Stereoscopic 3D and my 6870

[gwobbles]

So in an earlier post ive said I will be getting a summer job, so with that money I have constructed a wish list and one of those things is a new monitor, I pretty much made my mind up with which monitor to get but then I saw an article on 3D gaming which has sparked a question in me...

So I now have HD 6870 cf setup, and I am interested in 1080p 3D gaming, what do I need for that? And what Is AMD HD3D? and one last thing is, what monitor and cable would I need?

Thanks in advanced and sorry if it's in the wrong section coz I had a hard time deciding where this should go lol

 

[cmndr_andi]

Hi there,

Unfortunately at the moment AMD's approach to 3D is nowhere near as good as Nvidia's for consumers - what they have done is gone for a more open approach where they let third party companies sort out the 3D drivers and hardware, compared to nvidia where everything is in-house and proprietary. This may sound bad for nvidia - but it means that the complex systems all work together well and the drivers are updated and tested regularly - also the choice of 3D monitors is rather broad. For AMD 3D monitors you have a very small selection or chose a 3D TV (which are still very expensive and HDMI 1.4 only supports 3D at 1080P@24Hz or 720p@60Hz).


Therefore, if you definitely want to do 3D gaming then I would sell your 6870s and buy a high end Nvidia card (like this GTX 480), this nvidia 3D kit and this monitor.

 

[Final8y]

Hi there,

Unfortunately at the moment AMD's approach to 3D is nowhere near as good as Nvidia's for consumers - what they have done is gone for a more open approach where they let third party companies sort out the 3D drivers and hardware, compared to nvidia where everything is in-house and proprietary. This may sound bad for nvidia - but it means that the complex systems all work together well and the drivers are updated and tested regularly - also the choice of 3D monitors is rather broad. For AMD 3D monitors you have a very small selection or chose a 3D TV (which are still very expensive and HDMI 1.4 only supports 3D at 1080P@24Hz or 720p@60Hz).


Therefore, if you definitely want to do 3D gaming then I would sell your 6870s and buy a high end Nvidia card (like this GTX 480), this nvidia 3D kit and this monitor.

My comment below is incorrect, how i can to that assumption can be read here. http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=19057968&postcount=25

AMD can use the same monitors as NV, the 3D ready monitors are not NV proprietary & there are better quality glasses available than what's on the NV proprietary system.
But over all the NV system will be the least hassle at this time.

 

[coupe69]

AMD can use the same monitors as NV & there are better quality glasses available than what's on the NV proprietary system.

Are they? Why's that? I have no issues with the quality of my Nvidia 3D glasses

The fact of the matter is Nvidias implementation of 3D is streets ahead of AMDs rather lacklustre effort.

As for using the same monitors as Nvidia, I think AMD need to update their website if true.

According to AMDs HD3D supported hardware page found here, there's a grand total of 3 monitors that are compatible? whereas any 120Hz monitor will do with NVs 3D vision.

 

[cmndr_andi]

AMD can use the same monitors as NV, the 3D ready monitors are not NV proprietary & there are better quality glasses available than what's on the NV proprietary system.
But over all the NV system will be the least hassle at this time.

Thanks for the correction, they must have updated it since I last looked. So you can use a standard 120Hz monitor like that LG I linked to?

This page makes it seem that not many monitors work with the AMD 3D tech.

 

[Final8y]

Thanks for the correction, they must have updated it since I last looked. So you can use a standard 120Hz monitor like that LG I linked to?

This page makes it seem that not many monitors work with the AMD 3D tech.

That is certified by AMD, that does not mean that only those on the list will work.

 

[cmndr_andi]

That is certified by AMD, that does not mean that only those on the list will work.

Thats fair enough I suppose - motherboard makes don't list all the memory modules that work with their boards.

That said, do you have a list of the 120Hz screens that have been confirmed to work with the AMD 3D tech?

Also what shutter glasses & syncing hardware should you use with the AMD kit or do you need to get a monitor with the syncing built in?

 

[Final8y]

Are they? Why's that? I have no issues with the quality of my Nvidia 3D glasses

The fact of the matter is Nvidias implementation of 3D is streets ahead of AMDs rather lacklustre effort.

As for using the same monitors as Nvidia, I think AMD need to update their website if true.

According to AMDs HD3D supported hardware page found here, there's a grand total of 3 monitors that are compatible? whereas any 120Hz monitor will do with NVs 3D vision.

Read my edit:

And just because there are better quality glasses than NVs that does not mean that i said that the NV glasses are bad quality.
Don't get in to the habit of making out that i said 2 things when i said one.

 

[Final8y]

Thats fair enough I suppose - motherboard makes don't list all the memory modules that work with their boards.

1)That said, do you have a list of the 120Hz screens that have been confirmed to work with the AMD 3D tech?

2)Also what shutter glasses & syncing hardware should you use with the AMD kit or do you need to get a monitor with the syncing built in?

1)Why would i have a list.

2)I don't use 3D, i was remembering a users comment on XS who had both techs but prefers that fact that he could use a wider range of glasses with the AMD system & he said that there are better glasses that he uses.

 

[cmndr_andi]

1)Why would i have a list.

2)I don't use 3D, i was remembering a users comment on XS who had both techs but prefers that fact that he could use a wider range of glasses with the AMD system & he said that there are better glasses that he uses.

I don't know, you just seemed confident that a standard 120Hz monitor would work fine - obviously if you the OP is going to put money down he would want to be confident that it would work.

As for the glasses users commenting about better glasses, could they have been talking about the AMD 3D system making full use of 3D TVs using the HDMI 1.4 connection? Since there are a wide range of TV 3D active shutter glasses then it makes sense that some of them will be better than the Nvidia ones (I hear the 3D effect is often done much better on 3D TVs compared to 120Hz monitors - but there is usually a big cost difference).

Also, until recently AMD was the only tech that worked on these 3D TVs (which make use of the better glasses) but now with Nvidia 3DTV Play both camps can.

Could this be the explanation or are you sure that standard 120Hz monitors with no in-built glasses synchronisation (like this one) work with the AMD 3D technology?

 

[Final8y]

I don't know, you just seemed confident that a standard 120Hz monitor would work fine - obviously if you the OP is going to put money down he would want to be confident that it would work.

As for the glasses users commenting about better glasses, could they have been talking about the AMD 3D system making full use of 3D TVs using the HDMI 1.4 connection? Since there are a wide range of TV 3D active shutter glasses then it makes sense that some of them will be better than the Nvidia ones (I hear the 3D effect is often done much better on 3D TVs compared to 120Hz monitors - but there is usually a big cost difference).

Also, until recently AMD was the only tech that worked on these 3D TVs (which make use of the better glasses) but now with Nvidia 3DTV Play both camps can.

Could this be the explanation or are you sure that standard 120Hz monitors with no in-built glasses synchronisation (like this one) work with the AMD 3D technology?

The user was on http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/index.php? it was not about 3D TVs.

Also On AMD its down to the Each manufactures glasses & what type of monitor they support.

A little more than a month ago LG has announced that they are ready with 23-inch 120Hz LCD panels and during CES the company was already showing the first display to use these panels. LG W2363D will be the first 23″ 120 Hz 3D-capable monitor under the company’s brand, but I’m expecting a lot more display using the same panel to come out later this year. The LG W2363D display has to be out in the market in the second quarter this year, just before summer, but unfortunately there is no word about the expected price yet. In the mean time Alienware revealed their OptX AW2310 23″ 3D Full HD display and it seems that the company already started taking orders for it at a price of $499 in USA. It appears that Alienware’s specs are similar to the ones announced from LG, but there is still nothing confirmed about what panel is being used by OptX AW2310, although it will probably become clear pretty soon as the first reviews of the new Alienware display will probably be available pretty soon…

This is one of the email that I received from XpanD. Hope that answer your question, I mean you have the product series and then you can take a look on its features.

By the way, there are solutions (monitors and drivers) based on ATI. The only reason why I ahve not bought any one of those is becasue of the compatibility with XpanD. Now, about ghosting, the problem has to do more with the monitor and it’s ability to fully close the pixel and the time the glasses are shutting, so I hope on this second generation of 3d monitor some one can improve that.

Email from XpanD:
HI, Alex,

Thanks for your interest in Xpand.

Rorey already answered you about the release date. I would like to add that you will be able to buy the glasses at best Buy, Fry;s, Brandsmart, Sears others, and Target and Walmart by the end of the year.

The glasses will work with ATI cards, we have a very good working relationships with AMD, and they will have a wide support of 3D applications. However our glasses will not work with Alienware and Acer 120Hz monitors. Those monitors, as well as early Samsung and Viewsonic do not use strobing LED backlight. However there will be 120Hz models coming to the market pretty soon, that use LED backlit. Companies like HP, CMO, Viewsonic, LG and others are planning to offer such monitors.

I hope I answered your questions. If you have any other questions, please let me know.

Best Regards,

David Chechelashvili, XpanD Cinema

Head of Gaming Division

http://3dvision-blog.com/lg-w2363d-is-yet-anoter-23-120-hz-3d-capable-monitor/

The OP would have to make sure the glasses he chooses is compatible with AMD & the monitor.

 

[cmndr_andi]

Thanks for that info - however the guy you quoted didn't confirm any specific monitors that work with the technology - just that there would be some in the future.

Also, when I googled for some more information this was one of the first things that came up (also form 3dvision-blog).

There do seem to be a few 120Hz monitors that work fine with the AMD 3D system, but these are just the ones listed on the AMD site and have their own specific shutter glasses which they are sold with.

 

[coupe69]

So is AMDs website out of date? I'm confused now as to what monitors and glasses work properly with AMD.

And I think therein lies the problem, too much confusion about exactly what kit you need to get AMD HD3D working properly.

At least with Nvidias solution everybody knows exactly what you need, a set of 3D vision glasses coupled with a NV card and any 120Hz monitor.

 

[Final8y]

Thanks for that info - however the guy you quoted didn't confirm any specific monitors that work with the technology - just that there would be some in the future.

Also, when I googled for some more information this was one of the first things that came up (also form 3dvision-blog).

There do seem to be a few 120Hz monitors that work fine with the AMD 3D system, but these are just the ones listed on the AMD site and have their own specific shutter glasses which they are sold with.

The quote was not to confirm many specific monitor, it was to confirm that its down to the glasses.

 

[Final8y]

So is AMDs website out of date? I'm confused now as to what monitors and glasses work properly with AMD.

And I think therein lies the problem, too much confusion about exactly what kit you need to get AMD HD3D working properly.

At least with Nvidias solution everybody knows exactly what you need, a set of 3D vision glasses coupled with a NV card and any 120Hz monitor.

And i already said that NVs 3D is less hassle,.

 

[coupe69]

And i already said that NVs 3D is less hassle,.

Alright mate calm down, you seem to take a very defensive stance with my posts. I'm only asking some questions, I'm not having a dig at you

 

[Final8y]

Alright mate calm down, you seem to take a very defensive stance with my posts. I'm only asking some questions, I'm not having a dig at you

I get defensive when your telling me what i have already said & as if i refuted it in the first place when i did not.
The only error is that there is not a universal 3D glasses available for ATI ATM.

 

[cmndr_andi]

The quote was not to confirm many specific monitor, it was to confirm that its down to the glasses.

Well he mentions strobing LED backlight - which is a technology to reduce ghosting. So it is fair enough that they will wait for that monitor/TV technology so they get good results with 3D, since the technology is very response time dependent.

However it doesn't answer the question: how are the glasses synchronised with the graphics card (and thus the monitor)? As far as I can tell you can't buy stand-alone boxes to synchronise these glasses (connecting to the TV or monitor and sending an IR signal at the correct time to sync the shutters) and AMD doesn't seem to support this tech - they leave it up to the middleware companies (with the drivers for the AMD certified TVs with included glasses and syncing) or the 3DTVs.

As far as I can tell - those Xpand glasses only work with 3DTVs, 3D projectors and laptop screens with shutter glasses syncing built in, though please correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[Final8y]

Well he mentions strobing LED backlight - which is a technology to reduce ghosting. So it is fair enough that they will wait for that monitor/TV technology so they get good results with 3D, since the technology is very response time dependent.

However it doesn't answer the question: how are the glasses synchronised with the graphics card (and thus the monitor)? As far as I can tell you can't buy stand-alone boxes to synchronise these glasses (connecting to the TV or monitor and sending an IR signal at the correct time to sync the shutters) and AMD doesn't seem to support this tech - they leave it up to the middleware companies (with the drivers for the AMD certified TVs with included glasses and syncing) or the 3DTVs.

As far as I can tell - those Xpand glasses only work with 3DTVs, 3D projectors and laptop screens with shutter glasses syncing built in, though please correct me if i'm wrong.

I have already said that there is no universal solution for AMD, its down to the middleware companies.

I did not quote Xpand as a universal i quoted it as a that type of 3D tech.

Hence

The OP would have to make sure the glasses he chooses is compatible with AMD & the monitor.

 

[cmndr_andi]

I have already said that there is no universal solution for AMD, its down to the middleware companies.

Aye, exactly.

My point was that at the moment there doesn't seem to be any way of using an AMD card to run stereoscopic 3D content using one of the "dumb" non-synchronising 120Hz monitors (like all the ones listed here).