Supplements the debate/discussion thread

[Freefaller]

And your body starts to digest itself - no thanks!

 

[Syla5]

Used both

Appreciated

I did find that the products are a tad more expenisve then MP, but so far i have been happy with what they have supplied.

Never had a problem with MP myself, just fancied a change. Oh and i was getting fed up of ordering from MP and then the next day them putting up deals for the stuff i just ordered its like they were mocking me

 

[Chong Warrior]

You're right: it's a very serious challenge that does far more harm to the body than a resistance workout.

Massive oxidative damage, dehydration, ligament/tendon microtears... Yummy.

That's just for starters, why on earth people think long distance running is good for your health I have no idea?!

 

[mrthingyx]

"But doctors say it's good for me to do exercise?"



There is also a bizarre fear of steroids amongst the average joe populace, too. Admittedly, if they were all like UE, then I could understand D), however my entire family and uneducated friends all assume that I'm either on the juice or at risk of contracting 'juice use' or whatever just by looking at a gym and/or lifting weights.

Now whilst I'm not what I would desribe as skinny, some people can't distinguish between a juicer and somebody that is just bigger than they are.

Double

 

[Cristian]

I think the contrast between perceptions is rather hilarious.
Everybody is promoting marathons / long distance running and all those lovely things as "healthy" and something you should get involved in.
On the other hand, lifting weights and having a protein shake makes people look at you like you're about to tear your shirt and go roid raging hulk on them.

Then they look at Chris Hemsworth in Thor - there are many others but his 6 month "transformation" is most striking - and most females I know wet themselves, for good reason I might add.
Yet when presented with the idea that chris there did a bit of naughty sauce to get where he was in Thor they go in complete denial and say that's not possible, only monsters and cheaters (hi Lance) use drugs and so on.

 

[mrthingyx]

Yeah, it's somewhat depressing.

But it's the same reason I don't go to a doctor for a musculoskeletal problem: they just don't understand the area (as a general population).

This then gets passed on to the general populace, stoked by the media, and those of us who are notionally responsible get tarnished with a brush we've never even seen.

One of my mates believes everything he reads in Mens' Health and doesn't realise a lot of the models in there would be using some form of 'assistance' to get in and stay in their respective conditions. A two minute conversation with kai will tell anybody how difficult (and - to be blunt - trucking miserable) it is to do that naturally.

 

[Ultra_Extreme]

"But doctors say it's good for me to do exercise?"



There is also a bizarre fear of steroids amongst the average joe populace, too. Admittedly, if they were all like UE, then I could understand D), however my entire family and uneducated friends all assume that I'm either on the juice or at risk of contracting 'juice use' or whatever just by looking at a gym and/or lifting weights.

Now whilst I'm not what I would desribe as skinny, some people can't distinguish between a juicer and somebody that is just bigger than they are.

Double

heeeeey what u saying!?

Reality is they mostly dont see "oh he is so big he must use steroids" because the public opinion is that no matter how big you are you either worked hard at it or you took steroids and it just happened by magic. Then you get the gym bunnies who dont eat right and dont know what hard work is. They think everyone bigger than them only got there by juicing when often the guys they think are big are pretty small.

I just keep it to myself unless asked by someone i respect. It devalues everything i know about training once someone uneducated knows i use. So i keep it fairly quiet, ironically, for the benefit of others.

 

[BennyC]

hold your noses guys! makes a difference

Doesn't at all! at least not with EAA's. Learned to swallow with an open mouth in the end /no homo.

 

[mrthingyx]

Doesn't at all! at least not with EAA's. Learned to swallow with an open mouth in the end /no homo.

Whilst that comment might be /nohomo-tagged, you must have learnt that technique somehwere...

Suppose to suome, protein is protein at the end of the day.

 

[LiE]

Bit of squash and water makes OAKG fine. Just tastes like a sour version of the squash, in my case sour vimto.

 

[sunama]

There is also a bizarre fear of steroids amongst the average joe populace, too.

Yep. Totally agree.

I wrote a few posts in this thread regarding the supplements you speak of and it is a taboo subject that joe public do not want to understand or acknowledge.

I see these supplements as merely a stronger version of the supplements which are being discussed in this thread. Nothing more. Some would argue that these powerful supplements can lead to ill-health, but then this applies to many supplements. For example, if you abuse caffeine (available in RedBull and coffee - available in supermarkets), you can have a heart attack. Swallow enough sleeping pills and you will fall seriously ill. The key thing is that when taking a supplement, you must be educated in its usage and dosage.

If I wanted to look like an American wrestler (or Chris Hemsworth), I would take the stronger supplements (used by those wrestlers), mixing them up with protein shakes, a creatine product, a solid diet and a brutal weight training program.

On a separate note, for those of you who are looking to clean up your diets:
I have been reading up and watching many videos regarding fat vs carbs. I must say that the evidence against carbs is significant and it would appear that it is commercial companies wanting to profit from man-kind who are pushing the low fat diet (which GPs around the UK are currently pushing). There is also little evidence to suggest that medium-high cholesterol in the blood is a bad thing. The reports which show high cholesterol as a bad thing, are fueled by drug companies who want to sell cholesterol-lowering tablets. This industry is worth US$billions per year and appears to be the biggest selling drug in the USA. The scientists who suggested that high cholesterol is bad are paid by drug companies!

One thing's for sure - the low fat diets which Western Governments have been preaching to us, appear to be nothing more than a fraud, driven by commercial organisations who want to increase the sale of their products.

My research is suggesting that there is nothing wrong with saturated fats or dietary cholesterol.

For those interested, have a listen to the following videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vr-c8GeT34&NR=1&feature=endscreen
This video aims to destroy the theory of high cholesterol being related to heart disease and death.

This video explains the (mythical) theory that fat is the enemy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRe9z32NZHY

 

[LiE]

My research is suggesting that there is nothing wrong with saturated fats or dietary cholesterol.

Preaching to the choir.
We have covered these topics a lot in the past on here.

 

[sunama]

Whilst that comment might be /nohomo-tagged, you must have learnt that technique somehwere...

 

[Oxide™]

After years of being an utter slacker I finally started gyming and eating healthily in earnest since December. I am currently 264lbs (lost 14lbs) and am focussed on weight loss at the moment.

Routine
Gym twice a week with intense circuits - mixture of weights hitting all body parts and xtrainer
Swim before work 3 times a week

Currently taking:
MP Omega 3 Fish Oil Liquid
MP Whey Concentrate Protein
MP L-Glutamine
Milk Thistle to cleanse the kidneys

I just have a few questions.

1: I often read a lot of people recommending Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard Whey, is this really worth it over MP's?

2: Should I start taking Creatine as well (Creapure)? Doesn't it just increase water retention (which is good for muscle growth but will make me look fatter?)

3: I'm counting calories (2000 daily limit) as well as macros, should I start taking Whey Isolate or the usual Whey Concentrate?

4: Should I take some dextrose in the post workout shake or is 35g whey + 5g glutamine ok?

5: My best friend, who is a bodybuilder (I took pictures of him below - he's incredibly bulky and thick) came to visit me from South Africa recently and suggested I take Clenbuterol (Yes I read the posts about no steroid discussions but this is not a steroid). If we are allowed to discuss it does anyone know if this is something I should look at getting? He says it's great for cutting as it melts off fat and is anti-catabolic.

6: Otherwise should I be taking an ECA stack too?

 

[Steedie]

No offence to your mate, he looks big, but if he is using Clen, then he's not using it right. He looks about 20% bf, so it's obviously not melting fat off for him

As for not being a steroid, you're right. But it is a banned substance, therefore we can't discuss it

Eat Clen, and Tren Hard, nomsayin?

 

[Steedie]

As for the other questions (edit button doesn't seem to work today)

1: I often read a lot of people recommending Optimum Nutrition Gold Standard Whey, is this really worth it over MP's?

It tastes lovely, but it's not worth the premium, stick to MP whey or TPW

2: Should I start taking Creatine as well (Creapure)? Doesn't it just increase water retention (which is good for muscle growth but will make me look fatter?)

Creatine is worth it, if you play around with the various forms of creatine, you might find one that doesn't give you water bloat. For me it's CEE, but ti also tastes like crap, so I'd rather have a bit of water bloat. It's really not that bad

3: I'm counting calories (2000 daily limit) as well as macros, should I start taking Whey Isolate or the usual Whey Concentrate?

Whey Isolate really only comes into its own if you're on a diet where every calorie counts. Or you're using it post workout in which case the shorter digestion time can make a different, but again, it's not worth it, unless you're an elite athlete, you won't need that 1% difference you might see

4: Should I take some dextrose in the post workout shake or is 35g whey + 5g glutamine ok?

Yep get some dextrose in your post workout shake, simple carbs are ideal in a post workout drink, and dextrose is cheap as chips

6: Otherwise should I be taking an ECA stack too?

ECA is banned also, due to Ephidrine, so can't talk about it :X

 

[Oxide™]

Thanks Steedie I shall heed your advice

No my friend doesn't take clen and he drinks like an animal which accounts for his bf - literally 4x12 cases of beers (amongst other stuff - hey it was a reunion after all) in 2 days - beer for breakfast etc - he's always been like that - barsteward owes me my beers back

 

[stiv121]

Bought some off these from a friend yesterday to try. Craze has not really done anything for me, even after staying of caffeine for a few weeks then re trying it so I thought I would try these out as the guys and girls that are coming up to a comp are using them and they all say they get a good buzz and are helping with the weight loss Been of caffeine for a week now and will be giving it at least another week probably 2 until I start.

 

[LiE]

Stiv. 300mg caffeine, 5g taurine, 5g creatine, 3g beta alanine and 5-10g MCT. Pre-workout sorted.

 

[stiv121]

Hmm would It be possible to take the beta alanine and taurine along with these caps? No idea what MCT is though? Only got these because they were only a few left and was curious to try something a little different.

EDIT: and also to help me drop a little more weight easier