** ALL NEW (WITH RULES) Summer Transfer Window 2012/2013 Season Rumours/Signings **

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Once again because we ain't all brazilian's or professional scouts (disclaimer).

But the YouTube clips show he has Massive pace, very good feet/reactions and if you hadn't noticed doesn't go down easy at all. Looks like he could play in the middle quite well. Has all the attributes.

Being an effective centre mid isn't about strength and stature, it's your placement of the ball, your body and then your technical ability (scholes, Modric, Silva, Iniesta, xavi). He turns people for fun with his back to them by the looks of it.
 
I don't see why everyone is saying that Anderson is rubbish. He has been plagued by injury and asked to play in a team set up to play with Carricks style of midfield distribution.

With a more dynamic central 2 or 3 players he looks good. Not every player is capable of playing in a very alien way to their normal tempo and style. Ask Carrick to try and play like Silva or Modric and he would look absolutely dire, we don't say that he's rubbish for that reason though.

I think Fergie is a little reticent to spend too much money on a central midfielder this season because of the options we currently have.

Cleverly, Carrick, Scholes, Giggs, Jones, Kagawa and Anderson all potentially to fill 2 spots. He will have promised Scholes a certain number of games in his last season, he wants Cleverley to develop, Giggs will be bit part but perhaps last season, Jones still hasn't been assigned his final position so Fergie will want to give him a go and finally Carrick is just his guilty pleasure. Anderson will play a fair bit if he is fit.

Next season we will have to get a new CM but we are in limbo at the moment. Plenty of cover and a fair bit of potential but also quite a large chance that we are left with few good options should we get a couple of injuries.
 
The thing is you've included Jones who is a defender (and considering the number of defenders we have and the fact that they all seem to be injured a lot I ******* hope he is being considered as a defender!) Then you have two players who are in their final year (and Giggs is not a central midfielder anyway, not as part of a central 2 anyway) and Kagawa (who we're still not sure where he'll play) so it's deceptive how many we have.
 
anderson has had his chance at united,when he is 32 and still playing at united we will still be saying maybe this season will be his season,just offload him already fergie
 
The thing is you've included Jones who is a defender (and considering the number of defenders we have and the fact that they all seem to be injured a lot I ******* hope he is being considered as a defender!) Then you have two players who are in their final year (and Giggs is not a central midfielder anyway, not as part of a central 2 anyway) and Kagawa (who we're still not sure where he'll play) so it's deceptive how many we have.

Thats my point.

If we sign a first choice central midfielder, who will play with him.

Giggs won't want to sit there and only play 5-10 games.
Scholes will only have signed for another year on the promise of 30 odd games.
Cleverley looks very promising but needs as much game time as possible.
Carrick is Fergies golden boy so will play plenty of games.
Kagawa looks like exactly what we need but again, he should be getting regular game time.
Anderson should be given this season to prove what he can do when he is fit and given a run in the team.
Jones has been told that Fergie doesn't know where he will end up and to find out, he needs game time in both positions. I don't agree with him as a CM but its only Sir Alex that makes the decisions.

We already have plenty of potentially good enough players so who would give way? I think that this season will be quite experimental with the players we have in the middle then we will look at it again when Scholes and Giggs are gone and we have a better handle on the capabilities of Cleverley and Anderson.
 
There's a huge difference between playing in a position and excelling in it.

Could Ronaldo play central midfield? Yeah probably. Would he be any good at it? No he'd be useless. Could Kompany play up front? Yeah probably. Would he actually score as many goals up front as say Aguero? Of course he wouldn't

Jeez some of the stuff you come out with

Because I said Aguero and Kompany should switch, didn't i, well done.

Actually I pointed out players generally speaking suit certain roles, but don't bother reading that part. An attacking player that is great in every aspect of attacking, can play every attacking role, its as simple as that.

That is why Aguero has played from wide and from upfront, and he has played in different ways, taking the ball to goal on his own isolated(and been excellent) held it up waiting for support, and playing from wide providing that support very well.

As for if a player can excel in any position, yes that is the point, the best players CAN, that is why Messi is awesome from either wing or starting as a striker, or playing from behind a striker in the middle. Fabregas looks great wide, upfront, any position in central midfield, he excelled in all of those roles. He just won his third international tournament, Fabregas got his 3rd assist in a final, 3 in a row, playing in a completely different position, in which he was completely excellent and before this season hasn't played as a striker properly before.

Kompany, was the worst example you could have come up with because I've seen him play fullback, play in midfield excellently and was considered more of a DM when he was bought and started at City mostly in midfield. He's very versatile, and looks pretty damn good when he runs forwards, and scores good goals. That's the point, he's MORE suited to a defensive role and he excels in ALL defensive roles, but he's still pretty good when he does run forwards.

If one player is the worlds best at right wing, and a not as good but brilliant central midfielder, and another player sucks in the middle and is very good on the right but not as good as the first guy, where do you play both?

Firstly you don't know that Moura is best on the wing, because he might become better elsewhere, secondly he might already be a much better central midfielder but in the team he plays in, the TEAM is better with him playing wide.

This is the point, most great players can indeed play most roles, most players pick defence/offence pretty early on and specialise.

As I pointed out, almost everyone in your offence can play in multiple roles, and HAVE played in multiple roles. Carrick, who has been essentially a sitting/holding midfield for years at Utd, joined Utd as an attacking creative central midfielder.

If Moura can be a better central midfielder than you can buy, and you lack central midfielders, he'd still be a massive improvement to your weakest area on the team, buying the worlds best winger to replace the second best winger in the world wouldn't improve any team much at all.

Lastly, if Ronaldo played in central midfield, he'd be brilliant at it, you know why, because he's a brilliant player. Remember how no one thought Beckham could play in central midfield, then he made it his new position and won titles playing there?
 
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There used to be left midfield, then there was left midfielder, attacking left midfielder, now we've added wide striker, and somehow people want to pretend this is a completely different position to their right hand versions as well. It's like people want a new name depending on the square metre of pitch you spend the most time in. Get over it people. If Moura is good enough there won't be an attacking position he wouldn't be capable of playing in.

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Much as I dont want to shoot you down in flames, I'm going to anyway.

Attacking midfielder, inside forward, winger and Left midfield are all separate positions and have been since the 1860's when association football was formed.

Some of the positions have fallen away or become less popular simply because of fashions of play at any given time.

Winger and inside forward are NOT the same position for instance.

Valencia = Winger.
Nani, Ronaldo, Young= Inside forwards.

Nobody plays 3-2-5 anymore, but it doesnt mean it never existed as a formation.

A 4-3-3 is NOT played with wingers, thats a 4-5-1 a 4-3-3 with the correct personnel is played with a central striker and two inside forwards, with three "half backs" in the midfield.

Ronaldo was and is fairly ineffective as a winger, as an Inside forward he is devastating.
 
What's happened with Hamsik this summer? I thought he'd be moving to a bigger club.

With Lavezzi leaving and Cavani likely to go to AC Milan, I think Napoli are going to try and keep ahold of Hamsik.

Napoli without Lavezzi, Cavani and Hamsik will go back to a mid table team, maybe fighting for relegation.
 
Much as I dont want to shoot you down in flames, I'm going to anyway.

Attacking midfielder, inside forward, winger and Left midfield are all separate positions and have been since the 1860's when association football was formed.

Some of the positions have fallen away or become less popular simply because of fashions of play at any given time.

Winger and inside forward are NOT the same position for instance.

Valencia = Winger.
Nani, Ronaldo, Young= Inside forwards.

Nobody plays 3-2-5 anymore, but it doesnt mean it never existed as a formation.

A 4-3-3 is NOT played with wingers, thats a 4-5-1 a 4-3-3 with the correct personnel is played with a central striker and two inside forwards, with three "half backs" in the midfield.

Ronaldo was and is fairly ineffective as a winger, as an Inside forward he is devastating.

I get the impression that DM is mistaking the ability of very good players to adapt to other areas as an interchangeability of position. Ronaldo is good enough that he will be fine pretty much wherever he plays but there is no point putting an £80 million pound player in a position where he is no better than a £25 million player.
 
Fergie buys anything but a CM, fans all over the place "owners not giving him money"

Going by his recent transfer activity, Man Utd actually do have the money? but aren't exactly spending it on players which are going to improve the first team?

Seems like a case of loading the squad again, WE'VE GOT AN AWESOME SQUAD.. play dodgy looking lineups in europe and fall flat on ur face again?

Similar case last season, did they actually need Jones and Young? whom they spent ridiculous money on, sometimes you've got to question Fergie's transfer dealings. He's improving the squad at the expense of the first team.

Kagawa is a good buy, aslong as he ditches the 442 formation.
Still lacking a top class CM though, without one they're not getting anywhere in Europe.
 
Fergie buys anything but a CM, fans all over the place "owners not giving him money"

I remember when we lost to city 1-0 and Mancini brought on De Jong, Milner and Richards to close the game out. The only defenisive player we had on the bench was Rafael , if you could even call him a defensive minded player.

That just shows how weak UTD's squad is in some areas.

Our bench for that game was an all out attack. No plan B.


40 Amos
21 Rafael
18 Young
25 Valencia
09 Berbatov
14 Hernandez
19 Welbeck


When I saw City's bench I know the only way we would win is by 2 or 3 goals. As soon as they scored, I knew it was over. Mancini is so Italian.


30 Pantilimon
02 Richards
13 Kolarov
07 Milner
34 De Jong
10 Dzeko
45 Balotelli


and guess it looks like another transfer window where Fergie buys nothing but attack. Carrick is going to have to put on the best season of his life. Its all down to him this season to cover our back 4.
 
Fergie buys anything but a CM, fans all over the place "owners not giving him money"

Going by his recent transfer activity, Man Utd actually do have the money? but aren't exactly spending it on players which are going to improve the first team?

Seems like a case of loading the squad again, WE'VE GOT AN AWESOME SQUAD.. play dodgy looking lineups in europe and fall flat on ur face again?

Similar case last season, did they actually need Jones and Young? whom they spent ridiculous money on, sometimes you've got to question Fergie's transfer dealings. He's improving the squad at the expense of the first team.

Kagawa is a good buy, aslong as he ditches the 442 formation.
Still lacking a top class CM though, without one they're not getting anywhere in Europe.

Jones was going to be snapped up by someone else if we didn't. It was a case of "young talented english CB" and Rio and Vidic are coming towards the end of their reign. Young was for some cover. Look at the wings and who would we play there?

Valencia and Nani? Fine until one is injured or needs a rest. Park and Giggs as backup? No thanks honestly. We didn't have a huge amount of backup last season and its only the return of a few long term injuries coupled with Kagawa and Powell that has made us look rather top heavy currently.

I think we can handle this season without another CM as long as we can keep our main boys fit. Next season will be crunch time in that position.

As with a lot of young players, the key is to be their first big money move. You won't get many top top 23-27 year olds that are floating around the transfer market waiting for a big club to pick them up.
 
Vidic won't start the season, Smalling is out and now Evan's is struggling in training. That leaves an aging Rio, Jones who doesn't know his posistion and Evra/Rafael who don't like to defend.

Everton is our first game and they pretty much cost us the title last season. Manly down to our poor defensive showing. Rafael being the main culprit.

I hope SAF has something up his sleave.
 
I get the impression that DM is mistaking the ability of very good players to adapt to other areas as an interchangeability of position. Ronaldo is good enough that he will be fine pretty much wherever he plays but there is no point putting an £80 million pound player in a position where he is no better than a £25 million player.

That's quite apt, as Ronaldo was bought and paid for as a £80mil right winger.... who now plays on the left because its better for the team..... so that a 25million player who isn't as good can play on the right... he was of course around 25mil euro's so not quite the £25mil you said but close enough.

As for interchangability of position, firstly they are, secondly I didn't at any stage say that players wouldn't be better in specific roles, strengths in someones games tend to suit specific roles. As I said, GREAT players tend to be able to play anywhere, because great players are pretty damn good at everything.

I didn't say EVERY player can play ANYWHERE, at all, nothing even close. I said the best players can, if you're going for a £27million teenager.... here's a hint, I've never seen a manager buy anyone for £27million they didn't think was a great player.

As for the line in the other post that Ronaldo is fairly ineffective as a winger but devastating as an inside forward I really can't help but contain my laughter.

What specifically makes Ronaldo poor as a winger but great as an inside forwards, and Valencia a great winger.

Some player like to cut in more often, some players like to shoot more often, some like to cross more often, do we need a word for every type of player, where are the cut off's, if you shoot 64% of the time you're an inside forward, if you cross from the 69% of the time you're a winger, if you go 50/50 we'll make up a new word for it?

Here is what I expect a left sided player to do, get back and defend sometimes, get the ball up the field, run with the ball, cross, pass, shoot, throughballs, make runs into the box. Now, Young and Ronaldo both do these things, Valencia does the same list of things, but on the right.

A left back would do most of the same things but focus on defence and do the attacking parts much less often and in a more supportive role than direct.

What is this "key" thing that Valencia does that Ronaldo never does, and Ronaldo does that Valencia never does, that makes the positions entirely different?

Should we ignore the Utd fans who said valencia did a great job at Right back when he filled in? Or should we pretend that never happend, what about the fans that said Rooney did a great job in central midfield? Carrick at centre back, Fletcher at left back, right back, centre back, central midfield, right wing? no..... Rafael and HIS TWIN play the same position on opposite sides but the job is entirely different? There is no interchangability and great players can't play anywhere, but half of Utd's squad has played in mulitple positions successfully, and Valencia and Ronaldo did completely different jobs requiring completely different names, despite doing all the same duties and playing in the same area of the pitch?

Oh and you don't buy an 80mil player to not play in his best position...... except for of course that is exactly what happened. Real have also switched where Ramos plays, changed where Marcelo plays(and he plays left wing of left back with completely different types of play).
 
There is a borderline in terms of what you would think is a good signing.
I see some values on players, like Moura for instance. To me it's a lot of money. He's a good player, but £26m?
In this Moura deal, I bet Man.U. pay the agent £6m.
Why don't Man.U. just play some of their 18yr olds, after all it's their history & no other clubs can do that.

Sometimes I don't know whether to puke or cringe at the drivel Fergie comes out with.
 
Because I said Aguero and Kompany should switch, didn't i, well done.

Didn't say you did did I?, well done.

tbh when they very first line of your retort clearly misses the point by a good 90 degree's forgive me for not having the effort to read the rest of your post (I doubt I missed much)
 
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