Billion 7800N vs DG834 (DGTeam Firmware)

Alexrose1uk

Alexrose1uk

Alexrose1uk

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Billion 7800N vs DG834 (DGTeam Firmware) - Opinions?

Hi guys,
I'm trying to make the decision whether to upgrade my router. Right now I'm using a DG834GT with the DGTeam firmware (one of the final ones which included Phyre support). Right now I've got it sitting at 97% SNR to try and hold it over the 3Mbps profile, I could push lower but it'd be counteractive to stability and I'm worried it'd introduce too many line errors, especially when the conditions aren't ideal.

I'm considering upgrading as I'm on a countryside connection (ADSL Max only) and I understand the 7800n has a very good reputation for not only holding onto slightly more iffy lines, but is based off more powerful hardware, and a more recent broadcom chipset than the DG series; along with the other benefits it'd give me - Wireless N if I want to use it; GbE et al.
Beyond this; I've been reading that the upgraded hardware capabilities in the unit mean it handles things like downloading/streaming/torrenting and gaming at the same time as it's not as hardware bound.


Main targets are:
Increasing line stability
Maintain/Increasing reliable line sync
Increased performance whilst multiple machines are active online gaming/torrenting/streaming etc at once, without having to implement harsh bandwidth/QoS restrictions (better routing performance whilst handling high connections)

The Billion isn't pocket change at a bit over £100; so if anyone has made the same jump I'd be interested to hear your opinions, as it's money I'd rather save/spend elsewhere if it won't make any noticeable difference :)
 
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Well that is one option haha although one I'd prefer to avoid where possible :). I'm sure I'd read a few others in this position where considering trying it out whilst browsing this section a couple of months back, so hoping someone will be able to give direct experience for me to make a judgement on rather than dealing with the hassle of DSR.

I'm half tempted to just do it...but I have bad luck so I'd rather try and make a balanced decision BEFORE, before jumping the gun and my luck gets in the way :D
 
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Ooh, no I hadn't, perfect feedback that, especially as it sounds like you're in a similar position to me (countryside line, occasional disconnects, approx 55dB attenuation).

Will see if anyone else says anything specific, but providing I don't get hit by a sudden bill I might have to give her a try.

I've got far too many working routers sitting around too; so if I upgrade it'd be a good excuse to get round to selling off some of the old ones.
 
I'll show you my cupboard of routers if you'll show me yours

Seriously the Billion has been great - just make sure you update the firmware and enable Phyr (which seems to work much better than the Netgear)

Have you inspected all the wiring/socket(s) ?
 
Alex, this info might help you ........ Out of my 3 adsl routers the DG834GT gets the highest sync rate, and lowest Attenuation rate of the 3 routers, they are the DG834GT, DG834N, and the Billion 7700N.

The Billion gets the lower sync speed and the highest attenuation figures of the 3.(not so good, loss of 1.5db attenuation and 250 sync speed)

One thing that will help you is to fit a ADSL nation face plate, good for +100-200 on your sync rate, not a lot but it all helps on a long line, I'm on a 4.2 kl line and manage to hold a 4 MB profile
 
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Billion 7700N has a different Broadcom chipset

As I said in the other thread I got 200K lower sync initially (may not even matter with the wide bands of BRAS profiles) but that can be tweaked and the stability is excellent
 
I'm already running an isolated master socket so the internal wiring shouldn't come into it. My line/situation does sound pretty similar to yours, DM, only with very slightly lower attenuation (55 atm vs 57 as you were) :)

In terms of routers atm I've got (all working)
DG834PN
DG834GT
Belkin 7633 (which was pretty solid actually once I stuck the final, beta firmware on it, shifted to the DG's as I liked the DGTeam firmware and I needed something with better wireless at the time)
Billion 54G ...whatever it was (it's the one that had the interesting firmware that autosyncs at 6dB regardless of SNR/DSLAM etc)
 
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dmsims said:
Billion 7700N has a different Broadcom chipset

As I said in the other thread I got 200K lower sync initially (may not even matter with the wide bands of BRAS profiles) but that can be tweaked and the stability is excellent
Click to expand...

Agreed my 7700N the stability is excellent it holds a 3db profile like glue, better than the netgear does.

I'd still like to know why the Billion 7800N syncs less than the DG834N, as they have the same chipset (6358)
 
Perhaps the Netgear DG is slightly more aggressive somewhere in the modem coding; whereas the Billion opts for a more stable choice or two?

Either way, I'm getting intermittant dropouts in the evening at about 9dB SNR so hopefully with this I'll be able to stabilise there or slightly lower, with the 55dB Attenuation I'm a little uncomfortably far from being able to up the profile, but it'd be good to reduce the line errors and disconnects. If I go silly low on dB SNR I can push the sync itself into the 4-4.6k region, but its hideously error filled and unstable.

I'm already getting some CRC errors with 9dB (if its catching them I don't mind, but I dont want to have to ask for excessive data resends) so I dont want to push this too far.
 
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I have

Belkin N (was good when we lived near an exchange)
DG834GT
2 wire (BT) 2700HGV
Billion 7800N

socket may be OK but what horrors lurk upstream:

box1.jpg
 
Hahah, it's a master plate fitted at the master socket. BT's entry box is directly on the other side of the wall, and with the numerous BT visits I had recently due to issues on thier end, I've seen inside it enough to last me for quite some time.

Ordered the 7800N just a couple of minutes ago, hopefully to arrive in the AM.
Did you find any useful settings that aren't activated 'out the box', I've already noticed it's recommended to disable the ADSL2 option if you only have an ADSL1 line.

Providing it doesn't make me want to do something nasty; I think I'll see if I can offload a few of these routers, 5 is perhaps a few too many spares :D
 
^^^^^ looks just as mine did,...... now just the black Cable, orange/ white cables straight to the screw down terminals of a NTE5 master socket..... gained me 1MB sync 5 years ago, :).

Sims, the BT 2 wire, what was your connection like with that router (sync rate compared to the billion) as they are supposedly excellent on long lines?.
 
^^^ Cheers for the info.

Alex,.... Just some more info for you, I could not hold a 3db snr ratio on my line till I fitted the ADSLNation XTE-2005 face plate, it helped my lines stability a great deal, well worth you trying to get your usable noise margin lower.
 
Alexrose1uk said:
Hahah, it's a master plate fitted at the master socket. BT's entry box is directly on the other side of the wall, and with the numerous BT visits I had recently due to issues on thier end, I've seen inside it enough to last me for quite some time.

Ordered the 7800N just a couple of minutes ago, hopefully to arrive in the AM.
Did you find any useful settings that aren't activated 'out the box', I've already noticed it's recommended to disable the ADSL2 option if you only have an ADSL1 line.

Providing it doesn't make me want to do something nasty; I think I'll see if I can offload a few of these routers, 5 is perhaps a few too many spares :D
Click to expand...



Just make sure you upgrade to the lastest firmware think its like 1.06d. Also remember when you change any settings with the billion to click "apply" then click "save" after otherwise everytime it boots up your be back to default settings :D found that out the hard way

Troop said:
^^^ Cheers for the info.

Alex,.... Just some more info for you, I could not hold a 3db snr ratio on my line till I fitted the ADSLNation XTE-2005 face plate, it helped my lines stability a great deal, well worth you trying to get your usable noise margin lower.
Click to expand...

I had a BT engineer come and fit me a new open reach filtered faceplate to filter my BB at the 1st extension socket in my house i have one of these crappy XNTE outside and have around 6 extension sockets in my house and i must admit my connection does feel more stable and like a few people here i have a long line 60DB. I find it still drops out every night the sync doesnt really drop sometimes it increases i think it could be the crappy router from sky, so im also looking at one of these 7800n router or the cheaper 7700n to hopefully hold my connection for longer. I get a downstream speed of 3394kbps which is not bad considering but the actual throughput is more like 2.75mb according to speed tests
 
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Troop said:
^^^ Cheers for the info.

Alex,.... Just some more info for you, I could not hold a 3db snr ratio on my line till I fitted the ADSLNation XTE-2005 face plate, it helped my lines stability a great deal, well worth you trying to get your usable noise margin lower.
Click to expand...

I've already got a filtered face plate on the master socket; but will definately consider it in the future if I feel I need to push something else :) When BT were here last they did test the one I've got against the new filter; and found it seemed to be working fine with no loss, so fingers crossed it's not the cause of any issues.
 
I've had all these routers, and this Billion 7800 blows them all away, followed the the stability of the 2wire 2700 and the flexibility of the DG834V4 :)

Just re-sync on my line (now 8pm) and it resyncs back at my line cap of 6496/1024kbps. In fact there hasn't been a time the 7800 hasn't got to max sync.

Even the 2wire used to struggle past 3pm. The firmware is actually in english, which is more than can be said for the DGTeam Netgear (haha), and it has all the bells and whistles that modern routers should (IPV6, QoS etc)

If you don't like this modem then there's no help. Just make sure to configure it all before plugging in to the line, as it does need to be rebooted each time you make changes. Only downside tbh.

I will say also, in my testing with filtered faceplates, I'll recommend the bog standard BT filtered faceplate every time. The ADSLnation one gives me slower upstream, and less of a margin.. and I've tested them ALL.

Austin Taylor
Pressac Modified
BT standard
Tamar

You name them, I've tried them in pursuit of the best speed.
 
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Thanks for the advice EVH. I found out Broadband Buyer who I grabbed the router from (when I accidentally mistyped a digit and failed security) are on the other side of MK to me so was able to collect it on my lunch break, so I'll be able to set it up first thing in the AM rather than waiting for it to arrive :)

Do you have any recommendations for getting the most out of it, in terms of stability/sync speed, bearing in mind I'm on ADSL MAX, rather than ADSL2+
 
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