Cameron doesn't care about the UK manufacturing industry

[drunkenmaster]

So a company loses out a 3bn contract after recently failing to get a 7.5bn contract also, and you blame the government, when two massive contracts have had to go overseas to get something done on time for a proper price, which is also generating new jobs in the UK at the same time.

Think of it this way, the UK company can't do whats required, they can't hit targets, or do it for anywhere near the right price, so you just don't do it. The 1500 jobs being created to maintain the trains and build parts for the trains here don't happen.

Or we spend 3billion abroad which also creates 1500 jobs here and long term , english jobs. So a CANADIAN train company thats not competitive should randomly get all the train contracts just because they are here?

How much are we losing in tax by paying another company in Germany, lets say its, 20-30% of that 3bn, what if the trains from the UK company could only be done for 5billion....... how has that saved anyone in the uk, we've generated a little extra tax, for a Canadian based company, by spending vastly more than the tax we'll get back from the workers building the trains in the UK.

If a company can't be competitive or do the job, which seems likely as its missed to major contracts which, for the love of god, should not cost more than shipping in trains from abroad basically, it shouldn't be propped up for the sake of it, thats one of the reasons the UK has gone downhill.

WE need to encourage the best and most competitive manufacturing here, not prop up the worst ones.

 

[Slam62]

So a company loses out a 3bn contract after recently failing to get a 7.5bn contract also, and you blame the government, when two massive contracts have had to go overseas to get something done on time for a proper price, which is also generating new jobs in the UK at the same time.

Think of it this way, the UK company can't do whats required, they can't hit targets, or do it for anywhere near the right price, so you just don't do it. The 1500 jobs being created to maintain the trains and build parts for the trains here don't happen.

Or we spend 3billion abroad which also creates 1500 jobs here and long term , english jobs. So a CANADIAN train company thats not competitive should randomly get all the train contracts just because they are here?

How much are we losing in tax by paying another company in Germany, lets say its, 20-30% of that 3bn, what if the trains from the UK company could only be done for 5billion....... how has that saved anyone in the uk, we've generated a little extra tax, for a Canadian based company, by spending vastly more than the tax we'll get back from the workers building the trains in the UK.

If a company can't be competitive or do the job, which seems likely as its missed to major contracts which, for the love of god, should not cost more than shipping in trains from abroad basically, it shouldn't be propped up for the sake of it, thats one of the reasons the UK has gone downhill.

WE need to encourage the best and most competitive manufacturing here, not prop up the worst ones.

soon we won't have any industry at all

but plenty of room on those nice new trains, vorsprung durch choo choo

 

[*Moangroan*]

Lol more and more the penny drops that political parties do not have peoples interests at heart.

The story is always the same and news stories always the same. Oh we are deeply sorry for blah de blah and will do everything in our power to make it better I mean worse.

Plenty of soundbites and talk to keep you busy/happy.

Funny though over the last ten years it would even be possible to side with the conspiracy theorists and say this country and America are deliberately being driven into the ground...lol

 

[uvarvu]

Maybe the Government took the track record of the Siemes Desiros into account when getting the contracts lined up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siemens_Desiro

They had a few teething problems in the beginning but those issues were ironed out, they won the Golden Spanner awards last year

 

[Meridian]

Think of it this way, the UK company can't do whats required, they can't hit targets, or do it for anywhere near the right price, so you just don't do it.

Unless it's defence work, in which case BAe will still get the contract, despite decades of evidence that you really should not leave them to organise your brewery drinking session.


m

 

[Amp34]

soon we won't have any industry at all

but plenty of room on those nice new trains, vorsprung durch choo choo

Guess someone doesn't (want to) read anything...

Worst case scenario we lose al our heavy industry...

Not too important giving this is happening in a large number of other developed nations as well and we have a rise of high tech manufacturing.

Lets forget about that and just moan that we need more steel works, coal mines and rail manufacturers...

Either way, unfortunately this thread has broken the record again and we're just repeating what is said time and time again by the same people...

 

[Orcish-Horde]

If Bombardier had put together the best bid, it would have won.

Why should we accept less than the best bid?

That is subjective to what is best.

Best up front price?
Best longterm price?
Best for national development?*
Best backhander?
Best train?
Best price???

* Thats the unseen thing that is over looked, but its Canadian own its nothing to do with us... Nevermind the 10,000 people that are employed and invested in by said company that live within the UK. At some point in the not to distant future our manufacting base will be gone, it will be cheaper and faster to import and it will be better quality, but it will not be better for us. There is not that many jobs at Tesco, Asda or the City. The government can't fund the public sector without tax income for over seas, at some point the books will not balance and the IMF will come a knocking. If it still exists.

 

[Biohazard]

at some point the books will not balance

£8,000,000,000,000 worth of debt by 2015 approx. It could vary.

The books already don't balance, they are worsening as each day passes.

 

[Biohazard]

BBC presenter Evan Davis is chased across the rooftops of BBC Television Centre in a sequence to set up the BBC programme Made in Britain.

In the first of three-part series on how Britain pays its way in the world, Evan Davis busts the myths that we were wrong to let so much of our manufacturing go abroad, and that we have become a nation of shopkeepers, bankers and estate agents.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/13823201

Cool freerunning too

Would be interesting to see his point of view.

 

[chameleon]

I think the railway sums up the death of manufacturing in this country. We inventor the railways and had lots of huge works churning put trains.

Now, Swindon-closed, Darlington-long closed, Shildon-closed, York-closed-reopened, barely.
Doncaster, St Rollox(Glasgow), Crewe, Eastleigh all reduced to Glorified maintainence works.
The country that gave the world it's railways can barely even build a train now.

 

[Amp34]

No, we build missiles, satellites and high tech computer components instead...

Personally I much prefer going down t'up mine...

 

[Orcish-Horde]

£8,000,000,000,000 worth of debt by 2015 approx. It could vary.

The books already don't balance, they are worsening as each day passes.

That will become clear when the house of cards comes down and the big bluff is no more. But Right Said Dave will be ok.

 

[PermaBanned]

No, we build missiles, satellites and high tech computer components instead...

Personally I much prefer going down t'up mine...

Missiles? Really? That's a plus point?

There's only ever been one British launched satellite, Prospero. And that isn't even doing anything any more since we turned off our monitoring stations.

 

[Tefal]

Missiles? Really? That's a plus point?

There's only ever been one British launched satellite, Prospero. And that isn't even doing anything any more since we turned off our monitoring stations.

we build a lot of satellites we just don't launch them from Britain.

there are numerous commercial launchers around the world we use.

Missiles? Really? That's a plus point?

They do make a nice bit of money.

 

[scorza]

They do make a nice bit of money.

For now, presumably Cameron and Osborne would prefer to see those get made abroad too.

 

[bloodiedathame]

How do you that a German company isn't buying the Bombadier trains?

 

[Tefal]

For now, presumably Cameron and Osborne would prefer to see those get made abroad too.

Well a lot are made by EADS so technically parts of them are.

 

[Fusion]

I've not looked into this in great depth but it would be interesting to compare Bombardier's offer with that of the German's. I agree that it's important that value must be delivered to the taxpayer but if there was only a small amount in it then I'd have given it to Bombardier.

The question is though, why couldn't they match the German offer? As has been said, if they were good enough then there wouldn't be this issue. However, you can't imagine France making a decision like this. They would surely want to keep production within their own borders.

Britain does still make things. I work for a very successful manufacturing firm who are enjoying the best results they have ever seen and are hiring left-right and centre. If we can't compete any more for whatever reason, shouldn't we be asking why? Are we losing our entrepeneurship? Our talent base? Work ethic? If so, why?

Germany seem incredibly switched on to the potential of scientific/engineering/research support from the government. They are aiming to be a world leader in electric vehicle manufacture and connectivity implementation and I dare say they will achieve their goals. Their government criticised ours for allocating money to give as grants to people buying electric cars. Germany are ploughing all their money into research to engineer better batteries, motors and power points. It's a far better approach that long term will come out trumps.

Our government must ensure they understand the enormous role of science and research and support it properly. It's one thing to get the tax/regulatory base right but this alone will not ensure the proper technologies are developed (many are in an embryonic stage and won't be profitable for many years).

Fund the right areas and the numerous spin offs will come.

 

[scorza]

Well a lot are made by EADS so technically parts of them are.

Yeah but the parts that employ British workers, all that stuff needs to go abroad too - these people are the enemies of enterprise.

 

[badcompany]

Why buy an inferior product just because it's British?

To have a functioning society were people can actually have jobs rather than a life on benefits\perpetual education or a part time job in the service industry?