Dutch Ritual Slaughter Ban a Step Closer

philip2009 · 9 Apr 2011 at 03:02

In Holland, a proposal to ban Kosher and Halal slaughter methods has moved a step closer to reality, with a majority of the country’s MPs now supporting the ban.

In order to reduce stress, in the EU animals slaughtered for meat are normally stunned before they are killed. But Kosher and Halal butchery requires the animals to be fully conscious when their throats are cut.

Rabbi Raphael Evers, the Rabbi of Rotterdam Federation of Jewish Orthodox Communities in the Netherlands, said: “Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

Most countries grant exceptions for Kosher and Halal abattoirs. But a coalition of animal rights and anti-Muslim groups is now demanding that Kosher and Halal slaughter methods be banned. ...

Full article ...

Personally I don't believe in religious exceptions for slaughter ... not that the UK would ever follow Holland's lead.

Castiel · 9 Apr 2011 at 05:17

According to an NSPCA report In the UK 90% of the Halal prepared meat is stunned before slaughter anyway. As numerous threads on this topic have already said.

Werewolf · 9 Apr 2011 at 05:27

Castiel said:
According to an NSPCA report In the UK 90% of the Halal prepared meat is stunned before slaughter anyway. As numerous threads on this topic have already said.

Which would pretty much make a ban in the UK pointless...

Halal/kosher is more than just the slaughter method (and indeed there is not necessarily much difference between halal/kosher slaughter and "normal"), but also about things like making sure it's handled in a certain way after slaughter.

It's one of the reasons a lot of food is "halal" or "Kosher" even if it's not aimed specifically at the religious market.
Same sort of thing with stuff having the "vegetarian" or "gluten free" logo's, if the process for dealing with the food is already in line with the requirements, then it's more about marketing and trying to ensure that people don't put off buying your product because they are unsure, and a lot of the time all that is needed for that is a logo...

lttlejoe · 9 Apr 2011 at 08:38

“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

leicrao1 · 9 Apr 2011 at 08:46

lttlejoe said:
“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

+1

Orcish-Horde · 9 Apr 2011 at 08:54

lttlejoe said:
“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

+1

james.miller · 9 Apr 2011 at 08:54

lttlejoe said:
“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

leicrao1 said:
+1

Orcish-Horde said:
+1

why?

RDM · 9 Apr 2011 at 08:57

I would say it depends on how the ban is worded. If it is a ban on religious slaughter then I would see that as an issue. However if it is just a requirement for animals to be stunned before slaughter then I don't see an issue. The existence of halal meat where the animal is stunned would suggest that it is not an issue.

Castiel · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:00

lttlejoe said:
“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

So its the ritual you have issue with, not the animals welfare?

As for primitive beliefs, that is only your intolerant opinion, nothing more.

james.miller · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:03

fda-approved slaughter houses all stun the animal before slaughter anyway, halal included. i dont know if Holland has similar practices but i know Australia does, for example. stunning the animal first is just about the most humane way to slaughter an animal anyway, so who cares what religious rituals are performed after that? not me.

In fact, if you actually read up on Dhabīḥah, the welfare of the animal just about the first priority - you cant sharpen the knife in front of the animal, you cant let other animals see the slaughter, you should give the animal a drink first ect ect. so much for a barbaric practice!

lttlejoe · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:15

Castiel said:
So its the ritual you have issue with, not the animals welfare?

As for primitive beliefs, that is only your intolerant opinion, nothing more.

I see no rational reason for the existance of religions as we can all live quite well alongside our fellow man without the need of them, nor do I see why followers of such primitive views or practices should be given any consideration or extended protection ( other than from physical abuse) in today's society.

As for the slaughter of animals, as a meat eater I accept that this is part of it and it's all brutal but, I see no justifiable reason to make it ritualistic or more stressful for the animal and if that makes me intollerent in the eyes of people such as yourself, then fine!

Vonhelmet · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:15

Are they also going to ban the importation of halal and kosher meat?

Castiel · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:27

lttlejoe said:
I see no rational reason for the existance of religions as we can all live quite well alongside our fellow man without the need of them, nor do I see why followers of such primitive views or practices should be given any consideration or extended protection ( other than from physical abuse) in today's society.

As for the slaughter of animals, as a meat eater I accept that this is part of it and it's all brutal but, I see no justifiable reason to make it ritualistic or more stressful for the animal and if that makes me intollerent in the eyes of people such as yourself, then fine!

It doesnt make you intolerant, only ignorant. You are putting you own ill informed bias onto a group of people.

If you look at Halal lifestock practices in their totality, not just slaughter they are on the whole infinitely more humane and give a better quality of life to the animal.

Also you dont know enough about religions as is evident from other threads on belief to make an informed decision as to the primitive nature of beliefs within any given religion.

cm1179 · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:27

i thought you were on about people!

Orcish-Horde · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:38

james.miller said:
fda-approved slaughter houses all stun the animal before slaughter anyway, halal included. i dont know if Holland has similar practices but i know Australia does, for example. stunning the animal first is just about the most humane way to slaughter an animal anyway, so who cares what religious rituals are performed after that? not me.

The religious ritual is the cutting of the throut without stunning, which is what they are banning.

lttlejoe · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:41

Castiel said:
It doesnt make you intolerant, only ignorant. You are putting you own ill informed bias onto a group of people.

.

And followers of religions are NOT ignorant, ill-informed, biased or intollerent ??? Get real!

All followers of mainstream religion see those who don't subscribe to their irrational and unproven primitive beliefs as beneath themselves and less worthy in the eyes of their gods - is that not ignorant, biased or intollerent?

Give one sound reason why we as a nation could not live without religion?

~~#M-Bizzle#~~ · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:42

Cool, at least the Dutch have the balls to do this.

We havent even got the spine to ban the burka.

Well done Holland... Much respect.

Cleeecooo · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:45

lttlejoe said:
“Our Jewish community feels very shocked. We have been here in the Netherlands for four hundred years and we see this new law against ritual slaughter as an infringement of our constitutional religious rights.”

As an avid meat eater I feel like a bit of a hipoctite by criticising how others slaughter their animals but, when it becomes a religious ritual, it's time for the practice to go ...preferably with the religion closely following!

How anyone in the 21st century can actually still believe in such primitive beliefs is beyond comprehension. That is one law I'd like to see implemented throughout the Common Market at the very least!

+1

badcompany · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:48

I would support a ban

Vonhelmet · 9 Apr 2011 at 09:48

lttlejoe said:
And followers of religions are NOT ignorant, ill-informed, biased or intollerent ??? Get real!

All followers of mainstream religion see those who don't subscribe to their irrational and unproven primitive beliefs as beneath themselves and less worthy in the eyes of their gods - is that not ignorant, biased or intollerent?

Give one sound reason why we as a nation could not live without religion?

How about you give one sound reason why we should ban it? Besides, all your criticisms of (a subset of) religious people apply to anyone with hardline indoctrinated beliefs. Football fans have insane indoctrinated beliefs about how their team is the best, in spite of massive evidence to the contrary. Football fans regard fans of other teams and people who don't follow football as inferior. Football fans have been known to kill fans of other teams.