Scottish independence referendum deal agreed.

[Stretch]

I'd vote no, I am half English but my Dad is Scottish and I was born in Aberdeen. So would all my Scottish Family (Edinburgh based).

Seem's a populist move based on a load of rubbish.........

Unfortunately only 'Scottish' people are allowed to vote on the destruction of a country which if the SNP are to be believe would see people based both sides of the boarder live in a brand new country.

 

[Strife212]

Scotland does not 'belong' to the United Kingdom.

Yes it does, England belongs to the United Kingdom as well.

 

[Biohazard]

£13bn overspend? I'm confused by your logic.

Scotland contributes more in tax than is spent. It is a net beneficiary to the UK treasury, if only by a fraction of the UK mean.

 

[Biohazard]

Yes it does, England belongs to the United Kingdom as well.

So the two are the same?

 

[touch]

That's a complete assumption. And one that I believe is completely wrong. The UK will still exist a it dose now, albeit without Scotland.

The United Kingdom will not exist as it does now if Scotland leaves.
There will most likely still be a union between England, Wales and NI. It will most likely still be called the "United Kingdom". But it will not be the same entity that joined the EU.
If you look up "United Kingdom" on the EU website, you'll see it's defined as a union between Scotland, England, Wales and NI. If no such union exists anymore, then it's conceivable that both Scotland and the (new) UK would both have to reapply.

 

[Tefal]

The UK federalises, the monetary framework remains the fiscal structure changes. Foreign affairs and defence remain. That is the snapshot.

I'd imagine that would have to be put to a vote as giving a foreign country such massive influence over the pound sterling would be a huge risk to the united kingdom.

Something that i think was part of the argument against joining the euro and something that proved very true.

I'm not too fused if Scotland stays or leaves, I'd rather they stay just because it's simpler, but if they leave then I don't think we should exactly be accepting large risks just to make things simpler for them.

Especially when his is being pushed through as the scots wanting to be independent then i think it's only fair we get to be independent and equal nationalistic by telling them to sod off and start their own currency or join someone elses.

 

[Strife212]

So the two are the same?

If England became independent and the other countries were still in Union, then sure.

 

[Strife212]

Also there is precedent, when a state is split up there is only one successor, ie, USSR > Russia on the security council.

 

[Tefal]

The United Kingdom will not exist as it does now if Scotland leaves.
There will most likely still be a union between England, Wales and NI. It will most likely still be called the "United Kingdom". But it will not be the same entity that joined the EU.
If you look up "United Kingdom" on the EU website, you'll see it's defined as a union between Scotland, England, Wales and NI. If no such union exists anymore, then it's conceivable that both Scotland and the (new) UK would both have to reapply.

lets face it though that's not going top happen.

If that happens then the EU has signed it's own death warrant. with England/the uk remaining as one of the largest contributors (and dwarfing what Scotland would bring) the EU will be trying to keep the uk in rather than handing it an instant out clause, the new Scotland however being much smaller is a far easier target to force to follow their rules.

iirc the Eu cannot survive without the UK/France/german contributions if one leaves the resat are ****ed financially.(more so)

 

[Biohazard]

That's a complete assumption. And one that I believe is completely wrong. The UK will still exist a it dose now, albeit without Scotland. Scotlands status however is far from assured. If only because the eu will want to get what it wants from Scotland

It cannot.

It was created by two equal partners, two parliaments, and if any partner remains the partnership is ended. Either they both leave as successor states, or they both become new states.

 

[Tefal]

No, no UK citizenship as we know it.

Scottish and rUK. But, if you live in Scotland at the time irrespective of where you come from you will be granted citizenship.

There will be seperate tax jurisictions yes.

It's already started with Revenue Scotland in certain respects.

So all scots in England will have to register as immigrants?

 

[Biohazard]

Also there is precedent, when a state is split up there is only one successor, ie, USSR > Russia on the security council.

How is the UNSC a precedent for the EU?

 

[RoboCod]

The United Kingdom will not exist as it does now if Scotland leaves.
There will most likely still be a union between England, Wales and NI. It will most likely still be called the "United Kingdom". But it will not be the same entity that joined the EU.
If you look up "United Kingdom" on the EU website, you'll see it's defined as a union between Scotland, England, Wales and NI. If no such union exists anymore, then it's conceivable that both Scotland and the (new) UK would both have to reapply.

If that were the case (which I highly suspect it is not) then I would demand I have a right to vote in the referendum.

 

[Biohazard]

So all scots in England will have to register as immigrants?

Immigrants? Citizens more likely.

 

[Biohazard]

If that were the case (which I highly suspect it is not) then I would demand I have a right to vote in the referendum.

Too late buddy. Better luck next time.

Oh, and it is the case.

 

[Tefal]

Immigrants? Citizens more likely.

well they're foreigners living in a country (which by your reasoning will be a new country and their UK citizenship will be meaningless) that is not thiers.

So yes immigrants unless the government choose otherwise.

 

[Biohazard]

If England became independent and the other countries were still in Union, then sure.

No. The Union is built on and between Scotland and England as equal partners. Yeah? If either goes, there is no Union.

Simples. Get it?

 

[Tefal]

How is the UNSC a precedent for the EU?

both required only one of the disbanded states to remain a functioning entity?

 

[touch]

Also there is precedent, when a state is split up there is only one successor, ie, USSR > Russia on the security council.

There is precedent that could be used for pretty much every option:

- One new state, one successor: Pakistan split away from India

- Equal successors of the union: United Arab Republic split into Syria + Egypt

- Two new states: Czechoslovakia split into Slovakia + Czech Republic

 

[Stretch]

The United Kingdom will not exist as it does now if Scotland leaves.
There will most likely still be a union between England, Wales and NI. It will most likely still be called the "United Kingdom". But it will not be the same entity that joined the EU.
If you look up "United Kingdom" on the EU website, you'll see it's defined as a union between Scotland, England, Wales and NI. If no such union exists anymore, then it's conceivable that both Scotland and the (new) UK would both have to reapply.

It will be the same entity without Scotland. Just as it was after Ireland left the union. Ireland became a new state.

Besides, there's many in rest of the uk that would jump at the chance to 'reapply' because we could renegotiate a better deal as we have done before. This is one of the key benefit of the union. Power at the negotiating table. It can't be underestimated.