Is evolution a religion?

mollymoo · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:46

bhavv said:
There is yet nothing illegal about these kinds of schools, they are allowed to exist and import and teach curriculum from the USA / Saudi Arabia instead of the UK curriculum, and they are fully endorsed and supported by our government.

But are they LEA funded?

Vonhelmet · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:48

bhavv, can you provide evidence for the government "wasting" money on faith schools? Ideally evidence that shows it is the faith bit causing the problem, rather than them just being bad schools faith or no faith? If so, and I doubt you'll get that far, can you show that such problems affect a majority of faith schools?

bhavv · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:48

Deadbeat said:
I'm sure people have tried to correct you on this basic misunderstanding before - atheism isn't a lack of belief in God or gods, but an active disbelief. Do you still not understand the distinction?

I dont understand false statements no.

There is no difference between a lack of belief, and an active disbelief, both mean 100% the same thing.

Vonhelmet said:
bhavv, can you provide evidence for the government "wasting" money on faith schools? Ideally evidence that shows it is the faith bit causing the problem, rather than them just being bad schools faith or no faith? If so, and I doubt you'll get that far, can you show that such problems affect a majority of faith schools?

I never stated 'majority or minority'.

I stated that the fundamentalist schools in the videos I posted, along with however many others are like them are supported and funded by the government.

dirtychinchilla · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:49

I'm 22 I guess in primary school when I was learning about religion that would have been around 1995. They NEVER mentioned the possibility of being an athiest, EVER.

ringo747 · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:50

Captain Planet said:
I vote sub-forum for religion based threads... there is one every week and they all follow the very same debate/discussion and routine.

This.

Deadbeat · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:50

bhavv said:
I dont understand false statements no.

There is no difference between a lack of belief, and an active disbelief, both mean 100% the same thing.

Remarkable that you can say that with a straight face. I think I understand better now why you cling so rabidly to points proven false or disingenuous time and time again.

Vonhelmet · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:51

bhavv said:
The fact that the school that your son goes to offers support for dyslexic students, or any other better teaching standards has nothing to do with it being a catholic / faith school.

I rather fancy that that is exactly the point that Castiel is attempting to beat into you.

bhavv · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:52

semi-pro waster said:
Do you mean this to read as quite such an absolute position? To baldly state that no RE class will teach any more about atheism...

dirtychinchilla said:
I'm 22 I guess in primary school when I was learning about religion that would have been around 1995. They NEVER mentioned the possibility of being an athiest, EVER.

^^ What he said.

RomanNose · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:52

Deadbeat said:
I'm sure people have tried to correct you on this basic misunderstanding before - atheism isn't a lack of belief in God or gods, but an active disbelief. Do you still not understand the distinction?

That's a old definition, atheism most commonly is negative atheism which is a lack in belief of god. The classical definition is that it's an active disbelief, this is not widely used anymore and most people on forums these days mean the more modern definition. This is because negative atheism is much more common than positive atheism. If you use the classical definition, then where do negative atheists fit in? Are they agnostics? You can see the old definition might create some confusion.

dirtychinchilla · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:52

Vonhelmet said:
I rather fancy that that is exactly the point that Castiel is attempting to beat into you.

+1

bhavv, you must concede

Scougar · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:52

Even as a Christian, it's worrying that creationism to that degree is taught in schools.

bhavv · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:53

Deadbeat said:
Remarkable that you can say that with a straight face. I think I understand better now why you cling so rabidly to points proven false or disingenuous time and time again.

'Atheism is a belief that there are no Gods or Deities. An atheist is a person who does not believe in any Gods or Deities'.

This is not incorrect, no one has proven it to be false, and all other definitions that people keep giving on this forum are not backed up by any valid source.

It was actually proven to be correct by whoever gave the definition of the word atheos in the other thread.

semi-pro waster · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:58

bhavv said:
^^ What he said.

Ok, so at least two of you went to schools where the RE teaching is/was rubbish but you're going to hold that up as being indicative of all RE teaching everywhere? It seems like an awfully big leap to me to go from "teaching is rubbish in a couple of examples here" to "all RE teaching is rubbish".

bhavv · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:58

http://atheism.about.com/od/definitionofatheism/a/definition.htm

There is, unfortunately, some disagreement about the definition of atheism. It is interesting to note that most of that disagreement comes from theists — atheists themselves tend to agree on what atheism means. Christians in particular dispute the definition used by atheists and insist that atheism means something very different.

The broader, and more common, understanding of atheism among atheists is quite simply "not believing in any gods." No claims or denials are made — an atheist is just a person who does not happen to be a theist. Sometimes this broader understanding is called "weak" or "implicit" atheism. Most good, complete dictionaries readily support this.

semi-pro waster said:
Ok, so at least two of you went to schools where the RE teaching is/was rubbish

No, I didnt go to a school where the RE teaching was rubbish, I went to a school that taught a great deal of religion in 'religious education'.

Maybe you dont realize that the curriculum regarding atheism has most likely changed since 1995.

Castiel · 17 Dec 2011 at 15:59

bhavv said:
To my belief such programs and support for dyslexic students should be compulsory for all schools, and they are available in most schools if the parents of a dyslexic child take an active role in making sure that their child is receiving the support they need from the school.

If the goverment wasnt wasting so many resources on faith based schools, maybe this would be a possibility by now.

Also I am not ignoring your points, you are still ignoring, or are incapable of understanding mine.

The fact that the school that your son goes to offers support for dyslexic students, or any other better teaching standards has nothing to do with it being a catholic / faith school. The only thing that can be attributed to any faith based school is that it has a religious based bias, however significant or insignificant.

bhavv....I'm not sure whether you are intentionally obtuse or merely not intelligent enough to understand that the Catholic Diocese give EXTRA funding on top of that supplied by the LEA to support the dyslexia program within the school, this means more teaching assistants and better facilities than the other non-Catholic schools, the Diocese also contributes around 10% on top of the shool budget for capital projects and educational support that are not funded otherwise. It has nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with the extra funding allocated to the School by the Catholic Diocese. Also, as regards accessing the funding for dyslexia, the School first has to recognise the issue, which I am sad to say, many do not.

If the State replaces the funding given by the Diocese then I would not care whether the school becomes secular or not.....the reason my Son goes to the school is because the additional funding allocated to the school by the Catholic Diocese mean it can offer a higher level of education than the alternative schools available to him.

Also the state isn't wasting resources or money on faith schools as they are also state schools, they recieve (as a rule) additional funding from the diocese....independent schools recieve no state funds.

Bhavv..I suggest you get the facts before making judgement.

bhavv said:
The scientific method, reason and objectiveness do not apply to something that first and foremost bypasses all of these requirements such as religion.

I was referring to you and the way you pass judgement and reach conclusions based on opinion alone and not by objective and unbiased fact.

dirtychinchilla · 17 Dec 2011 at 16:01

semi-pro waster said:
Ok, so at least two of you went to schools where the RE teaching is/was rubbish but you're going to hold that up as being indicative of all RE teaching everywhere? It seems like an awfully big leap to me to go from "teaching is rubbish in a couple of examples here" to "all RE teaching is rubbish".

Potentially, but it was actually quite good for religions; I learnt a lot. It was an excellent school, trust me.

Biohazard · 17 Dec 2011 at 16:02

bhavv said:
^^ What he said.

Wouldn't it depend on the denomination of the school, if any, you were educated at?

dirtychinchilla · 17 Dec 2011 at 16:03

Biohazard said:
Wouldn't it depend on the denomination of the school, if any, you were educated at?

Mine had no denomination that I'm aware of, though being in an apparently Christian society, that was the focus.

bhavv · 17 Dec 2011 at 16:03

Biohazard said:
Wouldn't it depend on the denomination of the school, if any, you were educated at?

A non religious secular comprehensive / ex grammar school / now a sports college?

What more exactly does a school need to teach about Atheism other than what I said?

I went to a good school that at least had a religious RE teacher that taught the correct definition of Atheism (a very religiously open minded teacher who attended church / mosque / hindu temples / synagogues and gurudwaras only to further her own knowledge about every religion).

Anyone who genuinely believes that Atheism is anything more than 'not believing in Gods or Deities' are 100% misinformed and ignorant liars.

Vonhelmet · 17 Dec 2011 at 16:06

bhavv said:
I never stated 'majority or minority'.

I stated that the fundamentalist schools in the videos I posted, along with however many others are like them are supported and funded by the government.

Ah, I see, so your beef is with schools that deviate from the curriculum, rather than with faith schools?

Why do you keep banging on about faith schools, then? Surely your problem is with bad schools, as I said?