Law bods got any idea on this one?

Eliot · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:12

Scenario:

There is a flash mob taking place in the centre of london. Lets say somewhere like Leicester square/covent garden/camden. One of those open and high public traffic places which have a number of performers/performances a day.

There are no signs or general rules in place about recording video in this area generally. I.e nothing on display.

There are tv cameras in the area also recording this event which will persumably be shown on television at a later date.
100s of people have their phones out and are recording the dance act.
One of the participants has signed a release form for the tv channel in question in advance of the performance which did not state anything about them or their family or friends recording the performance (presumably as it is in a public places with tens of thousands of people how have not paid to be there)
The release form seemed to be purely centered around allowing footage of you to be put on television.

A friend of the participant records this performance and uploads it to youtube with the title as "flash mob in xxxxxx (the location) and the date(today)"
It mentions no names or company names in the description or title

Is it legal to upload this to YouTube?
Is there any difference between uploading to facebook and uploading to youtube?

On Holiday · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:17

Fine to upload to both if you recorded it yourself, and not i.e. copied from the tv cameras/recording.

PooBrain · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:19

Link us to it when your done uploading squire?

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:22

As long as it is your recording and you own the material and it was filmed on public property, or private property with consent, it is up to you what you do with it.

Just make sure it isn't Trafalgar square as that's private property

Eliot · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:25

Is that really true? Didnt know that about trafalgar sq?

Girlfriends girly friend was recorder girlfriend took part. Some of the gang we were with were saying that you couldnt upload somehing like that which i personaly thought that as above was a load of bs but it wanted to check this was correct
So the girl took it down from youtube.
A few people have uploaded other videos of it to facebook however

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 17:28

Eliot said:
Is that really true? Didnt know that about trafalgar sq?

Girlfriends girly friend was recorder girlfriend took part. Some of the gang we were with were saying that you couldnt upload somehing like that which i personaly thought that as above was a load of bs but it wanted to check this was correct
So the girl took it down from youtube.
A few people have uploaded other videos of it to facebook however

I could be wrong but it's managed by the Greater London Authority and therefore filming without consent isn't allowed xD However tax payers do fund the Greater London Authority and therefore surely we should have the right to film baring in mind we pay for it...

Edit: Here we go it's a bylaw link. I can't believe it's against the bylaw to feed the birds without written permission of the Mayor -_-

AHarvey · 13 Jul 2013 at 18:27

Whole point of a flash mob is viral advertising...I think they'd be stupid to start giving a damn about people uploading to facebook, youtube etc

Hades · 13 Jul 2013 at 21:02

It's a public place and therefore the public are entitled to film. The person who films it holds the copyright and can therefore freely upload it.

arknor · 13 Jul 2013 at 21:49

(presumably as it is in a public places with tens of thousands of people how have not paid to be there)

lol if somone selling tickets to be in a flash mob?

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 21:50

Moses said:
You can't just stroll into court and film there, even though we pay for it .

Pretty sensible, no? If birds are fed it can lead to a (worse) pest problem.

That's true

arknor · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:06

as far as I'm concerned if it happens in a public place then it is public...

if you film it tough doo doo I've never heard of any concert videos being removed from youtube the ones filmed with mobile phones and cameras that can also do poor quality movies and they are a lot more private than a flash mob...

Vulcan · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:20

Moses said:
You can't just stroll into court and film there, even though we pay for it .

There difference is Trafalgar Square is still an open place so there is no responsible expectation of privacy there. They can't stop you from filming there, but if it is private property, they can ask you to leave.

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:29

Longbow said:
There difference is Trafalgar Square is still an open place so there is no responsible expectation of privacy there. They can't stop you from filming there, but if it is private property, they can ask you to leave.

Well, they can ask you kindly to stop filming but they can't forcefully take the camera out your hand

Vulcan · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:33

Hyburnate said:
Well, they can ask you kindly to stop filming but they can't forcefully take the camera out your hand

So yeah... as I said, they can't stop you. If they don't like you filming in the square they can ask you to leave, where you can continue filming on the pavement.

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:41

Longbow said:
So yeah... as I said, they can't stop you. If they don't like you filming in the square they can ask you to leave, where you can continue filming on the pavement.

Indeed

As most people do a little like filming anything else though.

unwashed potato! · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:47

unless i'm mistaken the person who recorded and put up the video wasn't ever involved in the release form that the person who was in the video signed? if so then why would a release form that person A signed have any ruling over person B simply because they know person A?

also surely it's just a release form and nothing else, it's not a contract for work or anything

Strife212 · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:48

4 (2).

Amazing

Hyburnate · 13 Jul 2013 at 22:52

It is indeed

A release form isn't needed in this case, I think it's only ever needed in certain cases where legislation comes in to play that covers it, I can't quite think of the name but the one that covers children does it

Edit: I don't think there is one actually unless it's indecent but then a release form wouldn't even come in to it

Amp34 · 13 Jul 2013 at 23:08

Hyburnate said:
As long as it is your recording and you own the material and it was filmed on public property, or private property with consent, it is up to you what you do with it.

Just make sure it isn't Trafalgar square as that's private property

Leicester square is also private property. You'll probably find Covent garden is too.

Edit: WRT Trafalgar square I think thats only commercial filming (ie tv crews filming shows and films) rather than a tourist filming events. Leicester square is actual privately owned, by a company not the gla afaik.

Eliot · 14 Jul 2013 at 18:17

Fairly sure the answer is no said:
unless i'm mistaken the person who recorded and put up the video wasn't ever involved in the release form that the person who was in the video signed? if so then why would a release form that person A signed have any ruling over person B simply because they know person A?

also surely it's just a release form and nothing else, it's not a contract for work or anything

Yeah i thought that would be the case too but i wanted to make sure all the facts were there