Busted :(

RoyMi6 · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:28

Bit more to it than the title might suggest but willing to pay my dues, just not happy as how it came about.

500 miles of driving over the last week, and I'm one of those drivers that fairly rigidly sticks to the speed limit and drives with conditions, but got caught out the one time (about 200m of driving) that I'm over the speed limit.

More annoyingly is I feel tricked into doing it!

Was on some windy roads in the boarders (where I'm aware speed camera are plentiful) and was stuck behind someone doing 30 round all the bends and 70 odd on the straights (managing to pull away from me doing 60)

Infuriating and dangerous to drive behind so I keep my distance and take my time - no rush.

However, at one point I find myself sitting behind him doing 40 (with a 60 speed limit) with plenty of visibility so decide to make a pass. However, as more experienced drivers might realise (and I'll be more wary of in the future) this is just an opening for him to give me a wee race and stop me over taking.

Split second decision to back off (and put up with more of his nonsense) or carry on trying to pass him I decide on the latter only to pull back in front of him and get snapped by a GATSO.

I wasn't aware of it's presence before I made the move and it was only when I was having to speed up more than I felt comfortable with that I spotted it. Once in front, with hindsight, I maybe should have slammed on the breaks but at the time I wasn't willing to break hard with someone so close behind me.

So yeah, annoying as I reckon I was probably doing about 65 (had let off once I passed the other car) through the camera.

Suppose I better hold on to my Christmas money to pay some fines and cover the increase in my insurance then

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:31

What was the limit? A camera won't flash at 65 in a 60

If someone speeds up/tries to race when you overtake you should pull back in behind - you're responsible for creating a safe gap around your car, if you're behind him you can be in control of that.

It's your mistake, the other guy was being a **** but its still your own doing, so lesson learned and move on

Slam62 · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:32

Unlucky, totally understand, sounds like the other guy was an arse.

Matt82 · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:34

if you were on the wrong side of the road overtaking when it flashed youll be fine, i highly doubt theyd have markings on the wrong side of the road too

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:35

Matt82 said:
if you were on the wrong side of the road overtaking when it flashed youll be fine, i highly doubt theyd have markings on the wrong side of the road too

Huh?

RoyMi6 · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:39

iaind said:
What was the limit? A camera won't flash at 65 in a 60

Limit was 60. He was doing 40, dropped a gear and signaled to pass, got up to 60 and he was sitting level with me before I hit ~70 to move in front.

Once I was I was in front and back in the left hand lane I took my foot off the accelerator but didn't break so was still doing ~65 through the markings and saw it flash.

Actual speed could have been more like 67, 68 - was looking more at the road rather than my speedo.

iaind said:
If someone speeds up/tries to race when you overtake you should pull back in behind - you're responsible for creating a safe gap around your car, if you're behind him you can be in control of that.

It's your mistake, the other guy was being a **** but its still your own doing, so lesson learned and move on

Yeah, first time I've had to make that decision but annoying to get it wrong. I'm a calm driver so could have sat behind him all the way if I had given it any thought.

Matt82 said:
if you were on the wrong side of the road overtaking when it flashed youll be fine, i highly doubt theyd have markings on the wrong side of the road too

Was back on the correct side of the road. It was apparent he'd backed off once he'd made me gun it* so had managed to pull back over into left hand lane.

*For reference I'm in a stock MX5 MK2 1.8 - by "gun it" I mean "putter along a bit faster"

Dabbles · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:44

Sadly they don't do a camera that catches the ****s who put their foot down when someone tries to overtake them.....

RoyMi6 · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:57

Dabbles said:
Sadly they don't do a camera that catches the ****s who put their foot down when someone tries to overtake them.....

Well, considering investing in a dash mounted camera after this. On the way back I had the excitement of having to go on the side of the road to avoid someone over taking on a blind corner! That's another story though and no repercussions for myself

cheechm · 2 Jan 2013 at 19:59

Fixed penalty threshold for 40mph is 66mph, so fingers crossed you weren't over that. Over that and you will most likely go to court.

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:00

cheechm said:
Fixed penalty threshold for 40mph is 66mph, so fingers crossed you weren't over that. Over that and you will most likely go to court.

There is no standard threshold

Rybo89 · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:08

Sorry... but lol! Unlucky.

I would be F'in and blinding all the way home, feeling like a right nobhead

Steve2000 · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:21

cheechm said:
Fixed penalty threshold for 40mph is 66mph, so fingers crossed you weren't over that. Over that and you will most likely go to court.

The limit was 60 MPH.

Buckster · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:25

perhaps he knew where the camera was ...... and was goading you ..

cheechm · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:38

iaind said:
There is no standard threshold

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/p_to_r/road_traffic_offences_guidance_on_fixed_penalty_notices/#speed

...

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 20:39

cheechm said:
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/p_to_r/road_traffic_offences_guidance_on_fixed_penalty_notices/#speed

...

The Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) has issued speed enforcement policy guidance, which suggests that enforcement will normally occur when a driver exceeds the speed limit by a particular margin

...

It even says

Note that these are guidelines and that a police officer has discretion to act outside of them providing he acts fairly, consistently and proportionately.

And that's when you're stopped by an officer.

So, as I said, there is no standard threshold

Burnsy2023 · 2 Jan 2013 at 21:07

iaind said:
...

It even says

And that's when you're stopped by an officer.

So, as I said, there is no standard threshold

But fixed cameras nearly always follow national guidance, so in this case, taking that as a rule of thumb probably will be on the money.

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 21:10

Burnsy2023 said:
But fixed cameras nearly always follow national guidance, so in this case, taking that as a rule of thumb probably will be on the money.

I thought it was discretionary and up to the local authority, which results I'm quite a lot of variation? I'll bow to your superior knowledge though

Burnsy2023 · 2 Jan 2013 at 21:14

iaind said:
I thought it was discretionary and up to the local authority, which results I'm quite a lot of variation? I'll bow to your superior knowledge though

TBH, my knowledge isn't that much better here, but I know all of Hampshire's neighbouring forces act on the NPIA/ACPO guidance. I'd say that I'd expect this to be be very similar throughout England and Wales but I can't comment on the crazy scots. I'd expect most to follow guidance to prevent challenging of tickets that are more difficult to prove (hence why the guidance exists).

iaind · 2 Jan 2013 at 21:18

Burnsy2023 said:
TBH, my knowledge isn't that much better here, but I know all of Hampshire's neighbouring forces act on the NPIA/ACPO guidance. I'd say that I'd expect this to be be very similar throughout England and Wales but I can't comment on the crazy scots. I'd expect most to follow guidance to prevent challenging of tickets that are more difficult to prove (hence why the guidance exists).

I've just heard about people getting fixed penalties for speeds lower than the posted guidance, might have been from mobile cameras though but don't know why they'd follow different guidance for that

Do the cameras get triggered at speeds lower than the intended prosecution threshold to give some discretion manually?

cheechm · 2 Jan 2013 at 21:21

iaind said:
I've just heard about people getting fixed penalties for speeds lower than the posted guidance, might have been from mobile cameras though but don't know why they'd follow different guidance for that

Do the cameras get triggered at speeds lower than the intended prosecution threshold to give some discretion manually?

The threshold is the maximum rather than minimum. You can be done for speeding at 1mph above the limit.