Tube drivers vote to strike again!

Dr House · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:47

Aslef, the union representing the Tube drivers, wants triple pay and a day off in lieu for drivers for working on the bank holiday.

LU said a pay agreement with Tube workers meant drivers have 43 days' annual leave which means they have to work some public holidays, including Boxing Day.

What are these guys smoking? a tube drive still makes more then a doctor with 4 years experience (my wife), we don't get any extra pay for working on boxing day and 50% of the time we don't even get to use our day in lieu. Thats just life and how it goes.

These guys need to suck it up and go back and do a honest days work and understand that they are paid quite well and that working on weekends/ holidays is just part of the job!

mjt · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:50

When I heard that they wanted triple pay AND a day off in lieu I on the news I almost fell off my sofa. Whatever they're smoking, I want some!

franco_22 · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:50

They get paid more then a doctor?

That's ridiculous, what does a tube driver even do that's so special?

sniffy · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:53

How on earth do they get such high pay for what seems to be a relatively unskilled job? Obviously you couldn't just put anyone in the driver's seat but it doesn't seem to require that much knowledge/technical ability?

Cosimo · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:53

I'll have to find another way of getting to my game. :mad:

Ricochet J · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:55

This is getting ridiculous.

Dr House · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:55

franco_22 said:
They get paid more then a doctor?

That's ridiculous, what does a tube driver even do that's so special?

To be fair doctors pay for the first 7 to 8 years is not that good but it gets much better after that,

in the most junior hospital trainee post (Foundation Year 1) the basic starting salary is £22,412. This increases in Foundation Year 2 to £27,798. For a doctor in specialist training the basic starting salary is £29,705. If the doctor is contracted to work more than 40 hours and/or to work outside 7am-7pm Monday to Friday, they will receive an additional supplement which will normally be between 20% and 50% of basic salary. This supplement is based on the extra hours worked above a 40 hour standard working week and the intensity of the work.

I think tube drives can make unto £50k per year

Edit
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23993740-tube-driver-pay-to-top-pound-50000.do

Marky · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:55

I don't understand why they get paid so much anyway. Isn't driving a train essentially just forward, reverse, stop controls? Maybe I'm being incredibly nieve, but it sounds like a very easy job with little stress...

Next question... How long does it take to train as a tube driver?

DBT85 · 22 Dec 2011 at 17:56

3T I could live with even if it is a little high. A day off in Lieu and maybe 1.5T I could accept. But 3T AND a day off?

How the **** do these people get taken seriously?

sniffy said:
How on earth do they get such high pay for what seems to be a relatively unskilled job? Obviously you couldn't just put anyone in the driver's seat but it doesn't seem to require that much knowledge/technical ability?

That is in part a chunk of why they get that money. If you want someone to do what is probably one of the dullest jobs in the world in a small box in mostly darkness, where they cant just read a book or take a laptop to work like a security guy, you need to pay them some wedge.

My uncle quit being a Paramedic of 20 years to drive trains. He went from 27k to 35k and he now isn't going deaf from the sirens, isnt getting threatened every Friday and Saturday night and doesn't have to wear a stab vest.

Cosimo · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:00

LU failed to get the strike made illegal:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16302714

The ongoing tube strike discussion is in here:

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18325122

Dr House · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:01

Todge said:
That is in part a chunk of why they get that money. If you want someone to do what is probably one of the dullest jobs in the world in a small box in mostly darkness, where they cant just read a book or take a laptop to work like a security guy, you need to pay them some wedge.
.

I do accept its boring but its still not bad compared to what many people have to do.

Last week I had the gas guy out digging up the pipes in my garden. It was wet and VERY cold and the poor sod is in the mud digging a 40m long trench with a shovel I bet he is not on over 25k

Castiel · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:02

I usually defend their right to negotiate, including the withdrawal of labour, but frankly this is taking it too far...

Industry averages would dictate that they are paid Time + One Half and a day in lieu, which is effectively double time and a half for public and bank holidays.

Their relative level of pay to other occupations is immaterial to the reasonableness of what they are asking, and effectively asking for Four Times the daily rate or they will withdraw their labour is unreasonable by any standard.

alx · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:03

sniffy said:
How on earth do they get such high pay for what seems to be a relatively unskilled job? Obviously you couldn't just put anyone in the driver's seat but it doesn't seem to require that much knowledge/technical ability?

My mate was a tube driver for 3 months as part of the TfL grad scheme. He said it was a piece of ****.

They really have some nerve, I bet they are just striking because they can. Triple pay and day in lieu, what planet do these guys live on?

Glaucus · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:03

mjt said:
When I heard that they wanted triple pay AND a day off in lieu I on the news I almost fell off my sofa. Whatever they're smoking, I want some!

Standard contract for a lot of people on the railway, obviously not tube drivers. But they also get an extra 10 days AL

semi-pro waster · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:03

Marky said:
I don't understand why they get paid so much anyway. Isn't driving a train essentially just forward, reverse, stop controls? Maybe I'm being incredibly nieve, but it sounds like a very easy job with little stress...

Next question... How long does it take to train as a tube driver?

I'm not sure it's entirely low stress or quite as simple as all that, however I believe a large proportion of the wages of a Tube driver is for the levels of concentration required and responsibility for the numbers of people that they have. I don't think it's likely to be a very interesting job after the initial training period (or barring emergencies) but you need a pretty high level of concentration not to miss a signal etc and you do have frequently the lives of several hundred people in your hands at any one time - not to mention the ever present risk that someone will choose suicide by Tube train as the best way to go.

I don't think it's the easiest job in the World but I find my sympathy for them somewhat diminishing recently, I know it's not always that easy to find another job but it's surely an accepted risk of the job that sometimes you'll have to work on bank holidays - it's not as if they're being lured into the role and then told that this is the case.

Mr Jack · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:04

Castiel said:
Their relative level of pay to other occupations is immaterial to the reasonableness of what they are asking, and effectively asking for Four Times the daily rate or they will withdraw their labour is unreasonable by any standard.

The strike is over whether working on Boxing Day is mandatory or voluntary; the union is insisting that it should continue to be voluntary and attract sufficient incentives to actually get the workers in. TFL wants it to be compulsory.

I think the 4x pay demand is excessive, but I think the notion that they continue to have the right not to work on Boxing Day is not wholly unreasonable. Striking multiple times over it strikes me as OTT though.

Castiel · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:05

Dr House said:
I do accept its boring but its still not bad compared to what many people have to do.

Last week I had the gas guy out digging up the pipes in my garden. It was wet and VERY cold and the poor sod is in the mud digging a 40m long trench with a shovel I bet he is not on over 25k

One of my neighbours is a self employed Gas and Heating Installer....he digs holes and so on...last year he earned £90k......

Mr Jack · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:05

semi-pro waster said:
I don't think it's the easiest job in the World but I find my sympathy for them somewhat diminishing recently, I know it's not always that easy to find another job but it's surely an accepted risk of the job that sometimes you'll have to work on bank holidays - it's not as if they're being lured into the role and then told that this is the case.

Not entirely correct, compulsory working on Boxing Day will be a change of conditions.

Castiel · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:07

Mr Jack said:
The strike is over whether working on Boxing Day is mandatory or voluntary; the union is insisting that it should continue to be voluntary and attract sufficient incentives to actually get the workers in. TFL wants it to be compulsory.

I think the 4x pay demand is excessive, but I think the notion that they continue to have the right not to work on Boxing Day is not wholly unreasonable. Striking multiple times over it strikes me as OTT though.

I agree, if it requires a change in their current terms & conditions to change bank holiday working from voluntary to compulsory then that is different.

The pay demand however is unreasonable.

franco_22 · 22 Dec 2011 at 18:10

Castiel said:
One of my neighbours is a self employed Gas and Heating Installer....he digs holes and so on...last year he earned £90k......

I would imagine that the installation of gas heaters not only is far more technical and require a lot more training and qualifications then driving a tube does. Also, I imagine, if your friend is self employed, he probably had to work a lot harder, including weekends and 12 hour days to make that money with a lot more stress and responsibility then a tube driver.