March in London on the 26th?

Athanor said:
Can I just say Tummy that although I don't necessarily agree with you, your posts, points and attitude have the air of reason about them that will certainly persuade people to listen and understand your point.

I'm enjoying your posts and honestly finding them balanced and informative.

Just thought I'd say...
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I'm a personal and chatty kind of guy, I really dislike it when people use me as an spokesman for the entire march or take my views as that which are universally shared, I've been shot down and named called in this thread, horrific.

So thank you :)

Superewza said:
Out of interest, what don't you agree with? To be honest i've probably said some things i'll regret later when i'm in a less lazy mood, but still :p

I'll come back to the other posts in a bit, things to attend to first :)
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Most of what you say?

Look, even if you don't agree with the cuts (which I don't, I think they shouldn't be doing this (I've pointed out my thoughts and since been flamed for it but I have an opinion)) I understand why. I understand why they're cutting, I just don't buy in to that.

It's kind of like buying food, you buy coke, everyone else buys pepsi, I won't hate on people for not liking what I'm drinking, and it would be nice for it to work vise versa, discussion about the said drinks and nature of the drinks if cool as long as it stay civil. All that's happened is the coke lovers have gone off on a walk to say we should all drink coke, in this thread all the pepsi lovers are out and killing me. You come along, with some fruity weird fizzy drink, nobody quite likes nor understands.

That probably sucks, but it's cause I'm quite high on painkillers and it feels like my head is about to cave in after I got in to a fight with an underground carriage door.
 
Superewza said:
I could argue it on two fronts:

1) We don't need spending cuts.

2) We don't need money.

What would you prefer?
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Several people have asked you to argue your points and you haven't yet...

Personally I'd love for you to tell me why we don't need money. Better yet, if you could tell my landlord and the bank (who I still owe a bit to for my car) why they don't need money, you'd be really helping me out.
Oh, and my computers getting on a bit, fancy telling Spie why he doesn't need money either, perhaps he'll let me have some parts.
Oh, while we're at it, can you also tell the electricity board so I can use my free computer in the flat I don't pay rent for. Also, could you let the co-op know too so I can pop in there when I get hungry.

Ta

Also, if you could actually argue your reasons and not just use quotes from leftie websites that'd be just swell. Looking forward to not having to work any more, thanks :)
 
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He's right in the sense we don't need money, it just represents something if that makes sense. They used fish as currancy at one point in American history?

Not having money or a currancy all together? Christ. I don't like Capitalism, but I don't hate on it, I think it can work if it's kept in line if that makes sense, not because it's good, but because the alternatives suck.
 
Robboftw said:
You see, even a fellow protestor thinks he's a nutter!
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Two fellow protesters.

I agree with what Superweza says on occasion, but recently that's becoming a very rare occasion! But then again, that's fine - he doesn't need to agree with me, I don't need to agree with him - variety is the spice of life.

Tummy said:
Not having money or a currancy all together? Christ. I don't like Capitalism, but I don't hate on it, I think it can work if it's kept in line if that makes sense, not because it's good, but because the alternatives suck.
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Tummy - what are your views on altruistic capitalism? Many say it wont work, but I think it should be given a serious go.

John Lewis is generally only major UK company currently implementing a business plan closest the philosophy and making a success of it by all accounts. Having said that, Sainsburys seems to be heading down that path, another progressive company by all accounts.

Oh, currently on a First Class train departing Euston as we speak - what a weekend, one I'll remember for a LONG time. Looks like we'll be back in May!
 
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Athanor said:
Can I just say Tummy that although I don't necessarily agree with you, your posts, points and attitude have the air of reason about them that will certainly persuade people to listen and understand your point.

I'm enjoying your posts and honestly finding them balanced and informative.

Just thought I'd say...
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While I dont agree with some of Tummy's thinking, I can somewhat understand where he is coming from and I know he's a decent chap so I dont mind him at all.

Not coming across as a fanatical nutter does tend to help your case in threads like these, someone really needs to tell that to Superewza... :(
 
Chris [BEANS];18767674 said:
Several people have asked you to argue your points and you haven't yet...

Personally I'd love for you to tell me why we don't need money. Better yet, if you could tell my landlord and the bank (who I still owe a bit to for my car) why they don't need money, you'd be really helping me out.
Oh, and my computers getting on a bit, fancy telling Spie why he doesn't need money either, perhaps he'll let me have some parts.
Oh, while we're at it, can you also tell the electricity board so I can use my free computer in the flat I don't pay rent for. Also, could you let the co-op know too so I can pop in there when I get hungry.

Ta

Also, if you could actually argue your reasons and not just quotes from leftie websites that'd be just swell. Looking forward to not having to work any more, thanks :)
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I've been waiting to hear this too! I've always wanted to give up work!:)
 
Robboftw said:
Not coming across as a fanatical nutter does tend to help your case in threads like these, someone really needs to tell that to Superewza... :(
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Isn't that true for all walks of life?

You have lots of different people in any given situation, but we can all spot the mentalist :p

Super occasionally makes good points and comes across well, but in this thread some of the stuff he's on about it a bit daft :)
 
Superewza said:
Just woke up, after being caught in Cameron's 'Operation Halt All Trains For Slight Revenge' ;)

Was a great march, met a lot of people and now i can't be bothered to sift through 20 pages worth of right wing complaining.

As for the violence? There was very little of it. Nobody was hurt. Actually, the police were the only violent ones. Violence means attacking people. What some were doing was attacking property. Of which there is no such thing. There's personal property, which you need to survive and to exercise your craft, and there's private property - which implies that you have something that somebody else needs and they must earn it. This is not the case, it is just an illusion.

So here's the real story:

The UK Uncut action was peaceful in every sense of the word, including the occupations on Oxford St. The occupation of F&M was also completely peaceful, with no stock being damaged at all. Outside what appeared to be the Black Bloc were attacking property, and good on them for doing so - brilliant organization on their part. Later on the occupation of Trafalgar Square (i believe it was there anyway) was also completely peaceful in every sense of the word, the police were just looking for a fight and so when somebody stuck a sticker on the Olympic Clock they screamed criminal damage and went in all guns blazing.

Also, to those who were saying there would only be a few thousand, lets have a look at the scale of this. I arrived at Embankment at about 11:30, where everywhere you could see, including the bridges and side streets, was packed with people. Surprisingly light police presence, but i'm not going to complain. Anyway, after battling my way to where my dad's union (Unison) was, we began the march. This is more than 20 people wide the whole way through, and we were pretty near the front apparently. Definitely more than three people per meter squared to start with. Anyway, at no point did we actually see the start, and we definitely didn't see the end. By the time we arrived in Hyde Park the area in front of the stage was packed, and people were still pouring in. We got a text from somebody an hour later saying they were still stuck at Embankment. At roughly 7PM the march finished, when everybody made it to Hyde Park. That's easily half a million, probably more.
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Absolutely incredible, what a unique person.
 
Tummy said:
Please stay away from this thread, what with your normal ability to know lots about everything I don't want you involved in a thread on politics, my head hurts enough.
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Hmmmmm, not sure how to take that....:(

I just wanted a ride around London in a golf buggy...


There are people here, Dolph and Scorza in particular who have far more experience and interest in debating Politics than I.

I can research it a bit though, if you like.;)
 
Al Vallario said:
Trust me. You'll regret absolutely everything you've said in this thread — and being a Socialist more generally — in ten years time when you're wiser and have some life experience under your belt.

If you really think — at the age of what, 17? — that you know it all when it comes to political philosophy, you are so impossibly wrong it's embarrassing just pointing it out.
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Youth and experience have nothing to do with it.

I've been hopelessly capitalist from an early age and I'm only 21 now.
 
Castiel said:
Hmmmmm, not sure how to take that....:(


There are people here, Dolph and Scorza in particular who have far more experience and interest in debating Politics than I.

I can research it a bit though, if you like.;)
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No, just no :p

I've been shot and burned enough for a while thanks :)

Ps. Your superman sig is the best \o/
 
Castiel said:
I just wanted a ride around London in a golf buggy...
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Cast, you know what was REALLY funny, I met two very militant grannies on my wander and they both looked near death (from the walk not just 'cause they're old) and I said "You should 'ave them little electronic buggies"

I thought of the golf buggy conversation and imagined driving superman through london in one.

In all seriousness, the two old ladies would have charged the police / downing street had they had something that big. No joke.
 
Tummy said:
He's right in the sense we don't need money, it just represents something if that makes sense. They used fish as currancy at one point in American history?

Not having money or a currancy all together? Christ. I don't like Capitalism, but I don't hate on it, I think it can work if it's kept in line if that makes sense, not because it's good, but because the alternatives suck.
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But I'm sure we all agree that we need to represent our 'worth'. If I work and another doesn't, I should be worth more. I should be able to exchange the fruits of my labour for goods I want or need.
Money is (so far as I can see it) the best way to represent our 'worth'.

I can see that the far left think that we should all be equal, some should not have lots while others have little, but the fact is, that worth came from somewhere. Whether it be smart choices, hard work or sheer physical might and taking it from those weaker, but that is human nature. We all want to better ourselves, want better things for our loved ones etc. Abolition of money is idealistic, unsustainable, nonsense.


As for you being trashed in this thread.... Dude, we clearly have VERY different opinions, but just as you disagree with cuts but understand the reasoning behind them, I disagree with your views but understand where you're coming from also.
The reason for my understanding is your rational arguments for them and your willingness to engage and explain why you believe these things.
I'm glad you're in this thread dude and I enjoy your posts. There'd be no thread if we all had the same views!! :)
 
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Oh I've no problem with money, just wish some nice soul would give me a lot more of it :p

Cheers Chris.

I don't agree with a lot of people's views on here, but I'd never shoot them down for it. It's interesting reading what the "other side" think and I understand them, just don't agree.

Nah, if I wasn't here I think Super would be getting a right beating so to speak haha
 
Chris [BEANS];18767796 said:
But I'm sure we all agree that we need to represent our 'worth'. If I work and another doesn't, I should be worth more.
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Which is the fundamental difference between you and Super, he doesn't believe that you are "worth" more. Everyone is equal, the person working 50 hours a week and the person doing nothing. In his world everyone just magically gets what they need and no one has to work for it. He sees Cuba as some sort of utopia for Marx's sake!
 
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