Manual v Auto
- Thread starter Nazbit
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![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
That cold gearbox issue is resolvable though you just need to get it sorted by someone who is up to the job, a reflash and a gearbox flush sorted the last one i had with that problem.
But again this only applies to when you're giving it ten tenths on a good bit of tarmac, something that most people would insist that they need a manual for 'complete control' will never, ever do.
Why would you need 'complete control' when you're doing 50MPH on a ring road. Or are stuck in bumper to bumper rush hour traffic? Or are pottering around town at 20MPH? In what real world situation that most of the driving population are going to find themselves in when having a manual gearbox becomes noticeably more beneficial than having an auto? Even the overtaking one mentioned earlier isn't very good because every single auto I've ever come across is willing to drop down a cog or two when you press the pedal with the force that is required for an overtake.
I know what he means Josh, it is satisfying when you snick home a perfect gear change.
My 2 bones of contention on this though are one i was never any good at those superb perfect gear changes and 2 if you drive in London whats the point, its just one big drag made a bit better by not changing gear.
[TW]Fox;19400061 said:Not another car full of issues Moeks!? You don't have a lot of luck with cars do you
No I don't. Full of issues isn't quite true though, just gearbox issues and a wonky front parking sensor (I don't even consider the later an issue though
...the car is knocking on 8 years old)
Man of Honour
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Need is a strong word, for the vast majority of people it's simply a preference to have a manual or an auto. I'm sure a number of people buy products that are a bit over-specified for the use they'll put it to 99% of the time but for that 1% when they do use it to its full potential then maybe it's all worthwhile.
You don't have to accept the argument about overtaking, it was just raised as a possibility - whether there is an actual delay in response is almost irrelevant to the prejudice that someone may have towards them. For me I'm happy to acknowledge that my choice in this area is somewhat irrational so providing proof of this doesn't change much.
Either way it seems as if you're arguing as if there's a right answer here when it's down to personal preference and possibly if you're answering the original posters question what you might do in his situation.
You dont need 'complete control' in those situations but as you cannot get a car with a stick shift and an autobox (No, DSG doesnt count) you can't have that control when you want it and not have it at all other times as well.
Some people just prefer shifting with a manual box - thats all there is too it. I prefer it too - even when I'm just swapping cogs on the way home from work. I just... like it. So therefore I'll buy cars with a manual box.
I like autoboxes as well - I just like manuals more. Almost none of my driving is in heavy traffic therefore there is no real penalty involved in me getting a manual box. I'm either doing a quick trip to work - takes 10 minutes - or I'm on one of the South West's reasonably uncongested Motorways where I slip the car into top gear after pulling onto the Motorway, engage the cruise, and turn it off 150 miles later having not touched the box at all.
What situation does the average motorist NEED an automatic?
Never. Nobody NEEDS one or the other, it's entirely down to preference.
Some people really do enjoy the interaction and feel of changing gear themselves, so they drive a manual at all costs. Some people have no interest, they just want to plant their right foot and go, so they drive an auto. Some people like the 'control' over gears sometimes but not all the time and so they drive things like tiptronics or DSGs. Some people like to stick with what they know, so they stick with manuals. etc. etc.
It's all down to what people prefer and what gives them the best feeling of enjoyment and comfort within their own car.
Man of Honour
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Ok, most average motorists don't need a manual. Does that admission make any difference to their preference?
Of course not, but at the end of the day people will be admitting that they want a manual for having a manual's sake rather than to try and imply that there is something fundamentally wrong with an automatic for their type of driving.
As ever with me, its about the principal
I love how people have taken me saying "changing gears is an enjoyable part of driving" to be "I like changing gears". See the difference?
There is nothing particularly fun about changing a gear in itself. I never said there was. It's only as part of driving that it becomes enjoyable. Chances are I would never have considered it enjoyable without having driven automatics and made the connection with my lack of enjoyment and the gear changing element.
There is nothing particularly fun about changing a gear in itself. I never said there was. It's only as part of driving that it becomes enjoyable. Chances are I would never have considered it enjoyable without having driven automatics and made the connection with my lack of enjoyment and the gear changing element.
I find because a manual is more engaging I actually concentrate more especially when tired. But I'm in my 30s now and I have an automatic as I'm not out driving all night with mates and my car is more a tool rather than a toy now.
The average motorist doesnt buy a manual car because they want to feel involved with driving.
The average motorist buys a car with a manual gearbox because they perceive, rightly or wrongly, that cars have manual gearboxes and you only buy an auto if you have special requirements or are buying a luxury car. Your average Focus buyer will beleive a manual to be more reliable, more economical and simply the default choice. For new buyers, an autobox also adds £1000-£2000 to the price depending on the model. For a lot of people, thats just something they are not prepared to pay extra for.
We can argue all day about how true these perceptions are but they wont change the fact these are peoples perceptions and people buy cars based on perceived fact not real fact.
Thats why only 10% of hatchbacks have an autobox.
One of the very few times you'll catch me agreeing whole heartedly with Fox. Exactly what I was trying to get across. For most people it is silly perceptions that keep people away from autos and nothing else, certainly not this need for 'Total control' that many like to bang on about.
Not forgetting of course that the majority of people aren't going to have tried a decent auto with a big lumpy engine to power it, their experiences will be of the juddery POS found in a 1.4 Corsa auto or something.
When people believe they have a choice of that or a manual, they'll always turn to a manual.
When people believe they have a choice of that or a manual, they'll always turn to a manual.
Those 'banging on' about total control are expressing preference. For car enthusiasts 'total control' might be why they prefer an autobox, rather than perceived notions of cost.
Soldato
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The only automatic I ever drove was a Mercedes Elegance E Class, with a 2.2 litre engine. I did enjoy the feel of this, but since I only took it for a short journey I don't think I was able to fully appreciate the gearbox.
When I was first learning to drive (and struggling) it was suggested I go to automatic, helpful or otherwise, I went to a different driving school, worked hard and got a full manual drivers license.
I like that I can exercise the option to go to a manual or automatic.
Would I consider an automatic? I probably would for the daily commute - I use the M25 and M1 frequently and as I am looking at changing jobs, the daily commute could get longer and the traffic jams are only going to get worse as time goes on and more people learn to drive.
Kind regards
When I was first learning to drive (and struggling) it was suggested I go to automatic, helpful or otherwise, I went to a different driving school, worked hard and got a full manual drivers license.
I like that I can exercise the option to go to a manual or automatic.
Would I consider an automatic? I probably would for the daily commute - I use the M25 and M1 frequently and as I am looking at changing jobs, the daily commute could get longer and the traffic jams are only going to get worse as time goes on and more people learn to drive.
Kind regards