Is the copyright industry shooting itself in the foot?

The big difference is if you shoplift something then you deplete the stock from the store, if a store only had 10CDs from one artist and they were all stolen then they can no longer sell them (as they are gone), if 10 people downloaded the CDs above, they are still there in the store for someone else to buy. If those 10 people who downloaded them ended up with 2-3 of them buying the proper cds then its a win/win situation since they might not have purchased them at all without piracy.

I wouldn't steal a car, but I would download one if I could.
 
[DOD]Asprilla;23522919 said:
But you still deprive someone of recompense for the effort and skill they have put into creating that art.

For me that's not justifiable.
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Do you have the same opinion of going to see tribute bands?

How about borrowing CDs/DVDs/games from friends?
 
[DOD]Asprilla;23522919 said:
But you still deprive someone of recompense for the effort and skill they have put into creating that art.

For me that's not justifiable.
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No one is saying it is. We're just saying it isn't the same as stealing.

GBH isn't justifiable either, but that doesn't mean you can call it murder.
 
Pirating music has cost me a lot more money in the long term than before I ever downloaded music illegally. I started off using Audiogalaxy back in the day and it got me in to so many bands, this is when I was 16 or something at the time. Now through listening to these bands and finding new music I have spent a fortune on concerts, merch and also CD’s/Records. At that time I had a handful of CD’s and now I have just under 1000 CD’s and around 500 records.

Through downloading music I have bought and paid for so many concerts and go to about 20 – 30 gigs a year still and most of these bands I have heard through downloading music. At the gigs I will spend money on a t-shirt and possibly a CD. I now also have Spotify which I pay £10 a month or whatever it is for but it does not have everything and downloading and sharing music does mean a lot to smaller bands who are starting up. I know many bands who have been able to come over from the US to tour based on the fan’s they have got from their music being shared online.

With movies it’s simple, people are not willing to shell out the price of tickets to go see a movie these days. I used to go to the cinema a lot but at £9 - £10 a ticket these days it’s just not worth it and that’s why I have Netflix and also Love Film but again they don’t have everything. I have also been to see movies in the cinema because people have said to me “I watched it online but it’s really a movie you should see in the cinema”

I don’t think people take in to account the amount of good publicity that pirating gives your music/movie/TV Show.
 
Neutralmilk said:
Pirating music has cost me a lot more money in the long term than before I ever downloaded music illegally. I started off using Audiogalaxy back in the day and it got me in to so many bands, this is when I was 16 or something at the time. Now through listening to these bands and finding new music I have spent a fortune on concerts, merch and also CD’s/Records. At that time I had a handful of CD’s and now I have just under 1000 CD’s and around 500 records.

Through downloading music I have bought and paid for so many concerts and go to about 20 – 30 gigs a year still and most of these bands I have heard through downloading music. At the gigs I will spend money on a t-shirt and possibly a CD. I now also have Spotify which I pay £10 a month or whatever it is for but it does not have everything and downloading and sharing music does mean a lot to smaller bands who are starting up. I know many bands who have been able to come over from the US to tour based on the fan’s they have got from their music being shared online.

With movies it’s simple, people are not willing to shell out the price of tickets to go see a movie these days. I used to go to the cinema a lot but at £9 - £10 a ticket these days it’s just not worth it and that’s why I have Netflix and also Love Film but again they don’t have everything. I have also been to see movies in the cinema because people have said to me “I watched it online but it’s really a movie you should see in the cinema”

I don’t think people take in to account the amount of good publicity that pirating gives your music/movie/TV Show.
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But you're still a THIEF!!!!!11oneoneoneomg! :p

[DOD]Asprilla;23522997 said:
Do you think either are ok?
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That's irrelevant. Just because they both aren't ok, doesn't mean they are the same thing. Drink driving is also not "ok", the same with drug dealing, insurance fraud, mugging, people trafficking. None of those things are "ok", but we still don't decide to call them all murder :rolleyes:
 
Haggisman said:
Theft = taking
Copyright infringement = copying

One involves removing an item, the other involves duplicating an item. Is it really such a difficult concept to grasp?



See above.

While I don't agree that either of them are justifiable, arguing a point which is plain wrong simply shows that you don't know what you're talking about.
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I grasp what you are saying perfectly but what I mean by the end result is that the music is not paid for.
 
sid said:
agreed, do they seriously think that youtube videos are competition to hollywood movie industry?
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They can be, maybe not at the moment but it is totally possible. Look at FreddieW and Philip Defranco for instance (2 people I follow on youtube)

FreddieW does awesome short clips and has done a 6/7 episode show using kickstarter and some of his videos include some well known hollywood actors.

Philip Defranco started off as a small news segment where he reported on a few things that he felt mattered to him, this has now grown into him having 2 youtube channels with around 700k viewers each and a few companys under his belt including a production company.

Both started on youtube and both are doing what Hollywood types can do. It is possible and there are plenty out there doing it.
 
jas72 said:
I grasp what you are saying perfectly but what I mean by the end result is that the music is not paid for.
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The end result of copyright infringement is that the music is not paid for.

Theft also incorporates the element of permanent deprivation, which does not occur with copy infringement.

To use estebanrey's analogy:

GBH and murder both have the same end result of injury, however murder also has the end result of death, hence why they aren't classed as the same thing.
 
Haggisman said:
Do you have the same opinion of going to see tribute bands?
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As much as I'd like a copy of a tribute band album rather than the real thing.

How about borrowing CDs/DVDs/games from friends?
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There is such a thing as 'fair usage' you know. How about two friends? How about three friends? How long are we borrowing exactly?

There is an easy solution. Exclusive access to that particular copy.

Steam doesn't even allow that. You can't 'borrow' a game from someone, hell you can't even buy second hand copies from someone. That imo is just wrong. You don't own the game when you buy the game through Steam, you are just buying the right to play that game.
 
olivier renault said:
As much as I'd like a copy of a tribute band album rather than the real thing.
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By going to see a tribute band rather than the original band, you are stealing from the original band. Apparently. :rolleyes:

olivier renault said:
There is such a thing as 'fair usage' you know. How about two friends? How about three friends? How long are we borrowing exactly?
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So piracy as ok as long as it's only a couple of people doing the pirating and they delete it after a while? :D
 
Personally I have no problem with music piracy.

I'll clarify. I have pirated a lot of music in my time, but I also buy a ridiculous amount of music (both physical and digital) I don't use services like Spotify because I know how little goes to the artist, in the end the reason for me to buy music is to support the artist. When I can, I buy from the artist website if they offer it. I would probably have bought less than 1/4 of my current collection if I couldn't pirate to try stuff out.

I also think less artists have a problem with people doing it than is generally assumed. I've quite happily told artists I've pirated their stuff and ended up loving it, bought the CD then gone to see them live. Some like Trent Reznor (of Nine Inch Nails) have even stuck torrents up of their music as it helps get the music out there.
 
For myself I pirated when I couldnt afford to get things, job pays me more so I have a love film account and buy DVDs Blu rays, I still think they are missing a trick with the internet, there are no borders with it, so why not release things everywhere at the same time, its ridiculous, would cut piracy down massively over night!
 
I used to pirate games before I heard of Steam though I bought a few legitimately too. Now that i've used Steam for 5+ years i've not had to torrent anything because their prices are cheap and they have frequent sales.
 
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