Student protester jailed

Nitefly · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:43

Tefal said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-14150800

he fits it

"basically we've been trashing stuff cause we're very angry"

Hold on, who are we on about, Gilmour or the fire extinguisher guy?

Tefal · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:44

I dunno people seem to be switching between the two >.<

the thread was bumped for gilmour thoguht we'd all finsihed with the toher one before that

steve-h · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:45

8igdave said:
Completely missing the point.

Well I was replying to:

8igdave said:
The punishment system should be harder because then people wouldn't do stupid things like this in the first place.

So I wasn't missing the point at all, actually?

You just dodged my question by asking me questions, which I answered.

Nitefly · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:45

Tefal said:
I dunno people seem to be switching between the two >.<

the thread was bumped for gilmour thoguht we'd all finsihed with the toher one before that

I have to say, I'm less sympathetic to Gilmour.

Tefal · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:46

steve-h said:
Well I was replying to:

So I wasn't missing the point at all, actually? You just dodged my question by asking me questions, which I answered.

well you can bet whenever someone else thinks of throwing a fire extinguisher off a building that it'll occur to them now.

Dolph · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:46

I have to admire how people can compare sentences for negligent activities or carrying a weapon to sentencing for intentionally committing acts of violence with the emphasis on the sentence for the violent act being too severe...

steve-h · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:48

Tefal said:
well you can bet whenever someone else thinks of throwing a fire extinguisher off a building that it'll occur to them now.

Only the real dumb people will be put off now opposed to before. The type that have to put their hand into fire to know it's hot.

Dolph said:
I have to admire how people can compare sentences for negligent activities or carrying a weapon to sentencing for intentionally committing acts of violence with the emphasis on the sentence for the violent act being too severe...

I thought this, but read the other comparisons made

Bigger stage = bigger sentence?

Nitefly · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:49

Dolph said:
I have to admire how people can compare sentences for negligent activities or carrying a weapon to sentencing for intentionally committing acts of violence with the emphasis on the sentence for the violent act being too severe...

I am assuming you are referring to me, if you are my emphasis was on getting 'carried away in the moment' to do something disruptive, obviously dropping a fire extinguisher off a roof is a more destructive crime.

It was still harsh though.

Glaucus · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:50

steve-h said:
Only the real dumb people will be put off now opposed to before. The type that have to put their hand into fire to know it's hot.

Really? Before it was considered a joke, that people will get away with it. That is one reason why the sentences are long. Nothing new in that. That and the Bristol riots have shown the masses it n't be tolerated.

Carried away in the moment, stupid defence. Just like I had to beat someone up because I'm drunk. Thousands of people went to the protest and didn't get carried away.

Tefal · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:52

Nitefly said:
I am assuming you are referring to me, if you are my emphasis was on getting 'carried away in the moment' to do something disruptive, obviously dropping a fire extinguisher off a roof is a more destructive crime.

It was still harsh though.

scorza said:
Yesterday I watched Traffic Cops, featuring a horrific, near-fatal accident caused by a woman driving while talking on a mobile phone. She was given a 1 year suspended prison sentence for a crime that resulted in two innocent people suffering life-changing injuries. Today a rather stupid youth, who got carried away in a protest that turned violent but didn't actually hurt anyone gets jailed for 16 months. Guess that's what happens if you threaten the establishment, another life ruined.

that i think the gilmore one not you nite.

sunama · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:53

Bennie-Mac said:
No, but something tells me he would have gotten a much longer sentange for...that thing...whats it called...oh yeah, murder.

I thought the whole point of the judicial system was to punish people for the crimes they committed, not what they could have done.

My thoughts exactly.

Take the following 2 scenarios:

S1: I walk in to a shopping centre and with a semi automatic hand gun, unload 10 shots, at random. Nobody gets hit. I end up getting 10 years in prison (lets say).

S2: Now, lets say I do the same thing, only this time, each of those 10 shots ends up killing 1 person. So, I have actually now killed 10 people. In this instance, my sentence will be much harsher (almost certainly, a life sentence).

S2 was a lot more serious because I actually killed 10 people. As a result, I ended up with a life sentence.

When a person is sentenced, he is sentenced for the crimes he committed, not what may have happened, if the circumstances were different.

The sentence was extremely harsh and I'm sure his defence team would've been quite surprised at the severity of the sentence. Still, I think they will appeal and get it reduced.

Without question, this sentence is politically motivated.

Glaucus · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:54

But no one has compare two similar crimes.

Pinkribbonscars · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:55

Not harsh at all IMO, there's a fairly big gap between getting carried away and nearly killing someone.

Nitefly · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:55

AcidHell2 said:
Carried away in the moment, stupid defence. Just like I had to beat someone up because I'm drunk. Thousands of people went to the protest and didn't get carried away.

In that sense yes, you are completely right.

But he didn't beat anyone up - he didn't actually harm anyone (fire extinguisher man).

What about a man that gets drunk and does something destructive in public to a fire extinguisher which is dangerous, but nobody is harmed - a year and a half for that? Obviously not a perfect example, but I'm sure you get the jist.

Nitefly · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:56

sunama said:
Without question, this sentence is politically motivated.

Agreed.

Dolph · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:56

steve-h said:
Only the real dumb people will be put off now opposed to before. The type that have to put their hand into fire to know it's hot.

I thought this, but read the other comparisons made Bigger stage = bigger sentence?

Well, Violent disorder is a specific crime that can only occur during certain situations, which tend to occur during public disorder. In terms of violent disorder, he actually got a pretty lenient sentence.

Glaucus · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:57

Throwing an extinguisher of a roof, into a crowded place. Is not the same as any half arsed comparison anyone has said.
There are different crimes, it's also down to what can be proved. With regards to intent, or accidental.

z3r0 · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:58

Pinkribbonscars said:
Not harsh at all IMO, there's a fairly big gap between getting carried away and nearly killing someone.

+1

What a prat.

Tefal · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:58

Nitefly said:
Agreed.

whats the average sentence for violent disorder (guessing you can fid that thing out a bit easier than us considering you're training/are a lawyer)

Pinkribbonscars · 15 Jul 2011 at 19:59

Throw a fire extinguisher into a crowd of people and 9 times out of 10 someone is going to die, it was incredibibly lucky someone didn't. If he doesn't have the mental capacity to realise that (though I'm sure he did) then he should be locked up purely for the public's safety.