First Aid/CPR: Taught enough in Schools?

Slade2 · 22 Jun 2013 at 17:36

Robbiec053 said:
For something so simple that could possibly save somebody's life i'd much rather they taught first aid instead of half the stuff they teach.

As others have mentioned though there is implications for those that attempt CPR. Perhaps taking a leaf from the americans and introducing a good samaritan law would be an idea.

If you are trained by St Johns you are covered by there insurance to practice first aid outside of your workplace. In work would be cover by your employers liability insurance.

Xordium · 22 Jun 2013 at 17:36

Minstadave said:
There is so little need for lay people to use cardiac compressions in a paediatric arrest outside of hospital as cardiac arrest is so rare.

I find the idea of an asthmatic becoming effectively resucitatable with BLS once they've arrested highly unlikely, yes they may loose airway tone but their airways are so oedematous you won't shift any air with mouth to mouth. Normally they're hugely hyperexpanded.

Cardiac arrest in the paediatric is predominately respiratory derived as you say bar in groups such a renal and cardiac patients who are few in number. However, in a non-observed setting the respiratory arrest will have led to a cardiac arrest. Therefore, you need to shift any gas added to the area you need to effect ie lung to heart (in this case). Therefore, compression is still required. The problem was also the same as with adults that the lower compression rates didn't provide the necessary pressures to adequately perfuse.

Observed though is rather interesting though watching the Sa02 levels and the changes in HR. It's great to see physiology in action so clearly as long as you remember to bag when it gets too low. Not quite as much fun as flicking the nipride line and watching the ABP though.

On the asthmatic front you are correct that CPR is not going to be effective as we'd like but it can provide the necessary time for more adequate measures to arrive especially as the paediatric group is more resistant all around towards such depletion from a long-term point of view. My response was to the poster who said it was pointless. It isn't - it isn't totally effective - but it is adequate to buy the time one may require.

Xordium · 22 Jun 2013 at 17:37

Slade2 said:
If you are trained by St Johns you are covered by there insurance to practice first aid outside of your workplace. In work would be cover by your employers liability insurance.

It is also worth noting their have been no cases successfully pursued in this country. Reasonable measures with a rationale will not result in successful legal actions. It is a fear for many but not a realistic one.

Burnsy2023 · 22 Jun 2013 at 19:11

Rroff said:
Basic first aid probably should be taught from a young age but from the times I've heard the subject come up in conversation a lot of people are afraid of the implications of doing it wrong and either the outcome of that (making a situation worse or even killing someone) or getting sued.

As long as you do it in good faith you can't be sued. Attempt something, it is better then letting someone die.

areksnumbr1sxylady · 22 Jun 2013 at 19:56

Get mouth to mouth from a teen-age girl... If you survive, next thing will be getting sued for Pedophilia, If it was a boy... might as well blow your brains out

West · 22 Jun 2013 at 21:20

There's a scheme in Staffordshire doing it. I've taught it in a couple of schools to Staff and Students

Fenris · 22 Jun 2013 at 21:30

I learned first aid through Army Cadets years ago, since then I've never had to use CPR but I've dealt with people collapsing twice, one old lady on the high street and another girl on a train.

It is so easy to learn how check someones airways and put them in the recovery position that there really is no excuse not to know how to do it.

Though I do know how to perform CPR, I really don't know how I would respond to a situation in which it was actually necessary, even the girl on the train who collapsed a foot away from me scared me so much I just sat there looking at her for a good 10 seconds before I actually did anything, luckily she was breathing and her heartbeat was fine (as far as I knew) the experience still scared the **** out of me. Admittedly I was only ~16 at the time but still.

Rroff · 22 Jun 2013 at 21:47

Fenris said:
Though I do know how to perform CPR, I really don't know how I would respond to a situation in which it was actually necessary, even the girl on the train who collapsed a foot away from me scared me so much I just sat there looking at her for a good 10 seconds before I actually did anything, luckily she was breathing and her heartbeat was fine (as far as I knew) the experience still scared the **** out of me. Admittedly I was only ~16 at the time but still.

Yeah :| when I was at college I was studying with 2 other guys from my course when one had a mini stroke/fit and was foaming at the mouth and losing consciousness and it took me a full minute to get my head in the game. Fortunatly the other guy was a lifeguard so knew what to do while I went to get help.

Minstadave · 22 Jun 2013 at 22:27

You soon get used to it with time if you do a lot of resuscitation. Initially it's all adrenalin and panic, then you start to feel confident slowly and after a few years it almost becomes boring, the challenge becomes who is the coolest person in the room, rather than the actual resuscitation itself.

I don't break a sweat these days, was in A&E resusc this morning, still feel a buzz but have a bit of banter with the team and get the job done without too much bother.