National Military Service
- Thread starter prashantnew
- Start date
Got a few thoughts on this
- When I read the OP I thought it sounds a great idea, but then it reminds me of the Poundland/Tesco/Debenhams etc workhouse which I really disagree with, but let's not go there in this thread.
- The country benefits from National Service though and business don't (good thing)
- Don't know how you would get the people who don't want to be there to behave. You need supernanny type people for adults.
- Is it taking away the jobs that local/other government people have? Or simply adding more to the country....
Soldato
- Joined
- 29 Aug 2006
- Posts
- 3,779
- Location
- Wales
"You first."
Ever wonder why you're not Prime Minister?
Mark my words my friend, peace is just the dormant sea of war.
Perhaps the reason we haven't defended our own country since WW2 is because of nuclear deterrents? Mutually Assured Destruction can be a powerful thing.
Besides, who are you hoping to convince? The countries that are any sort of remotely credible threat are the ones that don't and won't operate by the same sets of ideals anyway.
Soldato
- Joined
- 29 Aug 2006
- Posts
- 3,779
- Location
- Wales
So you are suggesting most Scandanavian countries are akin to nazi germany?
Wow
Also I suggest fully starting out your swearies unless you want the holiday you deserve.
Nope. Just a knee-jerk response to anything remotely authoritarian or right wing. Am I back on neutral ground yet?
I said nothing about wealth. There are more than economic definitions for the word poor which was why I used the other side as good and not rich. The studies take into account for what you suggest and the point remains.
You need to define far more specifically than "studies state" as the hard real world evidence is quite to the contrary.
Pointless looking at data that more than likely takes ideal 'poor' candidates and places them in excellent schools and suggesting it reflects the majority of the populace.
I engage daily with people who are a result of their parental upbringing and nothing the education system could throw at them would change that.
In some countries it is born somewhat out of necessity i.e. South Korea and Egypt for instance would be in a much weakened position if they didn't. They both need that weight for reasons of regional stability.
Of course, we aren't in such a position though. I know more than a few people from such countries that hated the fact that they were (or about to be) forced into the military.
So your personal experience and obvious prejudice in this position is superior to academic research that looks exclusively at this issue?
Soldato
- Joined
- 31 May 2009
- Posts
- 21,506
Lol or Israel, who I think still have national service. Singapore has it for their males, one of the lowest crime rates in the world. Scandanavea has it, or had it until relatively recently.
Xordium you make a good point regarding education, but one goes with the other, if you haven't bothered at school, then some form of regimental correction may help, and I think would help the majority of society.
Soldato
- Joined
- 29 Aug 2006
- Posts
- 3,779
- Location
- Wales
Yup, if you're not in work or pursuing higher education, you should be forced into the military - really genius thinking here guys, seriously.
I hate this society. People are defined by 'what they do'. It's deeply ingrained and programmed into us. Why? Seeds of morality sewn in the soil of the ruling castle. Not everything that makes economic sense is good. "Work makes us free / liberty or death".
I hate this society. People are defined by 'what they do'. It's deeply ingrained and programmed into us. Why? Seeds of morality sewn in the soil of the ruling castle. Not everything that makes economic sense is good. "Work makes us free / liberty or death".
Last edited:
No, it would be the groups willing to use force to gain power. Force works. It might not be nice, but that's how it is.
There are situations in which the only way to peace is to force it on people, Pax Romana style. If <insert group here> is willing to use guns and bombs to kill any who openly oppose them and suppress opposition through fear, then they will come to power if there isn't an effective opposition to them, and that requires an armed force. If <insert group here> is eager to do some mass slaughter "cleansing" for ethnic, religious and/or political reasons, stopping them in the short term requires greatly superior force, enough to prevent them doing it. "Kill those people and we kill you" is ugly, but in some situations it's the only thing that works. Long term requires deeper changes, but that's not going to bring the dead back to life.
What you're proposing is an international military spanning dozens of countries without military training in those countries, which can't work unless there is far more unification between all those countries than currently exists. The most workable solution at the moment is, as it always has been, alliances.
I'm trying to find a quote and failing. It's something someone said to someone else after hearing a third person propose disarmament, something along the lines of him being a good man, but until all men are like him we must keep our swords sharp.
Soldato
- Joined
- 29 Aug 2006
- Posts
- 3,779
- Location
- Wales
No, I wouldn't expect anyone on this forum to. Nevermind, let's just keep blaming the poor for society's ills, even though we can quantitatively measure that there are more people than jobs. It's their fault, every single one of those benefit cheating scum with a free mansion and a range rover outside for their 11 kids. Millions of them, stealing your hard earned cash. Ignorant, stupid chavs with bad behaviour. Blame the poor! (Hitler was not a monster, just a deeply flawed human being).
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 27 Sep 2004
- Posts
- 25,821
- Location
- Glasgow
It's a theory certainly but I'm not aware of any evidence to support the assertion that regimental correction in the form of national service helps on a wider scale when there isn't education as a precursor (there may be such evidence and if so I'd be interested to see it).
I don't think I'd be willing to draw a link between Singapore's low crime rate and their military service - they might be linked or it might have more to do with the prevailing culture there.
I can't see national service (military or otherwise) as being much of a panacea for the issues that the country faces. You're likely to end up with lots more disaffected young people if you're going to conscript them and if there's no real reason or focus in doing so it seems like a bit of a waste of everyones time. I've got little doubt that a few will benefit but will that be enough to outweigh the negatives? That appears to be the point that is much more dubious even if we're taking a utilitarianism based approach.
Pardon the cynicism but of those 20 professionals how many of them would have been exempted from national service due to the further education/something lined up after school?
I worked hard to be in the military, and am working hard to this day. I would not want to work with some scrote who couldn't give 2 ***** about what he is doing.
We all have to rely on each other to make sure we get the job done, it just takes one person to balls this up - and out of the people that want to do the job, you can guarantee it will be the person who was forced to join.
We all have to rely on each other to make sure we get the job done, it just takes one person to balls this up - and out of the people that want to do the job, you can guarantee it will be the person who was forced to join.