Did you agree with the Strike today?

Biohazard said:
Yeah, he is a bit of a tit isn't he.
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easyrider said:
That's why they are striking. Because of these changes.

If he resigns its still government policy
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Then they are not making the message across well.

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Raymond Lin said:
Sounds like they should push for his resignation more than anything else.
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They have:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-22002527

Even the head teachers:-

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/educatio...cks-headteachers-over-no-confidence-vote.html

Trouble is the Tory back benchers love him - proper right wing nationlist nut job - they'd have him as thier next leader given half the job. He'd be more of a liability than Boris the loon!

Raymond Lin said:
Then they are not making the message across well.
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They are giving the message out perfectly clear - it's not their fault the media have a different agenda :rolleyes:
 
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RDM said:
Yeah but you said it would be showing the kids a good example, unless the proper reasons for the strike are explained to the kids (and currently it isn't being) then they aren't really showing the kids a good example.
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Aren't you assuming that it isn't being used as a learning experience. At the very least it will teach the children to parrot repeat any political clap trap their parents rant at them and then to propagate it. Therefore, at the very least it teaches them how to vote as adults.
 
Xordium said:
Aren't you assuming that it isn't being used as a learning experience. At the very least it will teach the children to parrot repeat any political clap trap their parents rant at them and then to propagate it. Therefore, at the very least it teaches them how to vote as adults.
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Yup.

One of my most memorable days at high school was "Trade Union" day.

Except I made a mistake and ended up volunteering to speak at the rostrum on 6 separate issues! Still, got a standing ovation at the end - probably explains where I've found myself today!
 
Biohazard said:
Can anyone explain to me how PRP would work in teaching?
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No one can because it wont work.

Teachers performance should be based on assessment, observation and responsibility, not pupil results (or the even more horrendous criteria of "parental feedback").

How on earth can you set a target that says "every pupil will make 3 points progress". That's not SMART is it?

PRP for teaching is a collection of the worst facets of performance related pay.

Fortunately most schools have adopted the NUT reconmendations on PRP - which Goove had the cheek to pronounce illegal! Wasn't the whole point of the reforms to give schools more choice over pay? Choice as long as it aligns with his ideology more like.
 
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amigafan2003 said:
Yup.

One of my most memorable days at high school was "Trade Union" day.

Except I made a mistake and ended up volunteering to speak at the rostrum on 6 separate issues! Still, got a standing ovation at the end - probably explains where I've found myself today!
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Disenfranchised from politics and disolusioned about the state of the trade union movement?

;) :p
 
amigafan2003 said:
I didn't say worthless - just less valuable. You'll get a job after all the "4 year" candidates have been snapped up - there are still more vacancies in teaching than there are students so it's a guaranteed job at the end of the day. I do wonder why there aren't more students than vacancies though if it's such a great profession with excellent perks etc?
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I am not even sure if anyone offers a four year course in my subject. Certainly nowhere close. As to why not teaching? CompSci degree can earn you a lot more, especially a First, outside of teaching.

amigafan2003 said:
You're probably looking at teaching in a deprived area so that's why they're keen to pull PGCE candidates in. And that's why they offer training placements as guarantees for PGCEs as "4 years" can go where they like.
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Again, not really seeing that.

amigafan2003 said:
PS - if you haven't figured it out by now, my wife is a teacher (deputy head). As are her parents. And my cousin. And both my Aunt and Uncle. And another Aunt. And my sister is training to be a TA. And I'm a Governor. Of two schools.
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Maybe it differs by location, or are they Primary, for which BEd tends to be the normal choice of route in?
 
amigafan2003 said:
No one can because it wont work.

Teachers performance should be based on assessment, observation and responsibility, not pupil results (or the even more horrendous criteria of "parental feedback").

How on earth can you set a target that says "every pupil will make 3 points progress". That's not SMART is it?

PRP for teaching is a collection of the worst facets of performance related pay.

Fortunately most schools have adopted the NUT reconmendations on PRP - which Goove had the cheek to pronounce illegal! Wasn't the whole point of the reforms to give schools more choice over pay? Choice as long as it aligns with his ideology more like.
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Could be worse, it could be PMR! (The old stack ranking rebranded).

Changing the goalposts doesn't even cover it when 'quotas' are introduced with retrospective KPI adjustments to match, often in conflict with guidance.

That isn't running something, that's driving it into the ground.

No wonder they started charging for ETs!

:rolleyes:
 
RDM said:
I am not even sure if anyone offers a four year course in my subject. Certainly nowhere close. As to why not teaching? CompSci degree can earn you a lot more, especially a First, outside of teaching.
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Sorry - I should have clarified - yes I meant Bachelor of Education.

Maybe it differs by location, or are they Primary, for which BEd tends to be the normal choice of route in?
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yes, I'm coming from the perspective of primary teaching. You do find most of the PGCE candidates go to Senior schools.


Thanks for the discussion.
 
amigafan2003 said:
Sorry - I should have clarified - yes I meant Bachelor of Education.



yes, I'm coming from the perspective of primary teaching. You do find most of the PGCE candidates go to Senior schools.


Thanks for the discussion.
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Secondary is a completely different beast, the main routes in are PGCE or School Direct (doing a PGCE).
 
Biohazard said:
Could be worse, it could be PMR! (The old stack ranking rebranded).

Changing the goalposts doesn't even cover it when 'quotas' are introduced with retrospective KPI adjustments to match, often in conflict with guidance.

That isn't running something, that's driving it into the ground.

No wonder they started charging for ETs!

:rolleyes:
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Oh god - don't even get me started on "bell curves"!

As for charging for ET's - so much for justice for all eh?

Who's going to risk £1300 on a claim when they've just been made redundant and worrying about how they are going to pay their bills? At least the Tories have made a good case for joining a union as they'll pay the ET fees.
 
amigafan2003 said:
Oh god - don't even get me started on "bell curves"!

As for charging for ET's - so much for justice for all eh?

Who's going to risk £1300 on a claim when they've just been made redundant and worrying about how they are going to pay their bills? At least the Tories have made a good case for joining a union as they'll pay the ET fees.
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It's not guaranteed, they can certainly always provide someone with relevent training and experience to act as your representative but the funding - as I understand it - isn't automatic. It is on a case by case basis.

Which is better than nothing, and typically they will try to take forward cases that will, by way of setting precedent, have wider positive implications for members and staff.
 
Biohazard said:
It's not guaranteed, they can certainly always provide someone with relevent training and experience to act as your representative but the funding - as I understand it - isn't automatic. It is on a case by case basis.

Which is better than nothing, and typically they will try to take forward cases that will, by way of setting precedent, have wider positive implications for members and staff.
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Yes - maybe I over egged the pudding - they'll only fund the case if it has a realistic chance of success (and we all know how backwards some of the ET rulings were even before the fees were introduced) but the unions wouldn't support vexatious claims before so it wont really change any claims going forward now. It was a myth and Unions pushed forward speculative cases prior to the fees - there were numerous costs involved before fees were introduced (subsistence costs for officers, travel allowances, legal advice etc) - and unions hate spending money as much as any other business.

Still, my point stands about ET fees actually strengthening the case for union membership - both as mechanism for avoiding an ET claim in the first instance and failing that fee re-imbursement if the former fails.

Interestingly, we're about to lodge our first ET after the changes.
 
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darael said:
Assuming a 365 day year, you work for only 195 days a year. So, if we disregard the 28 days paid annual leave that full time workers are entilted to, what do you do in the other 142 days?

If you worked in England, outside London, or Wales then your pay range is from £21,804 to £31,868.

Let's say you worked 08:00-18:00 5 days a week. That's 50 hours/week, or 195 days x 10 hours = 1,950 hours. With a £26,836 ((21804+31868)/2) salary that's just over £13.76/hour - over double the minmum wage.

Doesn't seem that bad, if you ask me.

Salary and hours information taken from here: http://www.education.gov.uk/get-into-teaching/salary/pay-and-benefits
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The hours are wrong. All full time teachers I know end up doing about 3-5 hours a day on top of their 8-5pm hours, lesson planning, marking, etc.
 
twoblacklines said:
The hours are wrong. All full time teachers I know end up doing about 3-5 hours a day on top of their 8-5pm hours, lesson planning, marking, etc.
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Rubbish! 3-5hrs a week maybe but not that amount of uninterrupted additional work each day. They may say "I did 3hr of marking last night" when what they mean is that they say in front of Eastenders, Corrie and Bakeoff while ticking through some exercise books with a red biro.

Not many teachers are going to say they feel adequatley remunerated for the work they do as the trend, over the last 40 years at least, is for the image of the poor underappreciated teacher.
 
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