I've never really considered it, but I don't know the difference. Care to explain?
Goldman Sachs Pay Your Tax
- Thread starter rickh
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I've never really considered it, but I don't know the difference. Care to explain?
Tax avoidance is something a lot of every day people do. Buy duty free ciggies you are avoiding pay tax, buy a house below the £250k threshold you are avoiding paying tax. Tax avoidance is legally avoiding paying tax by modifying certain behaviour to be the most tax efficient. Tax evasion is not paying your taxes using illegal means.
Wiki has a better explaination.
Tax avoidance is arranging your financial affairs so they attract the minimum tax liability.
Tax evasion is lying about your affairs to reduce your tax bill.
Tax avoidance is perfectly legal, as has been confirmed in various courts in the UK over and over. This quote, from a 1936 tax avoidance case in front of the Law Lords as part of the decision sums it up nicely.
Most of the tax gap often claimed by various campaign groups simply doesn't exist, it isn't tax that is legally owed, however much they whinge and moan about it. This is also the case with much of the money the HMRC has written off, it's normally about legality and the chance of actually making a case that it has been evaded, rather than avoided.
The media completely manipulates this to rip HMRC a new one. It can be pretty unfair tbh. Ever wondered how that £25bn on tax figure was calculated?
Here's broadly what happens when a case lands on an inspectors desk:
1. They quickly review the file, take a round guess at the tax involved and then send out an information request.
2. They receive information from the tax payer which sheds more light on the very brief information they started with. The £25bn disappears or becomes considerably less.
It's obviously not as simple as that but one example in the tax advisory work I do; a client had an enquiry in Japan who claims they owe £18m of tax. When we looked at the figures it turns out it's more like £3m. It's as simple as a few spreadsheets and opinions. Tax isn't always clear cut! It's highly complex and can come down to a range of things. I believe one aspect of the Vodafone case (from what I've read in newspapers) was the location of the transactions. I.e. who has right to tax and what amounts. Different countries tax and give reliefs of different amounts. HMRC don't just say "oh, we'll let you off with this month's tax!"
Here's broadly what happens when a case lands on an inspectors desk:
1. They quickly review the file, take a round guess at the tax involved and then send out an information request.
2. They receive information from the tax payer which sheds more light on the very brief information they started with. The £25bn disappears or becomes considerably less.
It's obviously not as simple as that but one example in the tax advisory work I do; a client had an enquiry in Japan who claims they owe £18m of tax. When we looked at the figures it turns out it's more like £3m. It's as simple as a few spreadsheets and opinions. Tax isn't always clear cut! It's highly complex and can come down to a range of things. I believe one aspect of the Vodafone case (from what I've read in newspapers) was the location of the transactions. I.e. who has right to tax and what amounts. Different countries tax and give reliefs of different amounts. HMRC don't just say "oh, we'll let you off with this month's tax!"
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Indeed, this is a practice which was legislated for and began under Labour. I forget the name of it, but they passed an act in 2001 that enshrined this crap in public law.
Those claiming it's the Tories are either grossly misinformed or willfully distorting facts. Still, this cosy relationship needs to be rescinded now that they are in charge.
P.S. As the above poster rightly identifies, this £25bn figure could be highly inaccurate.
Soldato
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How on Earth did she avoid stamp duty?
Most of them do it through a complex overseas company structure.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...by-secret-Labour-agreement-with-Brussels.html
Seems his hands were tied,handcuffs obligingly supplied by Darling.
Soldato
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And what?
Is our stamp duty system setup so overseas sales don't pay it?
I thought it was a transaction tax, make a transction, pay the tax?
These taxes are essential to maintaining the social structures which enable these corporations to profit within the countries they operate. They go towards the education of the people they employ, the health services which keep the people they employ healthy and productive, the transportation systems which allow the people they employ to get to their offices and the goods/services they provide to be delivered to customers ...
Failing to pay such taxes merely ensures that the long term success of their corporation in a country is destroyed.
Corporations which have no interest in the long term success of this country, should not be welcomed here, whatever the short term cost in jobs.
Failing to pay such taxes merely ensures that the long term success of their corporation in a country is destroyed.
Corporations which have no interest in the long term success of this country, should not be welcomed here, whatever the short term cost in jobs.
Goldmann sachs actually started this whole mess, after all they pretty much own the US treasury, they literally forced the government to go ahead with the bailouts 4 years ago.
You expect them to give a damn about what you think?
Erm... eh?
I thought those that actually started it was Merrill's recalling stuff from those two Bear Stearns structured credit funds... ironically two banks that no longer exist in the state that they were in prior to 2008!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/jan/07/blair-inc-rise-earnings
It's nice to see Tony Blair doing so well isn't it...
It's nice to see Tony Blair doing so well isn't it...
Just goes to show that everyone will try to avoid paying tax.
Sorting the entire mess out is fairly easy imo.
Scrap NI and combine everything under a single tax.
Set a flat % of 25% for all earnings above £10,000.
Stop creating public sector jobs entitled "Assistant consultant of the consulting consultant".
Watch everyone poor whinge and moan for the first year as the crap news papers shout "There is now less tax coming in than EVER!!!!11". People will strike and moan that rich people are being favoured and everyone else is getting shafted.
Wait another year as the graph for total tax generated per year continues to rise.
Wait 10 years when England becomes 2nd only to Switzerland for people and companies with big cash keeping their money within our borders.
Combine that with the continued expansion on London and things look even better.
25 years England has climbed the Economic leader board and is more prosperous than ever.
Poor people continue to moan despite the fact that England is now actually in a great position.
Some people realise that if they stop moaning and get back to work they too can make a lot of money.
Easy.
Soldato
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I like your solution.
Saves me a bit of money, not a whole pile, but do you think it would really make the likes of British hero, lol, Lewis Hamilton come home and pay his taxes?
I am not so sure.
Saves me a bit of money, not a whole pile, but do you think it would really make the likes of British hero, lol, Lewis Hamilton come home and pay his taxes?
I am not so sure.
I can almost guarantee that if KPMG does the company tax returns as well as the accounts they'll have been thoroughly checked and that admin amount will have been properly broken down and accounted for. Would almost definitely be classed as a high risk client due to being such a political figure and the damage anything bad could have on their reputation.