***SPOILERS*** Football 09-11 Apr 2010/2011

If Man City don't look to Hulk in replacing tevez I think they are missing a big trick.

Good shout but I'd have my doubts that he's ready to be the sole striker for a title chasing Premiership side, similar player to Tevez but still unproven to a certain extent.

If Tevez goes they'd need more than just Hulk IMO, problem is there's not many outstanding strikers who are available that's why I feel City missed a trick not going for Torres.
 
I'd say that's extremely harsh, it's clear to me that since he got the sack at Chelsea he's longed to come back to the Premiership ever since pretty much making it known from the start that his tenure at Inter was only ever going to be short term likewise at Real (who like it that way anyway)

Even with last season in mind Chelsea haven't been the same side since he left and when he left he was still very young in managerial terms should you lay any blame at his door for his exit

What exactly did I say that was harsh? Was he building a young side that was going to dominate for years at Chelsea? Did he sign players for Inter, looking beyond the couple of years he planned to be there? Or at Real?

2 of Mourinho's greatest strengths are picking the right clubs to join and knowing the right time to leave.

I won't deny Mourinho's succes and I'm sure Chelsea and Inter fans are greatful for what he won them but Mourinho's not the right man for every club. In everything he says and does, it's clear he only cares about himself.

If I was picking a manager to build a side over a long period, I wouldn't look at him. If you had an open cheque book and wanted instant success, he's your man.

Disagree;......

I agree that Mancini hasn't helped and that Tevez and/or Balotelli won't be there next season but they've still got the most talented squad in the league.

- Hart's an excellent keeper (only 2nd to Reina in the league imo) and Given's the best number 2 in the league too.

- Kompany's a fantastic CB, they do however need a partner for him but Toure & Lescott would make more than decent 3rd & 4th choice CB's.

- Zabaleta's 1 of the most underrated fullbacks around and dare I say it, Richards - after once being the most overrated fullbacks - has gone full circle and is vastly underrated now imo too. Boateng and Kolarov are both hugely talented and could very well be 2 of the best fullbacks in the league next season.

- De Jong has been excellent for them, as has Yaya Toure (he surprised me with how capable on the ball he is). Barry and Milner may not be all that good but they're certainly no worse than squad players at any other club.

- Silva's a fantastic player and Johnson has the potential to be a fantastic player. They are lacking strength in depth in the winger/attacking midfield area though.

- Tevez is fantastic, Balotelli's incredibly talented and while Dzeko has done **** all so far, he's clearly no mug.

There problem isn't a lack of talent in their squad. Their problem is the attitude of certain players (which is spreading through the squad) and the way in which Mancini is utilising them.

They have no shape or balance to their side, so much so that it's difficult to explain how they line-up. They don't play a natural 4-4-2, 4-3-3, 4-5-1 or 4-2-3-1. For some reason they only play with width on 1 side of the pitch; more often than not go into a game with 3 cm's (at best a Milner or Barry will play as a token gesture 'wide' player but effectively play as a CM), Johnson or Silva on 1 wing and then 2 forwards. It's a mess.

Imo, they should be lining up in a 4-2-3-1 formation with De Jong + 1 in the middle and then Tevez, Silva and Johnson playing off of Dzeko or Balotelli.
 
2 of Mourinho's greatest strengths are picking the right clubs to join and knowing the right time to leave.

I won't deny Mourinho's succes and I'm sure Chelsea and Inter fans are greatful for what he won them but Mourinho's not the right man for every club. In everything he says and does, it's clear he only cares about himself.

Ha! When I said this I was ridiculed fella. I'd not even bother trying..
 
Baz, I didn't mean he was going to go to United / Chelsea / Liverpool and spend the rest of his career there. I mean, I think they'd be the clubs he'd want to go to, he'd come in and win things. He's not a long term manager, there are better long term managers out there I agree, but I don't deny he'd do well at those clubs or at any club with money, I just don't think he'd go to City. Can't put my finger on why.

Also, agree with what you say about city's squad, we disagree on strengths and ability of players but I think their lack of shape, the ego's at the club and poor management isn't getting them anywhere.

It's a tipping point, City will imho soon lose the best they have if they don't do something, they won't do anything with Mancini in charge.
 
Couldn't agree more mate.
Mancini has a full pre season with everyone and hopefully with no injuries and stupid world cups and euro competitions he can install his formation and mentality into the players.
At the moment some are looking bad and frustrated to say the least but that can be changed and this pre season is going to be incredibly important.
I want to see this formation should Tevez leave.
-------Dzeko-----
-Johno--Silva--Balotelli
----De Jong---Yaya
Kol--Boat--Komp--Zab
-------Hart----------
That team is of course if no one joins and only Tev leaves. If rumour are true and Sanchez does join then i would switch out Balotelli unless of course he proves himself.

Looking at that team i dont know where he would fit but i would really like Milner to be a big part of the team as i think he is a quality player and has impressed me the times he has been CM.

FORZA MANCINI!!!!
 
How long has Mancini been in the job?
December 2009 so 1.5 years.

By now you would have expected a settled team with a proper structure and mentality?

It certainly has taken longer than i thought but Khaldoon and Marwood wouldn't have kept him if they weren't confident in his ability. I am all for keeping him so we can get some stability in the club for once but no top 4 this year and he has no excuses and will be sacked.
 
Baz, I didn't mean he was going to go to United / Chelsea / Liverpool and spend the rest of his career there. I mean, I think they'd be the clubs he'd want to go to, he'd come in and win things.

I know :)

I was simply pointing out why I wouldn't want him back at Liverpool and why (in our current situation) we'd never consider him either.

I know a lot of people seem to think he's destined to replace Taggart but I can't see it. Not only are there few parallels in the way Ferguson and Mourinho have gone about their careers, I can't see Mourinho wanting to work with the Glazers/Utd's financial situation or the Glazers wanting to work with Mourinho.

A return to Chelsea would be most likely but in a years time if City find themself qualified for the CL for a 2nd season running and closer to top spot, it wouldn't surprise me if Mourinho ended up there.
 
What exactly did I say that was harsh?

This to be honest

He spends huge money signing players for only the present day and when the money runs out or things aren't looking so good, he either talks himself into the sack or jumps ship.

Was he building a young side that was going to dominate for years at Chelsea?

The simple answer is yes; Drogba, Essien, A.Cole, Carvalho, Belletti (both only left last summer), Ferreira & Kalou all of these players were bought under Jose and have served Chelsea for 6/7 years, that's not a bad return

Did he sign players for Inter, looking beyond the couple of years he planned to be there? Or at Real?

At Inter he brought Sneijder when he was 25 and at Real he's bought Ozil (22) and Khadera (24) are those 3 not long term signings beyond a couple of seasons?

You're talking like at Chelsea, Inter and Real he's only ever buys players in their late twenties early thirties when that's not true at all.

As for him talking himself into the sack or jumping ship that's not true either, he was wrongly sacked at Chelsea and I think it's clear he wishes he was still there hence why he's always talking up returning to the Premiership, again at Inter he said from the start that it would be a short term appointment, it also had nothing to do with money drying up either as he was given very little to spend there likewise at Real so far they didn't spend massively last summer either.
 
I know :)

I was simply pointing out why I wouldn't want him back at Liverpool and why (in our current situation) we'd never consider him either.

I know a lot of people seem to think he's destined to replace Taggart but I can't see it. Not only are there few parallels in the way Ferguson and Mourinho have gone about their careers, I can't see Mourinho wanting to work with the Glazers/Utd's financial situation or the Glazers wanting to work with Mourinho.

A return to Chelsea would be most likely but in a years time if City find themself qualified for the CL for a 2nd season running and closer to top spot, it wouldn't surprise me if Mourinho ended up there.

In part I agree, I think he'll be replacing Fergie and he'll probably stay a fair while by his standards.

I understand why you don't want him at 'pool and why a lot of fans wouldn't want him, it's the question, is instant success worth more to fans then continued success or delayed success?

There are plenty, and I'm aiming this at Biz, plenty of young managers who are doing VERY well for themselves and would love an opportunity to be given a bigger budget, club, better off the field set up and allowed to build a squad. It's part of why I dislike big transfer fee's and owners buying success. I'm more of a, build the future and train the kids better kind of guy.

Germany is awash with talented managers, Italy is (you picked the wrong one that's all :p) and who's that dude at ?... hmm bugger I'm too tired / drunk to remember haha
 
This to be honest

The simple answer is yes; Drogba, Essien, A.Cole, Carvalho, Belletti (both only left last summer), Ferreira & Kalou all of these players were bought under Jose and have served Chelsea for 6/7 years, that's not a bad return.
You said yourself that Chelsea haven't been the same since he left. The truth is the decline (if it's the right word) began under him.

Ferreira, Kalou and Belletti are/were **** so you can discount them. I can't think of anybody else signed by him during his time at Chelsea that has subsequently been sold by his predecessors that would have proven decent longterm signings. So in 4 years, he signed 4 players that proved to be decent longterm signings. Great ;)


At Inter he brought Sneijder when he was 25 and at Real he's bought Ozil (22) and Khadera (24) are those 3 not long term signings beyond a couple of seasons?
I shouldn't have mentioned Real because other than the odd player that the manager specifically wants, the signings are out of the managers hands. 1 player Mourihno did specifically want though was Carvalho ;)

As for your question in relation to Sneijder, he most certainly will prove a great longterm signing for Inter. That wasn't his main objective though. Just like with the signings of Eto, Milito and Lucio etc, Mourinho was looking to build a squad for the present day. You only have to look at the average age of Inters squad now to see that little thought (from Mancini too) went into looking beyond the immediate future. Like Chelsea now, Inter are in a situation where the bulk of the spine of their squad are on the decline.

You're talking like at Chelsea, Inter and Real he's only ever buys players in their late twenties early thirties when that's not true at all.

No. I've said he concentrates on short term success rather than building a side that can challenge for years to come.

As for him talking himself into the sack or jumping ship that's not true either, he was wrongly sacked at Chelsea and I think it's clear he wishes he was still there hence why he's always talking up returning to the Premiership, again at Inter he said from the start that it would be a short term appointment, it also had nothing to do with money drying up either as he was given very little to spend there likewise at Real so far they didn't spend massively last summer either.

Of course it's true. He left Porto when the only way was down (can't blame him in that case). After early success at Chelsea, the money dried up and the success which resulted in him falling out with RA and ended with him as good as daring RA to sack him during a press conference - he was soon sacked. And then at Inter he put together a great side over the short term, won the CL and then left Inter with no money and a squad that needs a lot of work.

And as for not spending a lot at Inter :o Granted a lot came from Barca's crazy signing of Ibrahimovic but he spent huge money on Pandev (he wasn't free - reportedly got £10m+ signing on fee), Lucio, Milito, Muntari, Sneijder etc.

Your whole argument seems to be based around 'Oh, he didn't want to leave Chelsea and shouldn't have been sacked' and is pretty cringeworthy.

The answer to 1 question in an interview summed Mourinho up perfectly for me. After winning the league for a 2nd time for Chelsea he was asked about how big an achievement it was or Chelsea to retain the title, he answered by saying how big an achivement it was for him to win x amount of titles in a row (including 1's at Porto).
 
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Ferreira, Kalou and Belletti are/were **** so you can discount them. I can't think of anybody else signed by him during his time at Chelsea that has subsequently been sold by his predecessors that would have proven decent longterm signings. So in 4 years, he signed 4 players that proved to be decent longterm signings. Great ;)

Kalou has scored countless amounts of important goals for Chelsea, Belletti was a very good squad player, Ballack who I didn't mention likewise. Maybe if Chelsea still had some of those squad players they wouldn't of struggled like they did in the middle part of this season.

As for your opinion that only 4 turned out to be good long term players we are talking Drogba, Essien & A.Cole that's not a bad 3 for just over 3 seasons in charge.

As for your question in relation to Sneijder, he most certainly will prove a great longterm signing for Inter. That wasn't his main objective though. Just like with the signings of Eto, Milito and Lucio etc, Mourinho was looking to build a squad for the present day. You only have to look at the average age of Inters squad now to see that little thought (from Mancini too) went into looking beyond the immediate future.

Well if he knew he was only going to be there short term to continue the success they had under Mancini he was never going to go and buy 7 or 8 young players was he?

Of course it's true. He left Porto when the only way was down (can't blame him in that case). After early success at Chelsea, the money dried up and the success which resulted in him falling out with RA and ended with him as good as daring RA to sack him during a press conference - he was soon sacked. And then at Inter he put together a great side over the short term, won the CL and then left Inter with no money and a squad that needs a lot of work.

And as for not spending a lot at Inter :o Granted a lot came from Barca's crazy signing of Ibrahimovic but he spent huge money on Pandev (he wasn't free - reportedly got £10m+ signing on fee), Lucio, Milito, Muntari, Sneijder etc.

Your whole argument seems to be based around 'Oh, he didn't want to leave Chelsea and shouldn't have been sacked' and is pretty cringeworthy.

You cant blame him for leaving Porto, the chance to go and manage at one of the biggest leagues in the world of course he was going to leave. Porto have continued to have success since he left albeit mainly because of the lack of strength of that league.

Regarding Chelsea you can feel cringeworthy all you like but in 3 seasons with him they were much better than since he's left, you claim that proves your point about him being a short term manager when it clearly doesn't, how many managers in the world can build a club that will be best served for the next 10 years in just 3 years in charge? Especially when it was clear that he was assigned for instant success under the instruction of RA.

You said yourself Mancini did little to build a young team at Inter as well and when you look at the ages of the AC Milan players as well that just seems to be a trait of Italian football, quick turn over of managers at all clubs only ever looking at the now as they're not given the time to think long term.

As for now with Real Madrid, like Inter everyone knows that it's a stop gap job, Jose wants it like that was so he can come back to the Premiership and unless you win the league title and champions league Real Madrid do business that way as well. It's actually a testament to Mourinho that he may well be the first manager since I dont know when that will still be in charge of Madrid for two seasons in a row even if they dont win anything this year.

TBH I just think for your argument to hold up he'd of A- had to have had more than just 3 previous clubs to his name and B- given longer than just 3 years at one club.
 
We're just going to end up going around in circles. You've got nothing to back up anything you're saying because he's never stayed at a club for much more than 3 years. Everything you're saying is based around this opinion that he never wanted to leave Chelsea and he won't stay for a long period else where because he wants to return to England, ignoring the fact that even before coming to England, he'd managed 3 clubs in 4 years back in Portugal.

Your 'why should he' question regarding Inter proves my point about Mourinho. He only forcused on what was best for Inter while he was manager there, not what was best for Inter as a club in the longterm.
 
:confused:

Why bye bye Liverpool? There are lots of young talented managers that could do fantastically well and build a squad with a big club like Liverpool.
 
:confused:

Why bye bye Liverpool? There are lots of young talented managers that could do fantastically well and build a squad with a big club like Liverpool.
I just think that sacking Kenny would ruin the team once again. With Kenny i reckon they can push on next year and reclaim a top 4 place.
 
... Kenny's not the long term plan. I don't expect you to understand the concept of building for the future as a City fan, but that's what Liverpool need to do :)

Bring in, a young talented manager give him some time and money to build a great squad, Kenny has done very well with the team this season but imho, he's ready to hand it over. Also, my understanding is that he's just there as a motivator and that Steve Clarke does a lot of the work :)
 
I'd be interested to see what Boas can do, I'm happy with Dalglish staying on, I'm just as happy if he doesnt and another top manager is brought in instead. However, this article is bunkum imo, cant help but think that if this was true every sports site going would be tripping over themselves to say it, the fact that its barely talked about anywhere makes me think its just nonsense.
 
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