Noooeeesss is the GF1 extinct?

Dinomania

Dinomania

Dinomania

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Joined
21 Apr 2003
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I've been drooling over the Panasonic GF1 camera for some time now, promising to buy it for myself at the end of this academic year when I should have gained my Qualified Teacher Status.

BUT it seems it's becoming ever more rare, and expensive, especially as a kit with the 20mm pancake lens. I don't want the GF2, it sounds like it's trying too hard and I prefer buttons to touch screens.

Have I missed the boat? Just been phoning around Jessops stores that only seem to have display models left (why they're still displaying cameras they no longer stock, I don't know) that they're unwilling to sell - and these shops are at least 30 miles away as it is...

I'm hearing things about the Sony NEX 5 - is it really any cop?

What I really want is a camera which is complicated enough to keep me happy, simple enough that I can take it out without myriad lenses, and that will give me both landscape capability but also nice portraits with creamy backgrounds when I choose it. The GF1 with 20mm pancake seemed ideal, but looks like it's disappearing... :(

Are there any other good new alternatives to choose from?
 
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Ah cheers Rich, good to have a solid recommendation (esp as they are actually in stock there!!).

Not a bad price, either, given the increasing scarcity of the things. Now just have to convince myself to drop a load of cash on it...
 
I couldn't see any second-hand on the 'bay when I just looked - maybe I should check my search string...

EDIT: aahh, plenty body-only, not many with the 20mm lens...
 
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sara said:
I've been drooling over the Panasonic GF1 camera for some time now, promising to buy it for myself at the end of this academic year when I should have gained my Qualified Teacher Status.

BUT it seems it's becoming ever more rare, and expensive, especially as a kit with the 20mm pancake lens. I don't want the GF2, it sounds like it's trying too hard and I prefer buttons to touch screens.

Have I missed the boat? Just been phoning around Jessops stores that only seem to have display models left (why they're still displaying cameras they no longer stock, I don't know) that they're unwilling to sell - and these shops are at least 30 miles away as it is...

I'm hearing things about the Sony NEX 5 - is it really any cop?

What I really want is a camera which is complicated enough to keep me happy, simple enough that I can take it out without myriad lenses, and that will give me both landscape capability but also nice portraits with creamy backgrounds when I choose it. The GF1 with 20mm pancake seemed ideal, but looks like it's disappearing... :(

Are there any other good new alternatives to choose from?
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Just to say that if landscapes and portraits are what you want and you don't want to be changing lenses then I don't think the 20mm lens is for you, nor the whole Micro-4/3rds system.

Given then sensor size, the 20mm will become a 40mm effective lens, which for most people is useless for landscape photography. Not that you need an ultra wide angle, but you really want something close to a 24mm equivalent, i.e 12mm on MFT cameas like the GF1. (and alternative something in the 70-200 range makes excellent landscape lens for details), but the middle ground from 30-70mm is not very interesting.

The 20mm will make an OK portrait lens, but really you would something with more reach, and moreover, the MFT system does not lend itself to shallow DoF like you describe.

The MFT system only really excels in the very small size, and even then many f the cameras are not much smaller than an entry level DSLR. The E-PL2 stands out as something that is exactly small.


I think you need to choose if you want a fixed lens or interchangeable lens camera. If you don't want to be changing lenses then buy an S95/LX5/G12 type camera - much smaller and more convenient. Interchangeable lens cameras really only make sense if you use multiple task-specific lenses (unless there are specific handling issues required)
 
Well, honestly - I fancy the challenge of having a single lens/zoom level, and I have never owned a camera with the possibility of changing lenses before - but I'd like the flexibility to be able to do so in future without buying a giant DSLR (I'm only little).

MFT will lend itself much better to shallow DoF than any compact camera of a similar size though, no?

I own a bridge camera, which is nice but not quite flexible enough (and a bit dated now at a maximum 4MP resolution) - I could get nice portraits but I'd have to run a long way away and zoom back in to get the effect I wanted - but it seems very possible with the GF1 and the pancake: http://www.flickr.com/photos/simon_j/4110782710/

I realise bokeh is old-hat now. But I like it. Also I want this powerful little box, with the possibility of changing lenses, and the knowledge it has a physically large sensor. Want.
 
Broken Hope said:
Aren't the NEX series cameras MFT? They seem to handle shallow DoF okay

e.g


The NEx cameras have an APS-C sensor which helps a lot once you put a f/1.4 or f/1.8 lens on it.

All depends how shallow you want the DoF but an APS-C sensor is a good starting point for shallow DoF.
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sara said:
Well, honestly - I fancy the challenge of having a single lens/zoom level, and I have never owned a camera with the possibility of changing lenses before - but I'd like the flexibility to be able to do so in future without buying a giant DSLR (I'm only little).

MFT will lend itself much better to shallow DoF than any compact camera of a similar size though, no?

I own a bridge camera, which is nice but not quite flexible enough (and a bit dated now at a maximum 4MP resolution) - I could get nice portraits but I'd have to run a long way away and zoom back in to get the effect I wanted - but it seems very possible with the GF1 and the pancake: http://www.flickr.com/photos/simon_j/4110782710/

I realise bokeh is old-hat now. But I like it. Also I want this powerful little box, with the possibility of changing lenses, and the knowledge it has a physically large sensor. Want.
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The thing is, Landscapes and portraits are 2 completely different types of photography and will need a very different lens. Not to say you can't make a great landscape photo from a portrait lens, but you will struggle with the 20mm for sure. The kit lens would make a much better option TBH.

PS: you would be surprised how little difference there is between a GF1 and an entry level DSLR. The D3100 is about 150g heavier, more or less the same 2D dimension but has twice the depth, which helps handling a lot.


Anyway, I realize that I sound like I am discouraging you from the GF1, which i don't want to do. Just be aware that having just the 20mm pancake is very restrictive. It lends itself best to street photography rather than portraiture or landscape. Getting the kit lens + a 20mm panscake will open new doors and make a more versatile package.
 
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I have the Panasonic GF1 and it is one of the best cameras I have ever owned or used.

I was lucky to have got it for a very good price from the members market with the 20mm pancake kit lens.

I havn't had much chance to use it properly but I havn't felt restricted by the 20mm (40mm) lens as I don't do landscape photography that often.

If you ever get the GF1 you should consider the Panasonic 7-14mm f/4 (14-28mm after sensor crop) for landscape/architecture photography or the Olympus 12-60mm f/2.8-4 (24-120mm) lens, as it should give you decent wide angle view and good zoom range.

Both these lenses are built to a professional standard and demand a higher price tag.

Good luck.
 
Also ever since I've been taking pictures, and researching techniques, and using my bridge camera - I've wanted a small camera with a big sensor. Compact cameras with those tiny wee 1/2" or whatever sensors just don't allow you to play with the image.

I want compact, and I want aperture and shutter settings to actually make a decent impact on my pictures, I want to /play/ but without carrying a huge bag of kit around.

Hence me wanting such a thing.

Shame the NEX 5 Sony camera is so ugly!
 
sara said:
D.P. maybe I misunderstand the 'proper' definition of landscape?

Like, I realise this is a very good photographer - but his landscapes with the setup I want look wonderful: http://craigmod.com/journal/gf1-fieldtest/

Is it that the 20mm is too wide? Not wide enough? Distorting? What?
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There is no definition and one can make great landscape photos with any focal length lens, it is just that that most people, most of the time will prefer to to use something wider than 40mm (Full frame equivalent, i.e. the 20mm pancake lens) or something narrower.

The middle ground for many is just not interesting for landscape photographers. There are always exceptions, and going wide is not the be-all and end-all (in fact, I think most people should keep away form the ultra-wide angle since it is so challenging to get a pleasing composition).

Have a look at Ansel Adams' work, the most famous landscape photographer of all time (use Google images). Although he used medium and large format cameras, he compositions are either fairly wide or moderate telephoto. His photographs with intermediate focal lengths ('normal' lenses) are mostly portraiture of trees, rocks formations, cactus, etc.).

A more modern example is Galen Rowell (who is also sadly departed), the used Nikon 35mm film cameras and much of his work was with 20mm and 24mm lenses (10-12mm on a MFT camera), or also the Nikon 80-400 VR (something like the 50-200mm in MFT mount).
Galen Rowell philosophy was small and light, he would trek many miles, and would often require rock climbing and abseiling to get to locations for photography.



From the link you posted, i'm not impressed by any of the landscape photos, the portraiture on the other hand is very nice. Which is what I would expect from a 20mm lens on a MFT camera.
 
sara said:
Also ever since I've been taking pictures, and researching techniques, and using my bridge camera - I've wanted a small camera with a big sensor. Compact cameras with those tiny wee 1/2" or whatever sensors just don't allow you to play with the image.

I want compact, and I want aperture and shutter settings to actually make a decent impact on my pictures, I want to /play/ but without carrying a huge bag of kit around.

Hence me wanting such a thing.

Shame the NEX 5 Sony camera is so ugly!
Click to expand...


Nikon should announce its mirror-less lens soon (maybe next week even). Should make another choice.
 
in reviews the nex5 gets knocked down for being a bit fiddly to get to the settings that you want

if i remember correctly though they fixed that with a firmware update

if its the gf1 you really want then get a body only from store/ebay then buy the lens separately ?
 
Yo, excuse the name change.

"andy" nice idea but the most expensive way! Mathers of Lancs as mentioned above seems to be the best option at the moment.

D.P. I think we're at cross-purposes... At the moment, I want a shiny new camera which has flexibility options in future with regards to different lenses, but that for the moment offers me an interesting fixed-length challenge, it's not something I've done before.

My idea of landscape isn't necessarily big and dramatic - all I mean is that I can get more in the shot than a zoom, and that I can get much of it into focus. So my thinking may be wrong and maybe I should never have said landscape in the first place - I'm not one to hike to crazy places for exciting shots of scenery. And, if I do photograph scenery - it's probably more how you described some of Ansel's work: portraiture of trees/formations etc.

And, I'd prefer the camera more for portraits, events and sightseeing.

So anyway, whether I've justified myself in your eyes or not - I /still/ fancy the challenge of the pancake lens and a MFT camera, think they look wonderful, and love the pictures I've seen taken by them.

I have thought of the Sammy NX series as someone said above - but indeed I heard the lens system was restrictive, and they're just not as pretty. And the Sony NEX is uuuuugly and unbalanced-looking.
 
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