just cannot see the need.

Maybe so, but I am getting rid of my Lotus according to several factors:

- Warranty expires in June
- It will need new tyres mid-Summer
- Service due in June
- Tax due in June

This is my urgency factor unfortunately, otherwise I would just wait and wait and wait for the very right car at the right spec and the right price and mileage.
 
[TW]Fox;18721940 said:
No, I don't think its misleading at all.



If you have £20k to spend on a 3 Series Coupe, you cannot afford a 245bhp 330d, but you can afford a 272bhp 330i.

Therefore they are directly comparable - there is a whole year of overlap where they shared the range and its this production window that now makes up the £20kish market, as you well know yourself, driving a 231bhp variant and not the 245..

You need £25k+ for a high spec 245bhp 58 plate onwards 330d.

I was reading it from a buying-new-1-2-3-years-ago point of view, see your point from the second hand angle. As you know and have mentioned, highly dependant on the market unfortunately, 330i just wasnt an option when I was looking, the right one just wasnt for sale.

Will be very interesting to see what the market for LCI 3XXs looks like when they're hitting 3 years old.
 
Gah.

I am at a loss now. The 1 Series is quite small inside - I like the space of the 3 series; yet the 3 series vehicles are mostly leggy mileage, dogged interiors or weaker models (318SE, etc) with much reduced power.

I can't help but think that the Lotus has spoilt me - demanding supercar performance for 'adequate' MPG with top handling in any replacement car.
 
Good write up as always. I would be very happy with a 320i E90, never mind some of the machines talked about here! As you say Fox, E92s attract such a premium over the saloons.
 
[TW]Fox;18720961 said:
PMKeates new 535d had the diesel-rattle as well (But as it was an auto, not the gearstick) :p
Just noticed this, and it's completely true.
Sure, you know mines a diesel at start up but the second it's moving it's not noticeable unless you hit the throttle hard.
I think I said to Fox at the time, after I'd driven it, "it's a good engine, but you definitely can tell it's a diesel all the time". If you can't tell it's a diesel you are either deaf or numb :p

Although, that's not to say it's a necessarily a bad thing that you can tell. It's not overly harsh or going to rattle your fillings out, but it's not as refined as a petrol, and that's me comparing it to my 10 year old 191,000 mile petrol engine.
 
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interesting comparison, ESPECIALLY on the manual vs auto. I've not driven a manual 335, only an auto, and do kind of agree with the comments on it being almost too quick for a lot of scenarios. one of my favourite roads near where I live, which is fairly narrow but good for a decent pace, in the 335i was the first time i've found myself backing off. I actually remember thinking to myself that at least in that situation, I'd reached the limit of usable power.

That said, the auto on roads like the snakes pass where overtaking spots are short and sweet, or complex roads with lots of speed variations makes a lot of sense, I really enjoyed the ability to keep both hands on the wheel and of course when not hooning, the auto is a fantasticly able box for pottering around in. I do still hold out hope for owning a 335i, and I do think it'll be a DCT or an auto, not a manual, but I'd have to drive both.

The 330i/d is an interesting read too, as if I was to get a company car these are far more likely candidates than anything with 2 turbos. If this becomes an option I'll have to go for a drive :)
 
[TW]Fox;18721940 said:
No, I don't think its misleading at all.



If you have £20k to spend on a 3 Series Coupe, you cannot afford a 245bhp 330d, but you can afford a 272bhp 330i.

Therefore they are directly comparable - there is a whole year of overlap where they shared the range and its this production window that now makes up the £20kish market, as you well know yourself, driving a 231bhp variant and not the 245..

You need £25k+ for a high spec 245bhp 58 plate onwards 330d.

But your point regarding the self-fulling prophecy applies to new cars coming into circulation, not 2nd hand cars doing the rounds.
 
But your point regarding the self-fulling prophecy applies to new cars coming into circulation, not 2nd hand cars doing the rounds.

It's also already happened as the 330i Saloon and Touring have been discontinued for over a year now.

Obviously the £40,000 car buyers enjoyed the whopping 8mpg more they get from the tractor :(
 
[TW]Fox;18720486 said:
BMW 335i M Sport
N54B30, 306bhp, 0-60 5.4 seconds


Auto

I also tried an auto 335i. This was an SE but drives no differently to the M Sport, as the SE has standard fit M Sport suspension. What I'm going to say next is going to be quite controversial and perhaps reinforce the boring image I seem to have on these forums.

The controversial bit. This car and gearbox combination left me feeling that this car was simply.. well... errr.. too fast. Once I'd gotten over the initial excitement of the way it simply gathered speed like nothing else I'd ever driven I began to find it - and this wont make any sense at all - rather dull and uninvolving. Everything happened so quickly I was left with nothing really to do but a) hang on and b) watch the speedo like a hawk to avoid being arrested, imprisoned or killed to death in a fiery crash. I'm sure some of you would love this level of performance but for me it was so quick it sort of spoiled the car.


Doesn't make you boring, makes you want to be more involved. Different strokes and all that.
I'm from the other side of the fence, I see the gear change as restrictive and limiting (me being a big factor in the limitation of course).

Auto's can be immense fun, if you let them be. You have to forget about gear changes with a stick and clutch (easier if you haven't driven a manual in a long time mind) and give the car the chance to impress you with what it does do best.

The 330i auto that I had for a few days was perfect combination of gearbox and engine imo, fast enough to have fun but not 335i crazy fast :)

The coupe sports look fantastic, though for me (due to family) i'd prefer an LCI 'loon (with the 5 spokes though!)
 
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I agree, the LCI Saloon looks bang on and i would have one of the very few LCI Saloon N53 330i's in a heart beat.
 
[TW]Fox;18721655 said:
Thats odd really because the E90 M3 wasn't afflicted by the horrible front end of the E90 pre LCI, it had a different design.

2009 private sale : £42,995

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2502417.htm

2008 with the same miles from a BMW dealer : 35k

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2473981.htm

2008 with a bit more miles , non franchised dealer : £29,995

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2195246.htm

Unless its purely the DCT thats helping it hold its value rather than the age ?
 
[TW]Fox;18721816 said:
Diesel will never really be the enthusiasts *choice* - though we may be forced into them for other reasons. Diesel works in many cars - it's good in a big luxury car, it's great for pounding motorways in a 530d or similar, etc etc but if you want to really enjoy driving I dont think it will ever compare to a decent petrol engine and it doesnt matter how fast they are because the performance isn't the point.

We are being ever forced down the diesel route because most car buyers are misinformed or base purchasing decisions on perception and assumption - they assume you need a diesel without checking what the petrol is like. The salesman tells them they need a diesel or the residuals will be terrible. The salesman tells them the diesel is as good as the petrol when the reality of it is that the salesman has probably never driven the petrol let alone lived with it.

And the more people who buy them, the more it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Everywhere you go on the internet and discuss diesel there is overwhelming amounts of purchase justification syndrome going on. People WANT to think diesel is better - because the circumstances they are in dictate they must have diesel, or they already have diesel, and they end up beleiving it it is better, full stop.

How many people who ordered a 330d tried a 330i first? Hardly any. I'd be amazed if it was even 5%. So in reality they've no idea how it compares - they just took the word of the salesman.

A 57 plate 330d is just 4mpg better on the combined cycle than a 57 plate 330i. 5mpg. Thats it. FIVE miles per gallon.

A 100 mile journey in the 330d at the combined mpg would cost £14.70. In the 330i it would cost £15.95..

In 10 years time you simply will not be able to buy a car like a 330i.

And that is a huge, huge, huge shame.



You think they ask the salesman ??

Look at Wez's car buying thread. He decided he wanted a BMW, went out and found the nearest one and bought it.

This is how the vast majority of people buy cars. I talk to plenty of parents at the school gates etc.. and its amazing how many of them buy their cars this way, and go into the show room having already decided they want a diesel because its cheaper. I've no idea where people get the idea from, i think its just some urban myth thats now become common among non car bore types like us.
 
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