Are 'Lifeskills' still taught in secondary schools today?

Cleeecooo · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:14

LizardKing said:
Define "Correct English"
Writing skills are not set in stone and will constantly evolve with time. You can see a huge difference in the style of writing in books written in the 1800's to books written in the mid 1900's and i'm sure 60yr old scholars of the late 1800's had the same thoughts you do now to the current styles.

You can hang on to how you were taught as long as you like but lets face it, its old hat to the teeny boppers of today

There's a difference though, yes, English changes, but when you have a variety of spellings for each and evry word, something's gone horribly wrong. This is what's happening with text speak essentially. It wouldn't be bad if English evolved into text speak eventually, as long as we all spoke pretty much the same text speak.

LizardKing · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:15

Disco Boy said:
The change that is happening to the way that some people communicate, caused by the advent of the internet and text messaging, is much faster and more pronounced than any change in the history of English. It isn't really comparable.

It's going to lead to an even more pronounced separation between the educated and the less educated.

Ironic that technology is undermining the current collective teachings as it was once established through technology.

dirtychinchilla · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:15

desires said:
Speaking and listening is something some kids find hard to grasp, letalone reading and writing, skills which must be learnt. You don't honestly think reading and writing can just be 'picked up' do you?

I was taught to read and write by my father when I was about 3, when I had a reading age of 8. He's no teacher, and when I was older I found it very difficult to learn from him, but at that age he taught me at about 5am every day before he went to work when I couldn't sleep. I'm not saying this is impressive, because I know lots of people who could read and write at a very young age, but if a 3 year old can do it, then surely someone in secondary school should be able to.

Disco Boy · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:29

dirtychinchilla said:
I was taught to read and write by my father when I was about 3, when I had a reading age of 8. He's no teacher, and when I was older I found it very difficult to learn from him, but at that age he taught me at about 5am every day before he went to work when I couldn't sleep. I'm not saying this is impressive, because I know lots of people who could read and write at a very young age, but if a 3 year old can do it, then surely someone in secondary school should be able to.

It depends if they want to speak and write good English. If all they aspire to is communicating with equally uneducated individuals, then why lean good English?

Cleeecooo · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:36

Disco Boy said:
It depends if they want to speak and write good English. If all they aspire to is communicating with equally uneducated individuals, then why lean good English?

Depends how you define good English. I define it as being a way in which people can communicate readily with the rest of society.

Disco Boy · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:40

I define it no differently. Do you not think that someone who cannot write a "proper"* sentence will come up against hurdles when trying to get anywhere in life?

*you do know exactly what I mean here

Cleeecooo · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:47

Disco Boy said:
I define it no differently. Do you not think that someone who cannot write a "proper"* sentence will come up against hurdles when trying to get anywhere in life?

*you do know exactly what I mean here

So many negatives in that sentence - I'm confused!!!

If someone can't write a proper sentence, then they are uneducated IMO and they need to sort their lives out. There are probably some exceptions I can't think of right now to that though.

arknor · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:47

I work in primary, but I have to say, you saying his CV was "badly punctuated, full of waffle and poorly presented" doesn't surprise me. In general, even over the 3-4 years I've been working full time as a teacher, it never fails to surprise me how bad some children's grammar and punctuation are.

my dyslexic step son was told grammar and punctuation didnt matter in any of his exams lol

Disco Boy · 8 Jun 2012 at 00:50

Cleeecooo said:
So many negatives in that sentence - I'm confused!!!

If someone can't write a proper sentence, then they are uneducated IMO and they need to sort their lives out. There are probably some exceptions I can't think of right now to that though.

I meant that people who can't construct a sentence are less likely to get far in life.

For example, I can understand someone writing in text speak, but I would in no way respect them in a business context.

arknor · 8 Jun 2012 at 01:05

Disco Boy said:
I meant that people who can't construct a sentence are less likely to get far in life.

For example, I can understand someone writing in text speak, but I would in no way respect them in a business context.

a lot of busisness people dont have good writing skills anyway...

you wouldnt respect richard branson? lol.. wut.....

Cleeecooo · 8 Jun 2012 at 01:15

arknor said:
a lot of busisness people dont have good writing skills anyway...

you wouldnt respect richard branson? lol.. wut.....

Where does Branson fit in?

Disco Boy · 8 Jun 2012 at 01:35

arknor said:
a lot of busisness people dont have good writing skills anyway...

you wouldnt respect richard branson? lol.. wut.....

Last time I checked, he could string a sentence together.

Kamwah · 8 Jun 2012 at 02:12

There's hardly anything useful taught in schools. Probably maths and english are the only thing that are even worth while.

arknor · 8 Jun 2012 at 02:32

Cleeecooo said:
Where does Branson fit in?

can you imagine his CV when he left school? i dont think he would have had anything to put on one..

Branson has dyslexia and had poor academic performance as a student

op is to judgemental

dirtychinchilla · 8 Jun 2012 at 08:45

I think he means that people who do business studies in school are often morons

elmarko · 8 Jun 2012 at 08:55

RomanNose said:
At my secondary we did, it was called PSHE but most of it was talking about how drugs were bad and sex education. There wasn't any cookery/finance/CV advice which would have actually been useful.

Finished in 2001 - same as the above, has some drugs/sex-ed stuff, but nothing useful for life.

I can't believe we don't teach how to balance a home budget, write a CV/covering letter, how to do an interview, cooking (real cooking), changing plugs, lights, basic gardening, basic electronics, how to put up a shelf, build a flat-pack, basic problem solving, logic, how to handle rejection, anger management, deal with depression, the costs of living alone (bill management etc) basic ethics, empathy & politics.

krooton · 8 Jun 2012 at 09:02

vicisthebest said:
I work in primary, but I have to say, you saying his CV was "badly punctuated, full of waffle and poorly presented" doesn't surprise me. In general, even over the 3-4 years I've been working full time as a teacher, it never fails to surprise me how bad some children's grammar and punctuation are. Children as a rule sit in front of a TV or computer when they get home - I used to love writing stories etc, but it doesn't happen any more.

People now write in shorthand text/email speak so much that I think a lot of people have forgotten how to use correct English.

No matter how many times I teach the different rules in as many different ways as I can think of, they learn it there and then but don't apply it to their work.

We have decided that it is going to be a HUGE focus for us as a school next year, really trying to improve children's basic grammar, as it's getting worse and worse. I don't know if young people don't believe it's that important any more but it's a massive turn-off to future employers if you can't even spell and punctuate properly.

Well done for trying to give the lad some feedback - I know that when I was applying for jobs (even ones that were advertised), I lost count of the number of schools that didn't even bother to send an acknowledgement that they had received my application

I've said it time and time again, if schools stopped putting failing pupils through to the next year, this wouldn't happen as often.

The embarrassment of being kept back a year does wonders for the 'ambition' to scrap a passing grade, and if people fail the year a second time, then they need to be looked at in more detail, perhaps they have learning difficulties or are in no way academically inclined and would be better suited to learning a trade.

dirtychinchilla · 8 Jun 2012 at 09:03

elmarko1234 said:
Finished in 2001 - same as the above, has some drugs/sex-ed stuff, but nothing useful for life.

I can't believe we don't teach how to balance a home budget, write a CV/covering letter, how to do an interview, cooking (real cooking), changing plugs, lights, basic gardening, basic electronics, how to put up a shelf, build a flat-pack, basic problem solving, logic, how to handle rejection, anger management, deal with depression, the costs of living alone (bill management etc) basic ethics, empathy & politics.

There is nothing difficult about putting up flat pack furniture!

elmarko · 8 Jun 2012 at 09:04

dirtychinchilla said:
There is nothing difficult about putting up flat pack furniture!

It depends on how many pieces are missing

Frozennova · 8 Jun 2012 at 09:23

I left compulsory education and started working full time coming up for 4 years ago and I can conclusively say I've learnt more in those 4 years than I ever did at school.