"alcohol is at least twice as harmful to users than cannabis and 5 times more harmful to society"

Bifröst said:
I smoked everyday (here or there) for 2+ years in my teens, I won't lie. It was fun at the time but after a while I realized it was screwing with our heads. I've spoken to ex smokers and we agree its not a 'fun' day if you aren't high.

If we couldn't get any weed off our dealers then we'd be bored as hell really. We were all set to give up smoking it over one weekend where we'd buy an ounce and go camping. I pulled out relatively last minute as that seemed like a stupid idea. I gave up really easily infact and burnt my childhood friends in the process, I was always different in the first place.

A year ahead, one my friends proceeded to take harsher drugs, has been to a psychologist, has to take pills to control himself (dunno what). The other is okay as much as I know. Probably a little different but still going well.

Me on the other hand, whether it was the weed or not, I am fairly reclusive but disliking it a lot of the time. Socially inept mostly. Not sure if I came out worse then most of my friends or whether that was roughly the way I was going to turn out to be :p

I would turn back time if I could. Moderation is all people really need to know. People excuse weed as a weak drug, over time it really does mess with you.
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Well i've been smoking for over 22 years now and i can't say that it has "messed with me over time" like you say. Maybe it's you man your spirit and will power is weak, who said with or without the drug you was going to be a superstar. Sounds to me like you may have some underlying problems. Did you take other drugs too?
 
hurfdurf said:
Like prostitution, the major and by far the most harmful problems caused by drugs are caused by them being illegal.
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Exactly. A lot of people fear that if drugs were legalised that it would be easy for kids to get. When in reality kids are already purchasing drugs on the black market easily enough. If it were to be legalised and regulated properly then less kids would be taking drugs at a young age then there are now.

Lets not forget all the drug money that goes toward organised crime. Infact over the last year or so the price of cannabis has almost double. This money could be put to better use and the decrease in crime would also benefit everyone in general.
 
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amsterdam is in the EU.

go and live there if you want legal prostitution and smoke yourself into a vegetative state.

i've seen people get in a mess from the stuff. lazy lethargic, even stealing rent money to pay for their supply for the month.

can't sleep unless they smoke it i guess is the most common. depression creeps up a lot as well.

i'm waiting for UK ID cards so we can limit consumption of harmful stuff. like up to 12 units a night sort of thing using your ID card as a tally. if you mis-behave on the drink then you get your allowance reduced. job done.
 
ShaolinDreams said:
Well i've been smoking for over 22 years now and i can't say that it has "messed with me over time" like you say. Maybe it's you man your spirit and will power is weak, who said with or without the drug you was going to be a superstar. Sounds to me like you may have some underlying problems. Did you take other drugs too?
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Nah, I only smoked weed. Taking anything harder...now that would be stupid :p

Like I said, I was probably always going to be like this :cool:
 
stuman said:
amsterdam is in the EU.

go and live there if you want legal prostitution and smoke yourself into a vegetative state.

i've seen people get in a mess from the stuff. lazy lethargic, even stealing rent money to pay for their supply for the month.

can't sleep unless they smoke it i guess is the most common. depression creeps up a lot as well.

i'm waiting for UK ID cards so we can limit consumption of harmful stuff. like up to 12 units a night sort of thing using your ID card as a tally. if you mis-behave on the drink then you get your allowance reduced. job done.
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Why should I move because some people have a problem with something I want to do that only affects me, the person doing it?

I've seen people die of lung cancer because of tobacco products, drink themselves to death on alcohol (which is infinitely more addictive), and yet you want to regulate that? Why the double standard?
 
My favourite thing about weed is no matter how much I smoke, my morals remain completely intact and my mind is still able to tell right from wrong.
 
stuman said:
i've seen people get in a mess from the stuff. lazy lethargic, even stealing rent money to pay for their supply for the month.

can't sleep unless they smoke it i guess is the most common. depression creeps up a lot as well.
.
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so ? EVERYONE has seen someone do the above 'on' alcohol. often even their own parents , friends , colleagues , role models.

yes smoking cannabis is more dangerous than not smoking anything but its just one of many things where this applies. millions smoke it anyway and millions line the pockets of criminals with it. why not have these people lining the pockets of our cash strapped government

non smokers aren't suddenly going to start smoking it just because they can. its just the many people who do smoke it will be able to do so more safely and put their well earned money to a better use than buying their dealer a new pair of trainers or for example an illegal gun
 
^TANK^ said:
Resin known as solid can be cut with different agents to get more volume. A little list of some of the more well known rubbish sometimes mixed in with the cannabis resin are as follows.
  1. ,beeswax
  2. , turpentine
  3. , milk powder
  4. , ketamine
  5. , boot polish
  6. , henna
  7. , pine resin
  8. , aspirin
  9. , animal feces
  10. , ground coffee
  11. , barbiturates
  12. , glues and dyes
  13. carcinogenic solvents such as Toluene and Benzene
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And if it was legalized and regulated it would not be cut with those substances..
 
"andy" said:
so ? EVERYONE has seen someone do the above 'on' alcohol. often even their own parents , friends , colleagues , role models.

yes smoking cannabis is more dangerous than not smoking anything but its just one of many things where this applies. millions smoke it anyway and millions line the pockets of criminals with it. why not have these people lining the pockets of our cash strapped government

non smokers aren't suddenly going to start smoking it just because they can. its just the many people who do smoke it will be able to do so more safely and put their well earned money to a better use than buying their dealer a new pair of trainers or for example an illegal gun
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or how about the government offer up £1000 for shopping a drug dealer. then when they get caught sentence them properly. get them building the wind farms, replacing the roads, building bigger and more brutal prisons.

also, you mention everybody has seen someone like this on drink. well, no, i've not seen people suffering insomnia because they haven't had a drink. nor have i seen people stealing rent from house mates to buy some drink. both of these situations i have seen more than once.
 
chaosdestro0 said:
And if it was legalized and regulated it would not be cut with those substances..
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It's just scaremongering. Any decent dealer would not pollute their cannabis with ****, and it would be stupid to buy from an untrusted source. You cant give cannabis a bad rep because some kid dealer somewhere is mixing his crop with ****.

Trust is the key word. If you don't know a trustworthy source just stay the hell away from anything.
 
stuman said:
also, you mention everybody has seen someone like this on drink. well, no, i've not seen people suffering insomnia because they haven't had a drink. nor have i seen people stealing rent from house mates to buy some drink. both of these situations i have seen more than once.
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Your analytical evidence is exactly that. There are many alcoholics plaguing this country committing all sorts of crimes.

http://www.ias.org.uk/resources/factsheets/crime_disorder.pdf

It's the leading causes of some crimes, and yet, your beef is with weed because your friend once got robbed by some people who smoke it.

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asim18 said:
It's just scaremongering. Any decent dealer would not pollute their cannabis with ****, and it would be stupid to buy from an untrusted source. You cant give cannabis a bad rep because some kid dealer somewhere is mixing his crop with ****.

Trust is the key word. If you don't know a trustworthy source just stay the hell away from anything.
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Oh look, a broken clock.
 
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stuman said:
also, you mention everybody has seen someone like this on drink. well, no, i've not seen people suffering insomnia because they haven't had a drink. nor have i seen people stealing rent from house mates to buy some drink. both of these situations i have seen more than once.
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Amazed that people are still arguing that alcohol is somehow safer or less damaging than cannabis. How much evidence do you need? From the sound of it, your anecdotal evidence is wildly skewed.
 
i didn't see someone get robbed for the rent. he lived with us, and instead of paying the money to the letting agent he went to his dealer.

"A finding that might support this belief is the fact that if a person smokes marijuana for a long period of time and then quits, he experiences a period of withdrawal. The withdrawal period is filled with anxieties and, for some, depression. These are the very same symptoms that have been copiously noted as being the culprits for causing insomnia. Those who believe the drug is the cause of sleeplessness might call this state marijuana insomnia."

google search for canabis insomnia turn up many links relating this.

i could quote more little anecdotes but i was going for my more general observations not singular cases.
 
stuman said:
i could quote more little anecdotes but i was going for my more general observations not singular cases.
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Ok, quote some little anecdotes in terms of how harmful cannabis is compared to alcohol and nicotine and how much both of those lead to crime in comparison to it.
 
On the plus side - anyone stoned driving would be easy to spot. a. from the vast amounts of smoke billowing from inside the car and b. from the extremely slow speed they'd be travelling at...

In all seriousness - I'm not sure that using one evil is an argument for easing up on another. I firmly believe that there needs to be a serious swing on the way alcohol is perceived - pot is just fine where it is IMO.
 
hurfdurf said:
Ok, quote some little anecdotes in terms of how harmful cannabis is compared to alcohol and nicotine and how much both of those lead to crime in comparison to it.
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well nicotine is not harmful. smoking is. smoked for 6 years gave up 5 months ago. no health problems to report.

also, why link it to crime? why not link it to people on long term benefits/unemployed. costs me just as much in taxes.
 
taken from talktofrank.com. In light of this information it seems stupid to me to be relaxing the fight against one evil just because another is worse... It's a moronic argument.

POT
- Even hardcore smokers can become anxious, panicky, suspicious or paranoid.
- Cannabis affects your coordination, which is one of the reasons why drug driving is just as illegal as drink driving.
- Some people think cannabis is harmless just because it’s a plant – but it isn’t harmless. Cannabis, like tobacco, has lots of chemical 'nasties', which can cause lung disease and possibly cancer with long-term or heavy use, especially as it is often mixed with tobacco and smoked without a filter. It can also make asthma worse, and cause wheezing in non-asthma sufferers.
- Cannabis itself can affect many different systems in the body, including the heart: It increases the heart rate and can affect blood pressure.
- If you’ve a history of mental health problems, then taking cannabis is not a good idea: It can cause paranoia in the short term, but in those with a pre-existing psychotic illness, such as schizophrenia, it can contribute to relapse.
- If you use cannabis and have a family background of mental illness, such as schizophrenia, you may be at increased risk of developing a psychotic illness.
- It is reported that frequent use of cannabis can cut a man's sperm count, reduce sperm motility, and can suppress ovulation in women and so may affect fertility.
- If you’re pregnant, smoking cannabis frequently may have some association with the risk of the baby being born smaller than expected.
- Regular, heavy use makes it difficult to learn and concentrate. Some people begin to feel tired all the time and can't seem to get motivated.
- Some users may want to buy strong herbal cannabis to get ‘a bigger high’ but unpleasant reactions can be more powerful when you use strong cannabis, and it is possible that using strong cannabis repeatedly could lead in time to more users experiencing harmful effects such as dependence or being more at risk of developing the mental health effects.

Alcohol

- One drink too many can leave you feeling out of control – like slurring your words, losing your balance and vomiting.
- Official guidelines recommend that men shouldn’t regularly drink more than 3-4 units a day and women shouldn’t regularly drink more than 2-3 units a day because of the harm this may cause. The guidelines also recommend that after an episode of heavy drinking, it’s advisable to refrain from drinking for 48 hours to allow the tissues to recover.
- Psychological and physical dependence on alcohol can creep up on you. Tolerance gradually increases the more you drink excessively on a regular basis, so you may find you'll need more alcohol to reach the same state. In other words, you may seem to be getting better at holding your drink when that’s really a sign of a developing problem.
- Alcohol can make you mouthy, argumentative and aggressive. There’s no way of knowing beforehand if you’re going to turn into a nasty drunk.
- Serious overindulgence can lead to alcohol poisoning which could put you in a coma or even kill you.
- Alcohol is blamed for contributing to all kinds of problems in Britain, from violent crime to domestic violence and to car-related deaths.
- Long-term excessive use of alcohol causes illnesses such as liver damage, stomach cancer and heart disease.
 
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