Is the haswell really worth the cash ??

[Treebo88]

Hello peeps, Sorry i didnt reply bin stupidly busy, In the end believe it or not i spotted a i5 rig at a car boot sale, said it was faulty and more than likely the hole thing was dead so he was selling as spares, bought it for £50 quid inc case psu etc, After days of fault finding i ripped it all out of the case and noticed as i was taking it out there was a mobo screw underneith the board creating contact with the case ... Much to my suprise when i installed it all back in properly and connected it up it booted !!! So installed a gpu and gave it to my friend for what i paid plus a crate of beers for my trouble best find EVER !!!

 

[WingZero30]

Agree with Steampunk. I've gone from my Q6600 to an i5 4670k and it is night and day different. Really awesome upgrade.

This would indeed be a huge upgrade. Enjoy your new cpu

 

[Flibbles]

It's definitely an upgrade if you're coming from an i7 920 or earlier gen cpu - I've noticed significant gains in just about everything. Not to mention the immediate gains if you're using a modern SSD, due to SATA3.

 

[panyan]

If you looked at the first post you'd notice that he said his friend wanted an i7.

i7-4770k is £263.99 (OEM)
i7-3770k is £269.99 (OEM)

Z87 HD3 is £95.99
Z77 HD3 is £79.99

The copy of GRID 2 included with the i7-4770k can be sold for around £10.

Total cost of Haswell = £349.98
Total cost of Ivybridge = £349.98

The exact same price.

well - in that case - haswell all the way

 

[WeedRamen]

I just saw the price of the of the i5 haswell - £198?! yeah it's a 10-15% performance increase but you don't just raise the price by 10-15% as well. I think these days 'future proofing' is a non issue since they change the board sockets so often these days the greedy turds.

 

[Marine-RX179]

To be honest, I can't help by feel the whole "high temp because of Intel using crappy paste making the chips run like a mini-oven" makes the Ivy and Haswell any better than the Sandy.

Yes "clock for clock", there's no doubt the the Ivy is around 10% faster than the Sandy, and the Haswell in turn is around 10% faster than the Ivy. However, people can run a i5 2500K to 4.8GHz without exceeding 65C with a semi-decent cooler, whereas Ivy and Haswell can only manage on 4.5GHz on average...and even on that lower clock and the top of the line CPU cooler, their temp is much higher, running into the 70C~low 80C zone.

I seriously don't know what Intel was thinking...

If I have to make a build again, it would make more sense to go for a 2nd hand i5 2500K bundle (CPU+motherboard+ram=around £175), costing less than even just the Haswell i5 CPU alone (Haswell CPU+motherboard+ram=around £320) and get pretty much the same performance due to the higher overclock without the heat concern. The £150 saved would be much better off spend toward the graphic card budget, which would make far more of an improvement to frame rate than the Haswell i5 has over (or not has over) the Sandy i5.

 

[TNA]

To be honest, I can't help by feel the whole "high temp because of Intel using crappy paste making the chips run like a mini-oven" makes the Ivy and Haswell any better than the Sandy.

Yes "clock for clock", there's no doubt the the Ivy is around 10% faster than the Sandy, and the Haswell in turn is around 10% faster than the Ivy. However, people can run a i5 2500K to 4.8GHz without exceeding 65C with a semi-decent cooler, whereas Ivy and Haswell can only manage on 4.5GHz on average...and even on that lower clock and the top of the line CPU cooler, their temp is much higher, running into the 70C~low 80C zone.

I seriously don't know what Intel was thinking...

If I have to make a build again, it would make more sense to go for a 2nd hand i5 2500K bundle (CPU+motherboard+ram=around £175), costing less than even just the Haswell i5 CPU alone (Haswell CPU+motherboard+ram=around £320) and get pretty much the same performance due to the higher overclock without the heat concern. The £150 saved would be much better off spend toward the graphic card budget, which would make far more of an improvement to frame rate than the Haswell i5 has over (or not has over) the Sandy i5.

Well that is an option if you are cash tight or always have to have best bang for buck. But I wanted the latest and got haswell and I don't think there are hardly any, if any Sandy Bridge chips owned by ocuk users who can beat my 4.7GHz OC. I could probably push 4.8GHz down the line, but right now i can't be asked with providing all the extra voltage needed. My temps never go above 60C in games, and all this without deliding.

My point is you could get a good chip, plus all the benefits of z87 mobos and even more importantly that feeling you get when you buy brand new tech.


Choices... Each to their own...

 

[Marine-RX179]

Well that is an option if you are cash tight or always have to have best bang for buck. But I wanted the latest and got haswell and I don't think there are hardly any, if any Sandy Bridge chips owned by ocuk users who can beat my 4.7GHz OC. I could probably push 4.8GHz down the line, but right now i can't be asked with providing all the extra voltage needed. My temps never go above 60C in games, and all this without deliding.

My point is you could get a good chip, plus all the benefits of z87 mobos and even more importantly that feeling you get when you buy brand new tech.


Choices... Each to their own...

The thing is...all these talks about the "benefits" or "features" of new board, they hardly make any real deference to users (I mean realistically, gamers in general only "need" SATA3, USB3, and whatever "new features" of the new chipset or board, they don't really make any difference other than the "feel good factor" of knowing they have something more (which they don't really need ).

I mean when we talk about 10-20% faster might seem a lot, but when looking at actual CPU benchmarks and frame rate for games, the differences between the i5 2500K and i5 4670K on the same clock is like for example in CPU demanding games, the 2500K does 25fps, and the 4670K does 28fps; and in non-CPU demanding games, the 2500K does 86fps, and the 4670K does 100fps.

As for your point on overclocking, as I said on "average" 4670K it would be 4.5-4.6GHz. So you were lucky enough to land a good chip which can clock to 4.7GHz (or may be even 4.8GHz as you claim), but the same can be said about the 2500K, but their average overclock is 4.6-4.8GHz, and 5GHz is doable if like you someone landed a good chip).

I mean there's no doubt clock for clock the 4670K is faster than the 2500K, but as far as overclocking goes, it's been generally agreed that the 4670K won't clock as high as the 2500K.

Another thing to consider is the the Haswell launch price has creep up comparing to the Sandy launch price from average £160~£170 to £190~£200, most likely due to the lack of competition from AMD's side.

 

[flopper]

from 2500k to the new board and 4.7ghz now windows 8 and my desktop works the way I want for the first time, its all quick. I attend that to the new motherboard and its features.
I bought a 7970 rather than upgrade to a Titan as for third the price due to no difference in actual practical gameplay with the games I play.
sold off the old 2500k and sits with a new computer for a nice balanced upgrade in price and performance.

if its worth it, for me absolutly.

 

[panyan]

To be honest, I can't help by feel the whole "high temp because of Intel using crappy paste making the chips run like a mini-oven" makes the Ivy and Haswell any better than the Sandy.

Yes "clock for clock", there's no doubt the the Ivy is around 10% faster than the Sandy, and the Haswell in turn is around 10% faster than the Ivy. However, people can run a i5 2500K to 4.8GHz without exceeding 65C with a semi-decent cooler, whereas Ivy and Haswell can only manage on 4.5GHz on average...and even on that lower clock and the top of the line CPU cooler, their temp is much higher, running into the 70C~low 80C zone.

I seriously don't know what Intel was thinking...

If I have to make a build again, it would make more sense to go for a 2nd hand i5 2500K bundle (CPU+motherboard+ram=around £175), costing less than even just the Haswell i5 CPU alone (Haswell CPU+motherboard+ram=around £320) and get pretty much the same performance due to the higher overclock without the heat concern. The £150 saved would be much better off spend toward the graphic card budget, which would make far more of an improvement to frame rate than the Haswell i5 has over (or not has over) the Sandy i5.

The thing is...all these talks about the "benefits" or "features" of new board, they hardly make any real deference to users (I mean realistically, gamers in general only "need" SATA3, USB3, and whatever "new features" of the new chipset or board, they don't really make any difference other than the "feel good factor" of knowing they have something more (which they don't really need ).

I mean when we talk about 10-20% faster might seem a lot, but when looking at actual CPU benchmarks and frame rate for games, the differences between the i5 2500K and i5 4670K on the same clock is like for example in CPU demanding games, the 2500K does 25fps, and the 4670K does 28fps; and in non-CPU demanding games, the 2500K does 86fps, and the 5670K does 100fps.

As for your point on overclocking, as I said on "average" 4670K it would be 4.5-4.6GHz. So you were lucky enough to land a good chip which can clock to 4.7GHz (or may be even 4.8GHz as you claim), but the same can be said about the 2500K, but their average overclock is 4.6-4.8GHz, and 5GHz is doable if like you someone landed a good chip).

I mean there's no doubt clock for clock the 4670K is faster than the 2500K, but as far as overclocking goes, it's been generally agreed that the 4670K won't clock as high as the 2500K.

Another thing to consider is the the Haswell launch price has creep up comparing to the Sandy launch price from average £160~£170 to £190~£200, most likely due to the lack of competition from AMD's side.

Although I agree with everthing youve said, i would have still advised the OP to go with haswell as he wanted that new tech smell

but im still holding onto my 2500k

 

[Steampunk]

It's a pretty simple couple of decisions with any new tech:

1. Does it do what you want?

2. Does it cost what you are willing to pay?

If the answer to either if those questions is "no" then the product is not right for you, and those answers are pretty subjective. Someone coming from an I7 Ivy is going to have pretty different ideas of what they want compared to someone who is upgrading from a Q6600. Someone who has a lot of spare cash to spend on their hobby and upgrades constantly is going to think differently from someone who has a budget and upgrades every five years.

 

[Marine-RX179]

Although I agree with everthing youve said, i would have still advised the OP to go with haswell as he wanted that new tech smell

but im still holding onto my 2500k

I mean quite honestly...I am quite willing to recommend the Haswell i5 even Sandy i5 (even for the higher price), if Intel bothered to sort the paste and temp issue out...

People should not have to get a brand new chip and have to delid the headspread and sort the paste out themselves for the sake of getting the chip to run at optimal temp (because of Intel didn't think it was important enough to solder the chip to the headspreader)...it's as if Intel has outsourced their CPU manufacturing to China

 

[TNA]

I mean quite honestly...I am quite willing to recommend the Haswell i5 even Sandy i5 (even for the higher price), if Intel bothered to sort the paste and temp issue out...

People should not have to get a brand new chip and have to delid the headspread and sort the paste out themselves for the sake of getting the chip to run at optimal temp (because of Intel didn't think it was important enough to solder the chip to the headspreader)...it's as if Intel has outsourced their CPU manufacturing to China

You say that, but my chip hardly ever goes above 60c in many games i have tested and stays low 70's when video encoding with handbreak, those temps are not that bad.

It is annoying what they have done, but the heat issue comes in either if you are running stability tests or giving chip too much volts. I guess also if you happen to get a dog of a chip.

 

[Ferrari100]

I got a 4770k.
The thing is a work horse.
Zips through premiere pro conversions like anything

 

[yannis76]

To answer the thread title.

If you're buying a full rig from scratch, yes (because of the reasons above)

If you upgrading from sandybridge/Ivybridge, no.

Exactly!

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

A certain large retailer was selling the Core i5 3570K for between £150 to £155 for a short while. At that point considering the socket 1155 motherboards are cheaper and the K series Haswell CPUs lack TSX,it really is not that great value.

If anything the Core i5 2500K could be had for under £160 frequently just like the Core i5 750 and Core i5 760. These CPUs were better value that the last two generation Core i5 CPUs IMHO. SB also did not need as good cooling too when compared to IB or Haswell.

The Core i5 4670K is now starting to hit nearly £200. With every generation Intel are upping the price bit by bit,and I would suspect the Core i5 5670K will be £200 or £200+ at this rate.

Then for adding HT they are now pushing the CPUs closer and closer to the £300 mark for a K series Core i7.

Intel has turned overclocking of their CPUs into some E-PEEN sport it seems for people who spend decent money on a CPU. The Core i3 530 was fantastic value and could be overclocked on cheap motherboards too,and it seems that was the end of an era.

 

[1Deep]

A certain large retailer was selling the Core i5 3570K for between £150 to £155 for a short while. At that point considering the socket 1155 motherboards are cheaper and the K series Haswell CPUs lack TSX,it really is not that great value.

If anything the Core i5 2500K could be had for under £160 frequently just like the Core i5 750 and Core i5 760. These CPUs were better value that the last two generation Core i5 CPUs IMHO. SB also did not need as good cooling too when compared to IB or Haswell.

The Core i5 4670K is now starting to hit nearly £200. With every generation Intel are upping the price bit by bit,and I would suspect the Core i5 5670K will be £200 or £200+ at this rate.

Then for adding HT they are now pushing the CPUs closer and closer to the £300 mark for a K series Core i7.

Intel has turned overclocking of their CPUs into some E-PEEN sport it seems for people who spend decent money on a CPU. The Core i3 530 was fantastic value and could be overclocked on cheap motherboards too,and it seems that was the end of an era.

+1

Intel have no real competition, rather annoying tbh.

I wish they hadn't limited the ability to overclock to just K series cpu's, it killed the ability to build a budget overclocking monster. I loved my old E2160, a £40 cpu that when overclocked gave a E6800 a run for it's money.

Can't do that now, real shame, but that's business I suppose.