Mortgage rant !!!

nutcase_1uk said:
From what I can tell the reason lenders charge extra on BTL/LTB mortgages is this:

Oh so you're going to make some money out of the property? We'll have some of that thank you.
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EXACTAMUNDO!!!!
My thoughts precisely. As long as I pay the mortgage they shouldn't/wouldn't care who lives there or even if its empty.
 
Banzai_Joe said:
EXACTAMUNDO!!!!
My thoughts precisely. As long as I pay the mortgage they shouldn't/wouldn't care who lives there or even if its empty.
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No they charge more since you are a higher risk due to having to pay for 2 properties. What if you can't get tenants or the tenants leave? There is a possibility that you would not be able to pay 2 mortgages with your own money and are reliant on the rent to pay for the rented property.

You shouldn't lie about it to the bank either since there is a clause about that in the mortgage contract and it might be fraud. I don't know how they would ever find out though, and I am sure there are many people doing this, but I wouldn't.
 
I believe that NBS (Nationwide) are no longer taking on new BTL, and if they are at very prohibitive costs, basically they don't want them on their books. As soon as they found out you were BTLing they wanted to drop you like a very hot potato.

Oh and not declaring you are BTLing is technically mortgage fraud, I hope you have proper insurance as well?
 
Just don't tell them it's rented, as long as you have enough income/savings to cover the house if it was to sit empty for 3 months.

They wouldn't find out, well not unless you already have talked to the bank about changing the mortgage on your rented house..
 
vargojones said:
This is a REALLY bad idea.
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Honestly, how many people have you ever heard of being done for mortgage fraud for simply not declaring the property is rented, as long as the insurance is correct and you maintain it ie gas and electricity checks yearly.

I work for a housing association, speaking to the legal department I have had this conversation with afew of them and the general consensus was that even if you were caught (somehow) as long as you were playing by the rules on all other counts (you would be) and not endangering the tenants then at worst you'd have to rearrange the mortgage with a clause.

The only way I can see you'd be caught is if you defaulted on payments meaning someone would be round the house and unsuspecting tenants were to grass you up (unknowingly) or someone simply goes into the bank and tell them.

The right thing to do is get the correct mortgage, however if you can afford it then as long as the mortgage is paid surely that's better then bankruptcy.
 
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Banzai_Joe said:
Aaagghhh......***** at Nationwide.

Long(ish) version:
deal comes to an end this month, Nationwide offer me a better rate as a current customer, so i cancel an existing application with Snatch West (which was half way through).
Today when it comes to sorting the new deal they say, "because you're letting your property out, you cannot have any of these deals!"
The retards KNEW i was letting my house out, its all on record, but they decide to tell me now, not when i first applied, so i now have to find another lender and go through the whole crappy application process due to some jobsworth not doing their bloody job!!!
We'd planned on this new deal as it was really good and i don't think any other lender comes close. But cos i'm letting out, i get shafted.
They can NEVER give me a decent reason when i ask "what difference does it make who lives there, as long as i pay the mortage?"......useless.

The prats don't realise that what some ball-juggling idiot on the phone says can have a big impact on the customer on the other end. They can just shrug it off!!!! :mad:


Short version; told me one thing last month, now tell me another and have shafted me.

Rant over....but still fuming btw.....
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Every normal mortgage lender will not lend on a rental property, and not telling them amounts to mortgage fraud..... Just so you know, a lot don't tell them though, and you have to have all your post going to that address.

If you already have a mortgage and decide to let your house out most, if not all will hit you with either a flat fee a year, or hike your rate, with some being VERY expensive. My mortgage lender would ask for £1200+ a year for instance.

Buy to let mortgages usually are around 70-75 LTV, with large arrangement fees.

Demons UK said:
Just don't tell them it's rented, as long as you have enough income/savings to cover the house if it was to sit empty for 3 months.

They wouldn't find out, well not unless you already have talked to the bank about changing the mortgage on your rented house..
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Insurance policies and Mortgages are linked.... Wouldn't want to risk having landlords insurance on a normal retail mortgage....
 
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Demons UK said:
Honestly, how many people have you ever heard of being done for mortgage fraud for simply not declaring the property is rented, as long as the insurance is correct and you maintain it ie gas and electricity checks yearly.

I work for a housing association, speaking to the legal department I have had this conversation with afew of them and the general consensus was that even if you were caught (somehow) as long as you were playing by the rules on all other counts (you would be) and not endangering the tenants then at worst you'd have to rearrange the mortgage with a clause.

The only way I can see you'd be caught is if you defaulted on payments meaning someone would be round the house and unsuspecting tenants were to grass you up (unknowingly) or someone simply goes into the bank and tell them.

The right thing to do is get the correct mortgage, however if you can afford it then as long as the mortgage is paid surely that's better then bankruptcy.
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I had originally written a long post, but essentially i can sum it up here: you're wrong.
 
vargojones said:
I had originally written a long post, but essentially i can sum it up here: you're wrong.
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:p I never said I was right.

It's all about being found out and if it's possible, yes it's more then possible and will you get found out, unlikely.

Would I do it? No, I'd stump up for the correct mortgage.
 
kitch9 said:
Insurance policies and Mortgages are linked.... Wouldn't want to risk having landlords insurance on a normal retail mortgage....
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Not sure that's true. I changed my insurance over to landlords and wasn't quizzed by AXA as to why or what and i don't as yet have a BLT mortgage.
 
FutileBreadMachine said:
No they charge more since you are a higher risk due to having to pay for 2 properties. What if you can't get tenants or the tenants leave? There is a possibility that you would not be able to pay 2 mortgages with your own money and are reliant on the rent to pay for the rented property.
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I don't have 2 mortgages, i simply moved in with my then financee, (now wife) and rented mine out.

What sense would it make to give me a more expensive mortgage if they're unsure i can pay (for two)? The higher risk comes when they hike the price to something i can't afford surely?

You shouldn't lie about it to the bank either since there is a clause about that in the mortgage contract and it might be fraud. I don't know how they would ever find out though, and I am sure there are many people doing this, but I wouldn't.
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I never intended to lie, and i haven't but i was told point blank that i "needn't declare that it would be rented out" by a natwest advisor.
When i told nationwide this, they didn't refute it or argue that it wasn't correct, which led me to believe that nationwide were just trying to get in on any profit being made. There isn't any as i'm renting for less than the mortgage payment.
I feel like by doing things the correct (honest) way that i've ended up being shafted.
If i'd have just rented it out and not told anyone, but just changed the insurance as countless people do then i don't think i'd have had any flippin trouble.
 
Banzai_Joe said:
stuff
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I think the rate hike is so that if you end up not being able to pay them they have made some money off of you before they have to repossess and sell the property. I don't know for certain, I'm just applying some logic, so I could be talking rubbish.

I didn't mean to imply you were lying, I was just warning against the advice of some other posters who said you should say you are living there, since if you did that it would be fraud.

Like I said, I think many people don't tell their bank that they are renting out a property, and they get away with it, but personally I'm a straight shooter and am always honest (perhaps too honest :p).
 
S'okay, i wasn't implying that you were implying....yadda yadda.. :)
My wife is a bloody civil servant and works for revenue and customs. I can't even do a foreigner to make extra money without her wanting me to declare it.
Sometimes i despair.
btw, i registered for self-assessment quite a while ago.....because i'm letting the house out, so i've (well the mrs at least) always been of the mind to do it properly, but it seems that you just get shafted for doing so.
 
Banzai_Joe said:
S'okay, i wasn't implying that you were implying....yadda yadda.. :)
My wife is a bloody civil servant and works for revenue and customs. I can't even do a foreigner to make extra money without her wanting me to declare it.
Sometimes i despair.
btw, i registered for self-assessment quite a while ago.....because i'm letting the house out, so i've (well the mrs at least) always been of the mind to do it properly, but it seems that you just get shafted for doing so.
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Coincidentally I have been nagging my wife to fill out a form for Self Assessment registration since she gets income from my company via dividends, and if it's above £10K/year you are supposed to declare it. I don't know how they would ever know she was receiving the money though. Have to get the SA done by 31 Jan 2013.
 
vargojones said:
I believe that NBS (Nationwide) are no longer taking on new BTL, and if they are at very prohibitive costs, basically they don't want them on their books. As soon as they found out you were BTLing they wanted to drop you like a very hot potato.

Oh and not declaring you are BTLing is technically mortgage fraud, I hope you have proper insurance as well?
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Nationwide are the second most active BTL lender in the country (possibly becoming the biggest new BTL lender currently), via their subsidary compmany TMW, so unsure where you get this from.


Joe - BTL always costs more, just down to the nature of the product. What is the value of the house, outstanding mortgage and amount of rent you receive?
 
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BDEE said:
Joe - BTL always costs more, just down to the nature of the product. What is the value of the house, outstanding mortgage and amount of rent you receive?
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House value = £93k
Outstanding Mortgage = £69,400
Rent £450

On paper it looks like my rent will easily cover the mortgage, but i'm trying to reduce the term from 18 years down to 15, add to that the fact that a BTL are typically 1.5% higher than standard mortgages, it's gonna cost me quite a bit more than 'expected'.

In reality its the expected rate we had in mind that is now not going to happen due to nationwide ballsing up that galls me. We now have to rethink our finances to the tune of approx £100 per month.
 
Banzai_Joe said:
Aaagghhh......***** at Nationwide.

Long(ish) version:
deal comes to an end this month, Nationwide offer me a better rate as a current customer, so i cancel an existing application with Snatch West (which was half way through).
Today when it comes to sorting the new deal they say, "because you're letting your property out, you cannot have any of these deals!"
The retards KNEW i was letting my house out, its all on record, but they decide to tell me now, not when i first applied, so i now have to find another lender and go through the whole crappy application process due to some jobsworth not doing their bloody job!!!
We'd planned on this new deal as it was really good and i don't think any other lender comes close. But cos i'm letting out, i get shafted.
They can NEVER give me a decent reason when i ask "what difference does it make who lives there, as long as i pay the mortage?"......useless.

The prats don't realise that what some ball-juggling idiot on the phone says can have a big impact on the customer on the other end. They can just shrug it off!!!! :mad:


Short version; told me one thing last month, now tell me another and have shafted me.

Rant over....but still fuming btw.....
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Having worked for Nationwide for a number of years previously I would suggest this:-

1. Call them, explain you have moved back into the home.
2. If they don't play ball tell them you are not being treated fairly and would like to make a complaint. They way it works in Nationwide is the person who is on the phone has to deal with the complaint. Employees are encouraged to resolve the complaint within 2 working days so its classed as 'feedback' and it does not have to be officially logged with the FSA.
 
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