Any copyright/trademark guys in the house?

Russinating

Russinating

Russinating

Soldato
Joined
27 Dec 2005
Posts
17,316
Location
Bristol
I run a little sideline hobby making cufflinks and I've been bullied by a big global company to shut down basically. They may be well within their rights and I'm in the wrong in which case that's fair enough, but I don't know if I am or not yet!

I've been quoted £250+VAT just for advice from a copyright soliciting firm in Bristol which is more than I make from the hobby in a few months. And that could just be them telling me I'm wrong and I do need to shut down which would clearly be a bit of waste of money.

Is there anyone that knows a thing or two about trademarks and copyright that could give me some unofficial advice? If it turns out I'm not in the wrong then I'm more than happy to then go to a professional soliciting firm but it would be nice to have an inkling one way or the other first.

If you want to make direct contact then my email is in trust :)
 
Beerbaron said:
what is their reason?
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I'm using one of their trademarks, but only in saying what the product is - ie Oakley sunglasses are Oakley sunglasses.

TommyV said:
Can you repl, explain you make minimal to no profit and that it's a hobby, and ask it to be taken no further?
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I get from the gist of the their letter they won't care how much or how little I make from it.
 
Russinating said:
ie Oakley sunglasses are Oakley sunglasses.
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That sounds like the problem.

Yes they are, but you cannot use the name in the same way, as you do not own the name. They do.

It would be like making OcUK cuff-links and calling them OcUK cuff-links. People will assume they are official, branded, where infact, they are not.
 
jamief said:
Are you using their copyright without prior permission?
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Doesn't every shop in the world sell every brand without prior permission? Genuine question!

NealR said:
That sounds like the problem.

Yes they are, but you cannot use the name in the same way, as you do not own the name. They do.

It would be like making OcUK cuff-links and calling them OcUK cuff-links. People will assume they are official, branded, where infact, they are not.
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Bit different as OcUK don't sell cufflinks. It would be like selling an OcUK Mug bought from OcUK and calling it an OcUK Mug. It is what it is. Making your own OcUK Mug and using their logo is very different obviously.

Pestilence said:
Don't particularly get what you mean by that? How are you using their trademark? Straight answer please...
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I make scrabble cufflinks made from scrabble tiles. They're actual scrabble tiles (not reproduced) so I'm not sure how else you'd describe what they are.
 
Liquidfox said:
Then I think they're within their rights to tell you to stop. You're using their product and modifying it to make your own.
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Actually, I think you will find that thats fine (IANAL) - buying something, modifying it and then selling it is, I believe, legal. You might not be allowed to copy them and make your own identical duplicates, but you are effectivley reselling a good, albeit modified, which I believe is fine.

However, what they are claiming ownership of is the word "Scrabble". I assume you are selling them as "Scrabble cufflinks" or similar? I expect that is the issue. If you sold them as "letter square cuff links" or something like that, it would be fine. If you are willing to change the name you sell them under, it might be worth checking with a lawyer. If you wish to continue with "Scrabble cufflinks", I am afraid you are probobly stuffed.

IANAL - I stand to be wrong, corrected and possibly mocked.
 
Liquidfox said:
Then I think they're within their rights to tell you to stop. You're using their product and modifying it to make your own.
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I can maybe understand that but they didn't mention that as an issue in their letter, it was simply using the scrabble name. Perhaps that is wrong, I don't know, but they are scrabble tiles so it's not like I'm reproducing or using the name falsely which is obviously illegal.

Plus I'm not alone...

http://www.notonthehighstreet.com/search?utf8=✓&term=scrabble&search.x=0&search.y=0&search=go

http://www.etsy.com/search/handmade?q=scrabble&view_type=gallery&ship_to=ZZ&min=0&max=0

The same can be applied to most retro/recycled gifts (lego jewellery, beer-bottle glasses, vinyl art etc).
 
Linkex said:
Actually, I think you will find that thats fine (IANAL) - buying something, modifying it and then selling it is, I believe, legal. You might not be allowed to copy them and make your own identical duplicates, but you are effectivley reselling a good, albeit modified, which I believe is fine.

However, what they are claiming ownership of is the word "Scrabble". I assume you are selling them as "Scrabble cufflinks" or similar? I expect that is the issue. If you sold them as "letter square cuff links" or something like that, it would be fine. If you are willing to change the name you sell them under, it might be worth checking with a lawyer. If you wish to continue with "Scrabble cufflinks", I am afraid you are probobly stuffed.

IANAL - I stand to be wrong, corrected and possibly mocked.
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This does sound like the most logical explanation - although you do have the disclaimer on your site, people may well make the (mistaken) assumption that you are in some way linked to the company.
 
Russinating said:
I can maybe understand that but they didn't mention that as an issue in their letter, it was simply using the scrabble name. Perhaps that is wrong, I don't know, but they are scrabble tiles so it's not like I'm reproducing or using the name falsely which is obviously illegal.

Plus I'm not alone...

http://www.notonthehighstreet.com/search?utf8=✓&term=scrabble&search.x=0&search.y=0&search=go

http://www.etsy.com/search/handmade?q=scrabble&view_type=gallery&ship_to=ZZ&min=0&max=0

The same can be applied to most retro/recycled gifts (lego jewellery, beer-bottle glasses, vinyl art etc).
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But do you know, 100% that the company Not On The High Street, haven't got an agreement with Hasbro to use the Scrabble name ? Or any other company for that matter...
 
NealR said:
But do you know, 100% that the company Not On The High Street, haven't got an agreement with Hasbro to use the Scrabble name ? Or any other company for that matter...
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In the product details of the Scrabble Cushion it states its officially licensed... Whether that's true or not I couldn't tell you.
 
NealR said:
But do you know, 100% that the company Not On The High Street, haven't got an agreement with Hasbro to use the Scrabble name ? Or any other company for that matter...
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99% yes. I used to sell on NOTHS and how could they have an agreement? They're just a marketplace for other sellers like eBay, Gumtree or Amazon Marketplace.


TrUz said:
In the product details of the Scrabble Cushion it states its officially licensed... Whether that's true or not I couldn't tell you.
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Yes, I'd imagine the cushions are because they're reproduced.

And yes, just to confirm my site is scrabblecufflinks.co.uk. I believe I am at fault for having "scrabble" in the domain name (after consulting the HTML section) but want to know if I can essentially carry on with the same site under a different generic domain name.
 
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Sell the scrabble board game and include the cufflinks free. Problem solved :D

But no, good idea they look nice, can however see where they are coming from and the issue is problem with the name. Changing name may be the only way forward. Even then alittle iffy.
 
Russinating said:
And yes, just to confirm my site is scrabblecufflinks.co.uk. I believe I am at fault for having "scrabble" in the domain name (after consulting the HTML section) but want to know if I can essentially carry on with the same site under a different generic domain name.
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I'd agree that the domain name is probably the main issue here.

Can you call them and get them to be more specific about what they are unhappy with and ask if changing the domain name would be sufficient?
 
IANAL of course but I'd suggest scrabbletilecufflinks.co.uk would work better - you are clearing marketing cufflinks made from scrabble tiles, not cufflinks made by the company behind the scrabble board game.

No doubt you'd still have lawyers looking to deflower your *** though.
 
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