March in London on the 26th?

Von Smallhausen said:
Nick Herbert has just been on the box praising the Met and their handling of the demonstrations as well as the violence and laid into armchair critics.

Perhaps that and the excellent job the Met do policing a city of 7 million by night and about 12 million by day with 35,000 officers on the books should be considered before police pay and conditions are slashed as the Coalition intends.
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I've said in the thread that my opinion on the Police changed during the march and felt they handled everything very well, I wasn't around at the very end with the problems at night but during the day they were nothing other then fantastic.

They were in support more often then not for the March, some against it and a few didn't care. I found it a bit eye opening that there were tonnes of support staff and wives / partners of the Police force out protesting against cuts to the police.

Re; armchair critics, meh, what do you expect with rolling news and everyone thinking they're right? It was A LOT different on the ground Saturday then what the news made it out to be, the Police were brilliant, the March was brilliant just a few stupid young men out to cause trouble.
 
OldCoals said:
Should the Labour party support the unions even when the stance they take is damaging?
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Well the last Labour governmnet wasn't exactly friendly towards the unions!

Tummy said:
Re; armchair critics, meh, what do you expect with rolling news and everyone thinking they're right? It was A LOT different on the ground Saturday then what the news made it out to be, the Police were brilliant, the March was brilliant just a few stupid young men out to cause trouble.
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We were there pal, rather than being coseted in our nice warm, cosy "I'm alright jack" enviroments, and we're proud (I'm sure you wont mind me including you in this) that we did siomething, in a peaceful manner, trying to make a difference for something we believe in. Don't let anyone get you down by telling you you're wrong and be preapred to do this again int he future, and for as long as it takes to make that change happen. If I'm still having this fight in 4 years then bring it on!
 
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from a friends blog said:
- Essentially what he is saying is there doesn’t need to be a ‘sense of solidarity that everybody is bearing some of the pain any more’ because whilst the disabled, the elderly, and the most vulnerable lose all sorts of care, Cable is allowing the richest few to pay less tax. What an obscene man he has become. I wonder if the Vince Cable of 2010 who warned of the “same old Tories” would appreciate the Vince Cable of 2011 becoming one of the same old Tories. It is the biggest ideological attack in many many years. It is not the “only way”.

The issue from Tory MPs and those who seem to have very short memories, and an apparent lack of attention to detail, now seems to be that no one is setting out an alternative, to deep austerity. As if Neoliberalism is the only possible way. The problem with that is…
1) Labour set out an alternative before the election.
2) Pre May 2010 Lib Dems had an alternative.
3) Reforming the clear imbalance between cuts and taxes is an alternative. Tax more, do not cut Corporation tax, raise it. Impose a stricter set of regulations on banks and impose a far far higher levy. Robin hood tax. Close all tax avoidance loopholes. Ensure that Companies such as Diageo agree to pay back all of what they owe over a set period. Do not abolish tax on offshore profits bought back to the UK. DO NOT abolish the 50p tax rate, as Vince Cable announced would be abolished as early as 2013. Stop promoting the idea that we are like Greece. We aren’t, in any way like Greece, nor were we heading that way. That’s an alternative. It is a wholly left wing alternative, but an alternative nevertheless. Keynes set out an alternative. Stiglitz set out an alternative. Roubini, McCulley, Romer, Krugman, Pettifor, ****arides, Kalecki, Blinder, and many many other economic and political theorists have many different alternatives than deep austerity. Thereisabetterway.org sets out alternatives. To ask ordinary people to sacrifice their jobs and their livelihoods, for the sake of a mass of tax cuts, is not the only way. To claim no one could possibly come up with an alternative, is massively ignorant.
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Just food for thoughts.

Edit, he was talking about Vince Cable at the start and his hypocrisy.
 
Tummy said:
Just food for thoughts.

Edit, he was talking about Vince Cable at the start and his hypocrisy.
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I've seen the same thing said from many Lib Dem blogs - the LibDems have probably done more to increase Labour support than anyone - talk about driving people into the arms of your enemy!
 
Tummy said:
Just food for thoughts.

Edit, he was talking about Vince Cable at the start and his hypocrisy.
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Tax more, do not cut Corporation tax, raise it. Impose a stricter set of regulations on banks and impose a far far higher levy.
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what happens when they start moving away and your tax revenue plummets?

You'll have to increase the taxes on the "poor" much much more to compensate.

Remember the "evil capitalists" and their corporations are perfectly willing to vote with their wallets (ironically unlike the socialists) and move.
 
We had the same thing here in Brussels as well, I must say that the people in Brussels blocking the roads and causing trouble were paid hippies hell bent on causing trouble.

Here in Belgium they reduced a 3 lane main artery into Brussels to a single lane and blocked it completely during the traffic lights only allowing a single lane to drive every 2nd green light. There were only around 30 of them and you could tell straight away that they didn't form part of the union organised protestors, they were scruffy, unwashed, bigger and tougher than the students who were actually protesting they were all men (as opposed to the 50-50 split with students) and the student protestors acutually looked bewildered at their actions. There were 6 police officers standing by hands in pockets. Apparently this type of organised agressive tactics seems to be more prevalent judging by the picture from the London protests.

I do hope the police do launch some sort of investigation to weed these criminals out.
 
Tefal said:
what happens when they start moving away and your tax revenue plummets?

You'll have to increase the taxes on the "poor" much much more to compensate.

Remember the "evil capitalists" and their corporations are perfectly willing to vote with their wallets (ironically unlike the socialists) and move.
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Capitalist in "more tax for capitalists is bad" shocker!

Scaremongering, that's all that argunment is - there is no evidence that this happens. Do you think the North Sea oil companies are going to upsticks and move due to the 30% tax levy (a Tory levy at that!)?

No - they wont. Businesses are tied to thier customer base, they don't just up sticks because of a 0.05% tax being levied (which is all the Robin Hood tax is). Do you really think that someone like HP, with their multi-billion government contracts will just abandon the market if they get taxed a little more?

It's like those that say "i'm not doing overtime because they take it all off me". NO! They only take 30% (or whatever tax band you're in) off you - you're still left with 70% of it!
 
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amigafan2003 said:
Capitalist in "more tax for capitalists is bad" shocker!

Scaremongering, that's all that argunment is - there is no evidence that this happens.
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16,000 non doms left when they introduced the levy compared to just 5,400 that paid it.

which cost them nearly 5 times as much in lost tax revue than they gained...


They companies don't have to leave completely but they may well cut down their presence in the country after all a bank can reduce it's presence here and move to another major financial city if necessary, heck in most cases they can even take a lot of the profitable workers with them so you lose their tax and spending too


Do you really think that someone like HP, with their multi-billion government contracts will just abandon the market if they get taxed a little more?
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banks might move their headquarters over the extra £10 billion they're expected to pay over the term though.
 
Tefal said:
banks might move their headquarters over the extra £10 billion they're expected to pay over the term though.
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Great - that will reduce the government's total liabilities by a massive amount. We seriously do not want to be the world's financial capital any more, and neither does anyone else for that matter.
 
Tefal said:
16,000 non doms left when they introduced the levy compared to just 5,400 that paid it.
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Do you have a source for that? It's a point of argument I've not heard before and I'd like to do some more investigation on the matter.
 
http://www.taxation.co.uk/taxation/articles/2011/01/13/21541/uk-loses-16000-non-doms-one-year


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...ake-for-Britains-economy-and-its-society.html


11% of them.


like i said capitalist vote with their wallets because to them that's their equivalent of marching around waving a banner and chanting.

You may not hear about it but to the people who make the decisions it's not something as easily ignored as a simple few days of irritating people chanting in the street.

what would have genuinely been interesting is if you'd have gotten 200,000 people to refuse to pay tax this year, after all they can't jail you all.


Also ho come you skip over an extra "£10 billion as "just a little more", considering how money grubbing you portray the banks as 10 billion is a heck of an incentive.
 
Tax more, do not cut Corporation tax, raise it. Impose a stricter set of regulations on banks and impose a far far higher levy.
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Why is the left so deluded that they can only ever think of tax, tax, tax

Tax is BAD for the economy, you want the MINIMUM level possible - go ask any economist who actually knows what they are talking about
 
Tefal said:
considering how money grubbing you portray the banks as 10 billion is a heck of an incentive.
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Please find a SINGLE one of my posts where I've said such a thing.

I think you'll find I've never blamed hte banks for the mess we're in.
 
HEADRAT said:
That's very low for a pension that will allow you to retire at 50, obviously that's why the Government are trying to change it.
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And I am quite prepared to pay more towards it. I accept that I have to do my bit but the police pension should stay as it is in terms of retirement after 30 years an the renumeration that goes with it.
 
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