Bedroom tax

[BigAndy87]

generalize much?

 

[Lord-Jaffa]

My old nan is going to be hit by this.

She has lived in the same 3 bed council house pretty much all of her life but now its just her and my aunt.

The thing is they have been on a waiting list for a smaller property for several years now but the council can't find one and now they're being punished.
They'd love to move out as its far too big for them and expensive to heat but they have nowhere to go!

Just doesn't seem like this policy has been thought out at all.

So get them to join Homeswappers.co.uk they will find a 2 bedroom place to swap with in less than a week. People will be chewing their arms off offering 2 bedroom houses for a bigger property. The amount of people saying they have been waiting years for a smaller place is absolute rubbish, My mum has recently downsized as she wanted a smaller home, from a four bedroom (since we have all moved out, aside from one of my sisters years ago) to a two bedroom house, it took approx 3 days to find a suitable nice property for her using that website.

 

[Castiel]

Not as a student

Which is why I stated 'working age' rather than simply over 18. The implication being that they are available for work or in work.

 

[Lord-Jaffa]

generalize much?

I love the NO EVICTION signs especially, pay your rent instead of having others do it for you maybe?

 

[RDM]

I agree the implementation is flawed, however it is a bit rich make accusations of it being ideologically driven when much of the protest is also being ideologically driven and such claims do not do anything to help either side.

I thought the point of politics was ideology?

 

[Biohazard]

I agree the implementation is flawed, however it is a bit rich make accusations of it being ideologically driven when much of the protest is also being ideologically driven and such claims do not do anything to help either side.

It seems that many political groups are taking advantage of others misfortune to give a soapbox to another agenda instead of actually offering constructive alternatives or helping those in need.

I feel those groups are campaigning out of concern. Much of civic Scotland is repulsed by what they are witnessing. All welcome, and no party politics.

Scotland is providing the help of those who are impacted by these changes primarily at council level. I hope for uniformity in these counter-actions.

There is a Discretionary Housing Payments system being put in place so that Councils can give support to those in real need or cannot move and have lost benefit, yet nothing is said of this, many people don't even know about it, and it is incumbent, not only on the Govt and the Councils themselves to make sure that those who qualify get that help, but also on the Political Groups who are so willing tom take advantage of unpopular Welfare reforms.

Councils here are re-classifying bedrooms, many are voting for no evictions which means making up the difference but I prefer the former where applicable.

Wales for example have also set aside money so that those in need can get help if they also qualify, I don't know whether the Scottish Govt has also...

I don't like this policy, it means subsidizing Westminster cuts even further. Better to use the loopholes.

However, it is a Welfare reform, it is not a tax and that rankles me a little, even if I don't agree with the imposition on the poorest in our communities and that there are better, fairer ways to deal with the issue.

Better fairer ways of dealing with the issue.. than peaceful protest?

 

[MeatLoaf]

So get them to join Homeswappers.co.uk they will find a 2 bedroom place to swap with in less than a week. People will be chewing their arms off offering 2 bedroom houses for a bigger property. The amount of people saying they have been waiting years for a smaller place is absolute rubbish, My mum has recently downsized as she wanted a smaller home, from a four bedroom (since we have all moved out, aside from one of my sisters years ago) to a two bedroom house, it took approx 3 days to find a suitable nice property for her using that website.

Ive been on homeswapper for over a year and have only just this last week found someone to swap with.

It dosent help that our council wont move anyone with rent arrears. So even tho my account is clear, if the potential swapper isn't the council will block the swap.

And yes I do work and I do pay my rent

 

[Biohazard]

 

[Castiel]

I feel those groups are campaigning out of concern. Much of civic Scotland is repulsed by what they are witnessing. All welcome, and no party politics.

Some of the political banners in your supplied pictures would suggest otherwise. The everyday folks are probably protesting the reforms/cuts, but some of the groups organising and motivating such are ideologically driven to do so, for example It appears like the Yes Campaign has taken substantial advantage of the situation in an attempt to garner support for their campaign. Your little meme above also illustrates what I was saying, it isn't limited to one party or one group, nor is it surprising.

Scotland is providing the help of those who are impacted by these changes primarily at council level. I hope for uniformity in these counter-actions.

How? Are they reliant only upon the centrally funded DHP or is there another program in place to support that, like in Wales?

Are the Scottish Govt planning to build Social Housing on a scale so that the need for reform would either be mooted or that their would be enough social housing to adequately house those in need?

This is what I was getting at...here for example, the Labour opposition are quick to make political capital, yet they forget that if The Labour Govt had continued the John Major Govts social house building targets then there would be at least 300,000 more families housed in social housing. This is what annoys me....politicians and lobbyists taking advantage of situations they helped create or didn't do anything about when they could have.

Councils here are re-classifying bedrooms, many are voting for no evictions which means making up the difference but I prefer the former where applicable.

I think we have to be careful over the issue of evictions, there seems little to support such claims. Do you have some info or references on how councils are reclassifying bedrooms to avoid the reform?

I don't like this policy, it means subsidizing Westminster cuts even further. Better to use the loopholes.

Like advocating foster care?

Better fairer ways of dealing with the issue.. than peaceful protest?

What has that got to do with protest....I was referring to the reform.

 

[Biohazard]

Some of the political banners in your supplied pictures would suggest otherwise. It appears like the Yes Campaign has taken substantial advantage of the situation in an attempt to garner support for their campaign. Your little meme above also illustrates what I was saying, it isn't limited to one party or one group.

The Yes campaign isn't a political party, it's an umberalla group. As I said, all welcome. That Better Together didn't want to join in was entirely their choice, many other groups and individuals in Scotland and elsewhere did.

Yes campaigners find the reforms as distasteful as the next person, they are offering their solution and support to the victims.

How? Are they reliant only upon the centrally funded DHP or is there another program in place to support that, like in Wales?

By refusing to evict, and by helping people reclassify rooms in their properties. Welfare is reserved, but housing is devolved to a regional level. Not all councils have though, but there is campaigning underway to shame those who do not and the umbrella group COSLA have publicly denounced the abhorrent policy.

I think we have to be careful over the issue of evictions, there seems little to support such claims.

It's the councils' and housing associations that are reporting these concerns. Losing up to 25% of your housing benefit is going to cause real hardship for some, it's hard to deny.

Like advocating foster care?

Second livingrooms and big cupboards

What has that got to do with protest....I was referring to the reform.

Dealing with it, than calling it a tax? Well, that's just politics and perception for you.

 

[Castiel]

The Yes campaign isn't a political party, it's an umberalla group. As I said, all welcome. That Better Together didn't want to join in was entirely their choice, many other groups and individuals in Scotland and elsewhere did.

Yes campaigners find the reforms as distasteful as the next person, they are offering their solution and support to the victims.

I said Groups as well as Parties.

It appears that they are using the reforms as political capital to forward their agenda. It is not unexpected, in fact I would be surprised if they hadn't, equally the opposite with the Better Together group if the poles were reversed...I do think that as many of the constituent parts of the Better Together campaign are also opposed to and marched in protest, the Campaign itself however has nothing to do with Welfare Reform, but constitutional reform.

By refusing to evict, and by helping people reclassify rooms in their properties. Welfare is reserved, but housing is devolved to a regional level. Not all councils have though, but there is campaigning underway to shame those who do not and the umbrella group COSLA have publicly denounced the abhorrent policy.

Do you have any corroboration for the claims of reclassification and refusal to evict? I know some Councils in England have suspended any eviction based on arrears until a sustainable and equitable way forward is found.....I have not seen the same from councils elsewhere however.

Are they going to increase funding to social housing?

It's the councils' and housing associations that are reporting these concerns. Losing up to 25% of your housing benefit is going to cause real hardship for some, it's hard to deny.

I am not denying it, quite the opposite...although eviction is not a given as Councils still have an obligation of care to the most vulnerable in their parishes.

Second livingrooms and big cupboards

Corroboration?

Dealing with it, than calling it a tax? Well, that's just politics and perception for you.

I don't understand what you are saying here in relation to what I originally said, which was my disagreement that this kind of reform was the best way to go about it?

 

[Biohazard]

I said Groups as well as Parties.

It appears that they are using the reforms as political capital to forward their agenda. It is not unexpected, in fact I would be surprised if they hadn't, equally the opposite with the Better Together group if the poles were reversed...I do think that as many of the constituent parts of the Better Together campaign are also opposed to and marched in protest, the Campaign itself however has nothing to do with Welfare Reform, but constitutional reform.

Yes Scotland; Agenda. Better Together; Campaign?

The reforms, and wider social welfare, are part of the reason for their campaign. Better Together chose not to attend, and that again is their choice. It has no bearing on those who did unite.

Do you have any corroboration for the claims of reclassification and refusal to evict? I know some have suspended any eviction based on arrears until a sustainable and equitable way forward is found.....I have not seen the same from councils elsewhere however.

Did you look?

[url]http://www.west-dunbarton.gov.uk/council-and-government/newsroom/news-or-press-releases/2013/march/council-pledges-not-to-evict-tenants-affected-by-welfare-reform/?r=/council-and-government/newsroom/news-or-press-releases?size=AAA&pagenumber=1&month=3&year=2013

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/no-evictions-vows-over-welfare-changes-119842n.20648522

http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/lo...t-to-evict-tenants-hit-by-bedroom-tax-1.76104

http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobil...01?_=0c7a256eff4219d4269dc79e7cf30d056325f3f4

http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/tenancies/snp-councils-ban-bedroom-tax-evictions/6526282.article

Are they going to increase funding to social housing?

They are doing their best with the functions they have to mitigate, and have good intentions for the future. Budgets are under huge strain with continual, and recent, cuts.

I am not denying it, quite the opposite...although eviction is not a given as Councils still have an obligation of care to the most vulnerable in their parishes.

Councils most certainly evict, even when they are still obliged to provide alternative care or accomodation. This without concerted effort to reject it will result in more people being cycled through.

Corroboration?

The Scottish Government has written to all the councils asking them to do so where they can.

Seek and you shall find Castiel.

I don't understand what you are saying here in relation to what I originally said, which was my disagreement that this kind of reform was the best way to go about it?

ok.

 

[Castiel]

Yes Scotland; Agenda. Better Together; Campaign?

You are seeing things I did not infer. Yes Scotland is a Group as is Better Together....they both have an agenda, but Yes Scotland took this opportunity to forward theirs....

The reforms, and wider social welfare, are part of the reason for their campaign. Better Together chose not to attend, and that again is their choice. It has no bearing on those who did unite.

I though their campaign was to do with Independence and Constitutional Change, this particular welfare reform has little bearing on that, it does give them an opportunity however to use such public disagreement to forward their agenda however, and make a political statement thereof.

YDid you look?

No, I asked you. I note that some of those councils are either giving provisos such as 'repayment plans' or it is time limited...

YThey are doing their best with the functions they have to mitigate, and have good intentions for the future. Budgets are under huge strain with continual, and recent, cuts.

Is not Social Housing a devolved matter? If suitable Housing Stock is one of the main underlying issues on such an important issue (according to the Yes Campaign as you pointed out) can the SG not allocate increased funds to such building projects? Building or subsiding one bedroom accommodation for example?

How important a priority is housing compared to say non-means tested free university places or free prescriptions etc?

How will this change in independence?

How do the SG intend to reverse the welfare reforms in the event of Independence, as the Yes Campaign has made a point of opposing this, what are their solutions, outside of merely opposing them of course?

YCouncils most certainly evict, even when they are still obliged to provide alternative care or accomodation. This without concerted effort to reject it will result in more people being cycled through.

I didn't say they don't, I did say that it is quite rare to evict solely on the strength of rent arrears however, although that may be different in Scotland.

Y
The Scottish Government has written to all the councils asking them to do so where they can.

Seek and you shall find Castiel.

I did seek information...I asked you, and thanks.

The SG are not doing as the Welsh Assembly then, I though that they would help financially (other than the £2.5m for advisors)?

 

[Biohazard]

You are seeing things I did not infer. Yes Scotland is a Group as is Better Together....they both have an agenda, but Yes Scotland took this opportunity to forward theirs....

Which is a perfectly valid thing to do, and was welcomed for it's campaigning zest. Several political parties took banners, but the focus and issue was overwhelmingly unfair cuts.

I though their campaign was to do with Independence and Constitutional Change, this particular welfare reform has little bearing on that, it does give them an opportunity however to use such public disagreement to forward their agenda however, and make a political statement thereof.

You think that the Yes campaign has drawn a line in the sand at the constitution itself?

I think you've underestimated the over-arching reach of these organisations.

The campaign for Independence, constitutional change, is because of a myriad of aspects to society governance and policy. It isn't boxed to constitutional theory but of how we want our society.

No, I asked you. I note that some of those councils are either giving provisos such as 'repayment plans' or it is time limited...

Why don't you look?

Is not Social Housing a devolved matter? If suitable Housing Stock is one of the main underlying issues on such an important issue (according to the Yes Campaign as you pointed out) can the SG not allocate increased funds to such building projects? Building or subsiding one bedroom accommodation for example?

It has done and is doing. The SG has long been crying for capital spending projects such as housing. The aim is to build 30,000 new affordable social homes over the coming term.

How important a priority is housing compared to say non-means tested free university places or free prescriptions etc?

How will this change in independence?

Hard to conflate issues like that, but I'd say of equal importance if any sort of direct comparison can be sought.

How do the SG intend to reverse the welfare reforms in the event of Independence, as the Yes Campaign has made a point of opposing this, what are their solutions, outside of merely opposing them of course?

They intend to reverse them, if given the opportunity, by not implementing it. It can't without control of welfare.

I didn't say they don't, I did say that it is quite rare to evict solely on the strength of rent arrears however, although that may be different in Scotland.

I did seek information...I asked you, and thanks.

The SG are not doing as the Welsh Assembly then, I though that they would help financially (other than the £2.5m for advisors)?

The Scottish Government has already made it's budget and local grant settlements, all these authorites are having to find further budget cuts thanks to the last swing of the axe.

The question isn't how well the devolved powers are doing at mitigating against it, but who and what is imposing it.

 

[spankingtexan]

Iain Duncan Smith says he could live on £53 a week.

Lets hold him to it then, sign the petition...

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitio...e-on-53-a-week


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...k-8556002.html

I hope that includes him stacking shelves in a supermarket for it too. He could do it at Morrisons under Cait Reilly's supervision.

 

[Macro]

As far as I can tell the Yes Scotland propaganda machine would turn up to protest the closure of a crack house if they thought they could pin the closure as a move by Westminster to oppress the Scots.

 

[the shadow]

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/iain-duncan-smith-iain-duncan-smith-to-live-on-53-a-week

 

[semi-pro waster]

Iain Duncan Smith says he could live on £53 a week.

Lets hold him to it then, sign the petition...

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitio...e-on-53-a-week


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...k-8556002.html

I hope that includes him stacking shelves in a supermarket for it too. He could do it at Morrisons under Cait Reilly's supervision.

Please stop cross-posting the same thing in multiple threads, it's unnecessary and distracts from the actual topic as it can't be relevant to all of them. Thank you.

 

[Slam62]

I can tell by looking that 95% of those people are living on benefits and in 3-4 bedroom houses with 2+ spare bedrooms.

Yeah, and they've got Sky and all the premium channels

 

[spankingtexan]

Please stop cross-posting the same thing in multiple threads, it's unnecessary and distracts from the actual topic as it can't be relevant to all of them. Thank you.

No probs.