Lauryn Hill jailed for tax evasion

[Raymond Lin]

I don't live in the UK any more and I pay no income tax, so my opinion is some what jaded.

However regarding the TV thing... It's absolutely ridiculous and if you can't see why you are a little bit blind.

BBC have no right to say you should pay them money because you have a TV and watch ITV or Channel 4... Why can't I own a TV and just watch other channels without having to pay a license fee? Pretty sure the UK is one of the only countries in World to force people to pay a fee like they do.

Also, the notion that the license people have the personal details of millions upon millions of "subscribers" is a little daunting. They know your name, address, credit card info, pretty much everything. Who gave these people so much power?

I have lived in other places other than the UK and at first it is a shock to be asked to pay this. Then you realise you have channels in the UK with no advertising whatsoever.

Unless you have forgotten that? That's how other countries pay for their networks. I really don't see a problem with it and credit card info...er, go pay by cash in the post office if you are that paranoid about it. Lots of people know your address too, like your postman, the water company, your internet service provider, your employer, your friends, and if someone is savvy enough, at the other end of the internet to find your IP address. What's the big deal? If you want to be off the grid then get offline for a start.

 

[Woden]

I don't live in the UK any more and I pay no income tax, so my opinion is some what jaded.

However regarding the TV thing... It's absolutely ridiculous and if you can't see why you are a little bit blind.

BBC have no right to say you should pay them money because you have a TV and watch ITV or Channel 4... Why can't I own a TV and just watch other channels without having to pay a license fee? Pretty sure the UK is one of the only countries in World to force people to pay a fee like they do.

Also, the notion that the license people have the personal details of millions upon millions of "subscribers" is a little daunting. They know your name, address, credit card info, pretty much everything. Who gave these people so much power?

Actually they do have a right. Don't like it? Lobby for the law to be changed. That is how democracy works.

How is it there are countries with 0% income tax rate then who function perfectly fine?

List these tax free countries?

 

[AdladUK]

Name a country without taxation*, and we'll look at why they're (a) a special case in a manner that doesn't apply to the UK and (b) don't actually function "perfectly fine"?

They may be "special cases," for example Monaco or UAE, but there are other countries too, much bigger than the UK, that don't have such outrageous income taxes.

For example the USA has a max income tax rate of 20%... That's 30% less than the UK for anyone making £150,000+ a year (which by today's standards is no longer a fortune)

 

[AdladUK]

A nightclub bouncer telling me I can't wear trainers is a form of control, a bus conductor telling me I must have valid ticket is a form of control.

I don't get your point. Unless you are an anarchist and don't think society should have rules

You just made my point with your own post

"A nightclub bouncer telling me I can't wear trainers is a form of control"

Oh and a government telling you that you have to pay 50% of everything you make to them is not?

I'd say the latter example is far more scary

 

[Mr Jack]

They may be "special cases," for example Monaco or UAE, but there are other countries too, much bigger than the UK, that don't have such outrageous income taxes.

The USA does not have universal healthcare, instead having one of the worst and yet most expensive healthcare systems in the developed world. One of the highest murder rates in the developed world, the highest rates of teenage pregnancy, higher inequality, etc. etc.

You'll excuse me if I prefer our model. Although, to be fair, I'd prefer the models of our more successful European neighbours which have substantially higher tax rates.

 

[AdladUK]

I have lived in other places other than the UK and at first it is a shock to be asked to pay this. Then you realise you have channels in the UK with no advertising whatsoever.

You have the BBC, that's it. Like I say you should not be forced to pay for a couple of channels, it should be optional. Plus they start sending investigators around if you own a TV or large computer monitor and don't have a license registered from what I hear, even if you have zero intention of watching the crap

 

[AdladUK]

Although, to be fair, I'd prefer the models of our more successful European neighbours which have substantially higher tax rates.

You are free to hand over all your hard earned money to your government like a good little boy, that is indeed your choice.

Have fun with that

 

[estebanrey]

You just made my point with your own post

"A nightclub bouncer telling me I can't wear trainers is a form of control"

Oh and a government telling you that you have to pay 50% of everything you make to them is not?

I'd say the latter example is far more scary

And saying X is a form of control is an empty statement. OK so taxation is a "form of control" (by which I mean a rule society tends to adhere to).

So what? It doesn't mean anything or provide any debate or solutions to just claim that taxation is a form of control.

 

[estebanrey]

You are free to hand over all your hard earned money to your government like a good little boy, that is indeed your choice.

Have fun with that

Yeah believing that people should contribute towards a better overall society is clearly stupid.

Whereas rampant survival of the fittest individualism has always worked and produced perfect societies with no problems.

P.S. You can make anything sound silly when you phrase it your way. That's right, you go off and only have sex with people over 16 like a good little boy. There you go, I just made paedophillia sound like the cooler choice.

 

[AdladUK]

So what? It doesn't mean anything or provide any debate or solutions to just claim that taxation is a form of control.

No actually getting your head out the sand and realizing that the plateau of taxes you pay and how you live week to week on barely anything left after paying the rent and bills kinda is.

And I don't know what you make or what you have saved, I'm just talking about the vast majority of Britons who have little to nothing in terms of savings etc.

 

[AdladUK]

P.S. You can make anything sound silly when you phrase it your way. That's right, you go off and only have sex with people over 16 like a good little boy. There you go, I just made paedophillia sound like the cooler choice.

And bringing murder rates and teenage pregnancy into a discussion about income tax is pretty silly too.

If you want to talk about a good society I would hardly use the UK as an example. Have you ever been out at night in your town or city? It's pretty damn scary

 

[starfighter]

Lauryn Hill does seem like abit of an idiot but The Fugees were great. Listen to "The Score" all the time.

 

[Woden]

And bringing murder rates and teenage pregnancy into a discussion about income tax is pretty silly too.

If you want to talk about a good society I would hardly use the UK as an example. Have you ever been out at night in your town or city? It's pretty damn scary

It is not silly at all, taxation pays for policing does it not? The UK is by no means perfect, but for the majority the quality of life is a fair whack better than the US.

 

[Mr Jack]

And bringing murder rates and teenage pregnancy into a discussion about income tax is pretty silly too.

What do you think happens to bring these things down? How do you think they're paid for?

Note: these are, of course, complex multi-facetted problems. I'm not suggesting that they can be distilled down to a single causal factor but non-the-less there are direct causal links between the US's low-tax, I'm-alright-jack, corporate-over-individual* approach and the high levels of social problems they experience.

* - and, make no mistake, that's what a low-tax, small-government approach is.

 

[AdladUK]

It is not silly at all, taxation pays for policing does it not? The UK is by no means perfect, but for the majority the quality of life is a fair whack better than the UK.

You're just making a broad comparison that it seems you have no real knowledge about.

Where in the US have you been? Where have you lived there? Okay yes there are some terrible parts, but there are in the UK too (Toxteth comes to mind). The US is 40 times bigger than the UK, so it's probably going to have a lot more crappy places too.

I have quite a few friends in the US who live in absolutely beautiful cities and they feel perfectly safe, so to them it's great.

Are you now suggesting the vast majority of the US is crime ridden?

 

[AdladUK]

What do you think happens to bring these things down? How do you think they're paid for?

Oh yes because increasing tax will decrease murder and teenage pregnancies! Jeez

What's the murder rate in Switzerland compared to here? Their maximum income tax rate is 13%.

From my experience living in the UK, teenage "women" act absolutely awful. Maybe that's because I lived 30 minutes North of Liverpool, but I've never seen people act with such little regard for those around them. Smoking and drinking whilst pushing prams, screaming, fighting, the list goes on. More tax won't change that

 

[Woden]

You're just making a broad comparison that it seems you have no real knowledge about.

Oh the irony!

Where in the US have you been? Where have you lived there? Okay yes there are some terrible parts, but there are in the UK too (Toxteth comes to mind). The US is 40 times bigger than the UK, so it's probably going to have a lot more crappy places too.

I have quite a few friends in the US who live in absolutely beautiful cities and they feel perfectly safe, so to them it's great.

Are you now suggesting the vast majority of the US is crime ridden?

Statistics, my good man, negate the need for visiting places to determine these things. In fact personal experience is bound to cloud judgement.
The average crime rate for the USA is higher than the UK's. Thats average, as in, not worrying about local areas, or population sizes etc. Because averages help us to get around that. Crappy places up the average crime rate, nicer ones lower it. They are also (usually) recorded per capita, negating population differences.

 

[Mr Jack]

Oh yes because increasing tax will decrease murder and teenage pregnancies! Jeez

Both are strongly linked to inequality so, yes, increasing progressive taxes will decrease them. However, that's a relatively small effect. The larger effect is the things that taxation can pay for.

 

[kwerk]

Genetics is what causes inequality.

 

[AdladUK]

Statistics, my good man, negate the need for visiting places to determine these things.

Yeah exactly that's your problem right there. Statistics cannot tell you everything.

States (and cities) vary vastly in the US... There are places I wouldn't go close to and there are places I'd feel safer than the UK in. You can't just put some "average number" on everything and think it gives a realistic picture of the actual situation.

This is kinda getting off point. If taxes were so effective at reducing murder and other things then the UK would be in a far better place than it is now.

There are a lot of other countries that have similar or less tax rates, with lower murder rates and lower crimes overall.

Since you like statistics and averages though...

Poland for example has 20% less max tax rate and a lower murder rate. Switzerland has virtually no murders and far lower taxes.

Anyway I have to go. Keep paying your taxes and maybe society will become a better place (yeah sure)