A hot hatch needs to be practical, fairly quick and fun to drive. Something with a rev limit below 5.5krpm and a great heavy lump up front isn't that. Torque is good but not if it peaks at 3k rpm.
Diesel hot hatch?
- Thread starter squarehead94
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A hot hatch needs to be practical, fairly quick and fun to drive. Something with a rev limit below 5.5krpm and a great heavy lump up front isn't that. Torque is good but not if it peaks at 3k rpm.
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well ive done 3k in 3 months of owning the civic. mainly driving on a roads, town and 1 dual carriageway thats around 5 miles long.
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also, i never said i get 270 to a tank, i said it hits the petrol light at 270. i dont run the redline all the time, and the tripometer reckons im hitting 33mpg usually. last week i managed to get 348 to the tank but this really was scraping the barrell. petrol light was on for the last 60 miles.
Caporegime
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Not really. Yes there's a couple that stray into hot hatch territory, but most are dull and clattery.
I would say that the 123d is all of those things. You do not need 7krpm to make a hatchback "hot".
Admittedly once past the 123d i'd struggle, a lot of the stuff below that is more "warm".
The power delivery characteristics do not determine if the car is "hot". It's up to the driver to extract the performance.
You might not need 7krpm for a hot hatch but you need more than 6krpm. Power delivery is one of the most important things for a hot hatch along with throttle response. You just don't get that from a diesel.
I don't feel a diesel within a hot hatch works as the power delivery just doesn't seem right. I want a sharp throttle and no diesel delivers that. In a big saloon such as my 530D it works, but I can't see my engine for example working in a 1 series, same for the twin turbo version from the 535D.
What are you basing this on? The 123d for example, could easily hang with some of the petrol equivalents on a track.
People who think revs are everything are no better than the OMG TORKS brigade.
Back onto topic.
If you're only doing ~12k a year, you're not at the stage where a diesel is going to save you any cash due to the extra potential for costly bits to break over a petrol. On top of this, the Civic is presumably a known quantity now?
If you do a poll I think it will come up as one of the most important
I did a lot of miles and bought cars like the ones mentioned here (Fabia vRS and now a Leon FR Diesel) and while I enjoyed them I would hesitate to recommend them to you here. I was doing almost 3x your mileage and I broke even around 60-70k approximately (vs a petrol, bought nearly new), you need to take diesels the distance if you want to see a return based on fuel choice. I also bought nearly new - maintenance was a known thing when I took the car long, it got treated well, all serviced, tyres were always good etc... buying older ones means you may have a bit of an unknown here unless you come across a diamond in the rough. I also managed to dodge any large repairs to the intake system - others are not so lucky (with the PD you're basically looking at turbo & injectors as the larger items that can go wrong, with the vRS you also get leaking rear doors)
The type of road is also a pretty large consideration when going diesel, my commute is all motorways which is pretty much the perfect scenario for the black stuff giving good MPG and now also keeping my DPF in great condition. Just something to bear in mind when looking at potentials.
If you've owned your civic for a decent amount of time and treated it well then I'd highly consider if it was worth losing the money in the trade for something that may not be all that much of an improvement. I won't lie, I enjoy the power band fun as much as the next person and the vRS was the perfect car for that point in my life (does mileage, cheap to buy, maintenance is extremely cheap too, performance which was fairly decent for it's price) but at 12k I'd be looking at petrol. You'd probably be able to get a better performing petrol for this money - is this an option? If you're dead set on a diesel then so be it but I think you're probably looking at the wrong thing here. Also you arn't gaining 50hp by chipping it without upgrading something so your budget needs to be re-adjusted. a PD would need a new clutch here surely, likely an intake as well (although these are cheap and be stolen on PD150s).
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Ok so what about petrols? Obviously id like more power than the 110 or so bhp my civic has, what are some good petrol hot hatches for under 5k? Cos i could peobably find them for 3 5 4kish.
What are you basing this on? The 123d for example, could easily hang with some of the petrol equivalents on a track.
People who think revs are everything are no better than the OMG TORKS brigade.
There is more to a 'performance' car and its driver enjoyment than just horsepower, torque and track times you know
There is more to a 'performance' car and its driver enjoyment than just horsepower, torque and track times you know
And there's more to it than the engine note and how many revs it has as well.
And there's more to it than the engine note and how many revs it has as well.
Indeed, mainly things such as good throttle response and smooth power delivery
Soldato
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1k a month and you're debating diesel?
Lol. I do triple that and I'm only half-sold on diesel, I'd take the move back to petrol if the right car came up at the right price.
Keep the Civic.
Lol. I do triple that and I'm only half-sold on diesel, I'd take the move back to petrol if the right car came up at the right price.
Keep the Civic.
Indeed, mainly things such as good throttle response and smooth power delivery
According to whom?