Car Air Con Repair

smr · 16 Jul 2013 at 13:32

Hi all,

Had my Mondeo MK3 since 2008 and during that time I've never had the air con working but with the hot weather at the moment it's something I wouldn't mind having fixed.

I took it to one of these car audio places who happened to fix air con as well, they regassed the car and it was working fine for a day, the next morning I noticed a hissing sound from the car and realised immediately it must be a leak with the air con.

Took it back to the same place and they told me it would cost around £200-300 to repair as they'd need to take the car apart and see where the leak was coming from etc.

This sounded a bit steep to me ... were they just trying to rip me off or is this normal price for finding, diagnosing and fixing an air con leak?

Janesy B · 16 Jul 2013 at 13:38

I went to Ford and they diagnosed the issue for £50. They don't need to rip the car apart to find out what is wrong. If the leak is that bad it shouldn't have been regassed in the first place.

smr · 16 Jul 2013 at 13:42

Janesy B said:
I went to Ford and they diagnosed the issue for £50. They don't need to rip the car apart to find out what is wrong. If the leak is that bad it shouldn't have been regassed in the first place.

OK thanks, there wasn't an audible leak to begin with. I bought the car and it just didn't turn on iirc. The day after this place regassed it I heard the leak.

Will give Ford a call.

Just out of interest how long did it take for them to fix it ?

happy_2008 · 16 Jul 2013 at 13:42

All garages charge around £40 to perform a nitrogen dye test which should determine the leak unless its a tiny hairline crack. By the sound of your hissing noise, it may be a big crack in which the dye should be easily diagnosed.

Janesy B · 16 Jul 2013 at 13:46

smr said:
OK thanks, there wasn't an audible leak to begin with. I bought the car and it just didn't turn on iirc. The day after this place regassed it I heard the leak.

Will give Ford a call.

Just out of interest how long did it take for them to fix it ?

I didn't let them fix it because they wanted £500 to fit a new condenser but it only took them an hour to do the dye test and work out where the dye was leaking out.

paintguy · 16 Jul 2013 at 18:12

As above, a dye test should be your first (and cheapest) port of call.

A lot of the more reputable places will add dye as a matter of course when re-gassing (or even run a check first) to make later diagnosis easier (UV light and some funky yellow goggles

)

Orionaut · 16 Jul 2013 at 18:40

paintguy said:
As above, a dye test should be your first (and cheapest) port of call.

Cheapest port of call is a re-gas cannister from Halfords! (It often contains dye too)

Either it fixes it, in which case fine, or it doesn't, in which case you have a leak/bigger problems that you now know you will have to deal with.

Air Con guys turn their noses up at these (you are doing it by pressure rather than by evacuating it out and adding a precise amount of fresh gas) but I have successfully re-gassed several different vehicles over the years with no adverse issues.

It works best with vehicles whose gas pressure is low because of gradual normal leakage rather than gone completely (If the pressure is lost completely it is likely that you have significant leak and there is a danger that air/moisture might have contaminated the system. )

Biohazard · 16 Jul 2013 at 19:03

I take it that the dye washes off?

RJC · 16 Jul 2013 at 19:39

Orionaut said:
Cheapest port of call is a re-gas cannister from Halfords! (It often contains dye too)

Either it fixes it, in which case fine, or it doesn't, in which case you have a leak/bigger problems that you now know you will have to deal with.

Air Con guys turn their noses up at these (you are doing it by pressure rather than by evacuating it out and adding a precise amount of fresh gas) but I have successfully re-gassed several different vehicles over the years with no adverse issues.

It works best with vehicles whose gas pressure is low because of gradual normal leakage rather than gone completely (If the pressure is lost completely it is likely that you have significant leak and there is a danger that air/moisture might have contaminated the system. )

Problem is you should not be putting in refrigerant in a system which could possibly have a leak which is illegal - but yes who is actually going to find out and report you to the authorities!

Ideally is you should remove the gas charge and charge the correct weight, but I have done many systems by trim charging and checking the suction superheat and sub-cool. I use a electronic leak detector to check for leaks.

paintguy · 16 Jul 2013 at 19:45

Orionaut said:
Cheapest port of call is a re-gas cannister from Halfords! (It often contains dye too)

Either it fixes it, in which case fine, or it doesn't, in which case you have a leak/bigger problems that you now know you will have to deal with.

The fact that he can hear it hissing suggests a major problem and I doubt a gas cannister will cure it

Biohazard said:
I take it that the dye washes off?

I've only dealt with professional dyes through a recycling machine, but they are hardly noticeable without a UV light, and yes they clean off.

Ian_Eb · 16 Jul 2013 at 19:50

RJC said:
Problem is you should not be putting in refrigerant in a system which could possibly have a leak which is illegal - but yes who is actually going to find out and report you to the authorities!

I thought there were ever so slightly easier rules under F-Gas for mobile systems due to the movement?

With all the regulation, I am surprised that you can still just buy cans for cars.

RJC · 16 Jul 2013 at 20:56

Ian_Eb said:
I thought there were ever so slightly easier rules under F-Gas for mobile systems due to the movement?

Just checking the form below and its slightly ambiguous in their wording but you cant refill a system if there is abnormal leakage!

Service providers are not allowed to refill a system if it has shown abnormal leakage until the cause of leakage is identified and the necessary repair has been completed.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...ata/file/182577/fgas-mac3-key-obligations.pdf

Ian_Eb said:
With all the regulation, I am surprised that you can still just buy cans for cars.

Indeed since my apprenticeship I have been hammed in not to add refrigerant charge to a known leaking systems and going through my F-Gas the other year as well!

Ian_Eb · 16 Jul 2013 at 21:01

lol.

Sitting here at work running tests on detection sensors for sensitivity to groovy new gases

Tom_ed1987 · 16 Jul 2013 at 21:03

Was it still hissing when you went to the garage the 2nd time? They may have been able to hear roughly where it was leaking, and if it is a well hidden pipe that has corroded through the quote given could be reasonable to dismantle everything to replace it.

If they were just speculating based on what you told them, get a dye test done somewhere else as suggested. Many places include a UV dye in a standard regas these days.

It does wash off.

RJC · 16 Jul 2013 at 21:06

Ian_Eb said:
lol.

Sitting here at work running tests on detection sensors for sensitivity to groovy new gases

Nice!!

R1234-yf on there

Ian_Eb · 16 Jul 2013 at 21:09

Nope

just R407F at the moment.

Clarkey · 16 Jul 2013 at 21:15

Orionaut said:
Cheapest port of call is a re-gas cannister from Halfords! (It often contains dye too)

Either it fixes it, in which case fine, or it doesn't, in which case you have a leak/bigger problems that you now know you will have to deal with.

Air Con guys turn their noses up at these (you are doing it by pressure rather than by evacuating it out and adding a precise amount of fresh gas) but I have successfully re-gassed several different vehicles over the years with no adverse issues.

It works best with vehicles whose gas pressure is low because of gradual normal leakage rather than gone completely (If the pressure is lost completely it is likely that you have significant leak and there is a danger that air/moisture might have contaminated the system. )

This is a nonsense, the method is a total bodge, and you can have a proper evacuation and recharge done for cheaper than the silly bottle costs anyway.
Believe it or not, the evacuation and precise measurement of freon and oil is done for good reason.

ubersonic · 16 Jul 2013 at 22:21

Clarkey said:
This is a nonsense, the method is a total bodge, and you can have a proper evacuation and recharge done for cheaper than the silly bottle costs anyway.
Believe it or not, the evacuation and precise measurement of freon and oil is done for good reason.

I love the way the Halfrauds cans are something like 510g of gas, of which 425g is R134a+oil according to the contents

Psymonkee · 16 Jul 2013 at 22:27

Going through similar issues with my 2004, 53 plate Mondeo - 1 guy thought it was maybe the pressure sensors but didn't seem confident.

Garage ruled out sensors and a leak and think electrical and I've been told the ballpark figure could be £300.....