working for your dole......

[realBabelfish]

WE dont deal with it the claimant has to deal with his own situation and he has a year to sort something out, very reasonble. That is the whole point. There has to be a time limit to combat the life long depedants.I cant think of any other solution to that problem. If its done in a staggerd manner then it shouldnt lead to drastic increases in social problems. Eventually the state won't have any money left and then the consequnces to social problema may be worse than if they implemented a time limit on all welfare benefits. There is no reasonble justification for giving poeple free houses for their entire lives and often the lives of several generations that follow. We are up to 4 or 5 generations now, of people who have received free houses, frew healhcare, free education, free salary and free child benefits and free etc. Oboviously that cant go on for ever.


sorry for spelling and grammer typing on nexus 7 and its rubbish for typing.

but how will this work when there are millions more unemployed than there are jobs available.

the people at the bottom will always struggle to get the jobs as the people with better quals/experience will always get them.

 

[realBabelfish]

I have been working 30 hours a week(only had to do a minimum of 20) for the past 5 weeks for my dole money at B&Q, it is something i offered to do because i would rather work for my dole money then be classed as a lazy **** who sits at home all day. It has given a lot of confidence, met loads of great people and more importantly recent work experience.

It has been one of the best things I have done recently. They are saying I am fantastic at my job and got me to fill in a job app today

nice one mate. when do they teach you all to vanish when a customer needs something?

every time i go in my local one i see loads of staff but as soon as i need something its like they all hide in the wardrobes or something

 

[realBabelfish]

Don't have time to go through all the new posts since I last read but these are two points I want to pick up on -

Increase minimum wage!

Minimum wages reduce competitiveness, which is something we can ill afford. Low value labour can be sent overseas to save costs if we increase it too much.

Germany doesn't have a minimum wage, which is one of the factors in it's success.

I can't afford to rent on minimum wage

So move in with someone. Stop living beyond your means and learn to cut your cloth to fit your means. There will be plenty of spare rooms available now that we have the spare room 'tax'.

germany also has massive industries and capped rents.

sure, keep wages low but then dont fleece workers with high rent.

my mortgage on a 4 bed house in a nice village in lincolnshire (bought 2 years ago) is LESS than my mate is paying to rent a 3 bed terrace house in a ****** area of hull. the rent he pays would buy that house outright in 10 years tops

when you compare other countries you need to look at more than 1 thing.

 

[realBabelfish]

I'm not sure what your point is here. What are you saying? So what exactly do you do to help? Were you there in Manchester, on a union organised anti-tory march that had more to do with party politics than anything else? A march organised by the unions, who symbolise the everything for nothing culture.

Also, I can't take credit for the "rage bubble", I think you've just invented that yourself through slightly dodgy reading comprehension.

unions support workers. hardly the something for nothing lot are they?

without unions how much do you think us peasants would earn from the landowners? (and who gave them the land anyway?)

im not saying unions are all good, but they have helped many over the years.

 

[FoxEye]

germany also has massive industries and capped rents.

sure, keep wages low but then dont fleece workers with high rent.

my mortgage on a 4 bed house in a nice village in lincolnshire (bought 2 years ago) is LESS than my mate is paying to rent a 3 bed terrace house in a ****** area of hull. the rent he pays would buy that house outright in 10 years tops

when you compare other countries you need to look at more than 1 thing.

Exactly. Not only do places like France have capped rents, tenants also have a lot more protections than they do here. They have a huge amount of rights and the landlords have a huge amount of liabilities, and services that they must provide to the tenant.

In this country you can have a damp, festering 1-up-1-down, and an unscrupulous landlord could want 1/2 your wages for the privilege of living there. Whilst he can also get away with a ridiculously low standard of maintenance or basic appliances.

People on the continent would be appalled if they had to rent here.

 

[realBabelfish]

Sounds like a lie to me

thats up to you. but its the truth. was maybe 12 years ago though so hopefully more intelligent about this now. sad thing is he would have aced it too. it was in Hull btw

 

[Schlong&Stable]

germany also has massive industries and capped rents.

sure, keep wages low but then dont fleece workers with high rent.

my mortgage on a 4 bed house in a nice village in lincolnshire (bought 2 years ago) is LESS than my mate is paying to rent a 3 bed terrace house in a ****** area of hull. the rent he pays would buy that house outright in 10 years tops

when you compare other countries you need to look at more than 1 thing.

My understanding was Germany did not have rent control prior to the recent election, as this was a policy Merkel was suggesting she'd introduce.

Most Germans DO live in state housing, which might be why they have 'capped' rents, but then they also have the second lowest rate of home ownership in Europe. So is that really a model we should aspire to?

 

[realBabelfish]

My understanding was Germany did not have rent control prior to the recent election, as this was a policy Merkel was suggesting she'd introduce.

Most Germans DO live in state housing, which might be why they have 'capped' rents, but then they also have the second lowest rate of home ownership in Europe. So is that really a model we should aspire to?

i guess that depends

over here owning a home is saving for the future. but if i could pay much less to rent and put that money away for later then thats fine. the problem we have is that renting is very expensive and actually more costly than buying.

i thought it was a much older law in germany?

 

[TheLegendOfMart]

thats up to you. but its the truth. was maybe 12 years ago though so hopefully more intelligent about this now. sad thing is he would have aced it too. it was in Hull btw

They aren't.

They like to send people on "gateway to work" courses which consist of telling people:

• How to read a job advert
• How to put things in envelopes
• Make sure to have a shower before you go to interview
• Make sure to put some clean clothes on

I was volunteering with an IT company that worked with charities giving them free computers, setting them up, etc.. they were just about to pay for me to get some qualifications in a field I know lots about but don't have the piece of paper that says I do when the job center told me I had to go on a 12 week "course" which consisted of me sitting in a room from 8 till 4, mon-fri, with 10 computers along the wall and 30-40 people all sat round twiddling their thumbs until they could get on a computer and do job search for hours.

The DWP/Job Center don't give a crap about anyone, you have to do what your told, when you are told to do it regardless of your situation, they are just itching to sanction you and when they do you STILL have to jump through hoops for them or risk getting sanctioned up to 3 years.

I lost my place at the IT company and the chance of getting a decent qualification just so the job center can make it seem they are trying to get people into work. When in reality the companies that win contracts get paid to take people on regardless of if they help them or not.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

i guess that depends

over here owning a home is saving for the future. but if i could pay much less to rent and put that money away for later then thats fine. the problem we have is that renting is very expensive and actually more costly than buying.

i thought it was a much older law in germany?

Well it depends how much the difference is, but generally speaking a mortgage is always better than rent.

For example if I pay £500 for a mortgage and you pay £250 for a rent. Over 10 years you'll have £30k more than me in your pocket, but no assets. I'll have £30k less in my pocket, but a £60k asset. So in effect, I am £30k up as I could liquidate my asset and start renting.

Obviously there is interest and house prices to consider, but I am excluding those as argubally they could be either good or bad for the scenario.

But anyway, I think you'll find German rental prices are similar to our own. Google it.

 

[anything I don't mind]

half the problem is the people at the state offices that can't see the (or refuse) to see the difference between people who legitimately need JSA and others who do it for a living. They need to be reasonable and use their common sense when implementing policies, the goal should be to get people off JSA not to follow policies without thinking about specific circumstances.

I also agreed with what some other people have said in that if people are working they should be paid for it, the same rate at which the market would be paying for it. if they are going to be doing work that otherwise would have been in the makret , that is only going to exasperate the problem as it would be taking jobs that would be in the market, thus further decreasing the jobs that are available and worse reducing them and reducing the rate at which that job is paid in the market. If they are going to invent state jobs for them to do only, that would have otherwise not existed then they have to be careful not to create jobs for the sake of jobs.

increasing minimum wage will lead to less jobs being available in the market and further increase unemployment.

 

[FoxEye]

Well it depends how much the difference is, but generally speaking a mortgage is always better than rent.

For example if I pay £500 for a mortgage and you pay £250 for a rent. Over 10 years you'll have £30k more than me in your pocket, but no assets. I'll have £30k less in my pocket, but a £60k asset. So in effect, I am £30k up as I could liquidate my asset and start renting.

Obviously there is interest and house prices to consider, but I am excluding those as argubally they could be either good or bad for the scenario.

But anyway, I think you'll find German rental prices are similar to our own. Google it.

That way of thinking only works if you can guarantee house prices. Which it seems you can atm. But future governments might decide to stop propping up the housing bubble, your house value could dramatically fall (or normalise, as I would call it).

Ultimately if house prices keep rising, an ever growing number of us will not be able to get a mortgage, period. And the idea of being in debt servitude for the rest of my life doesn't exactly appeal either.

Time to emigrate soon, I think.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

My understanding was Germany did not have rent control prior to the recent election, as this was a policy Merkel was suggesting she'd introduce.

Most Germans DO live in state housing, which might be why they have 'capped' rents, but then they also have the second lowest rate of home ownership in Europe. So is that really a model we should aspire to?

Yes, absolutely.

I don't get the hang up with owning your own home. In Germany you can rent a house on fixed length leases (upto 25 years) and a 3 bed semi equates to about £400 pcm. That's a system worth aspiring to imho.

But anyway, I think you'll find German rental prices are similar to our own. Google it.

I did - and you're wrong. For example - 3 bed apartment in capital city (Berlin) is 800eur. Same in London is 1600eur.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

increasing minimum wage will lead to less jobs being available in the market and further increase unemployment.

Fallacy. That's been trotted out by the capitalists every time a country has introduced a min wage and it's never happened.

Worth re-using again:-

 

[Schlong&Stable]

That way of thinking only works if you can guarantee house prices. Which it seems you can atm. But future governments might decide to stop propping up the housing bubble, your house value could dramatically fall (or normalise, as I would call it).

Ultimately if house prices keep rising, an ever growing number of us will not be able to get a mortgage, period. And the idea of being in debt servitude for the rest of my life doesn't exactly appeal either.

It is unlikely property values outside of London would drop very much, because there is high demand. Unless something drastic happens to the economy, it also seems unlikely there will be a massive price drop inside London either. Especially with so many foreign buyers looking to snap up a London portfolio.

We MAY have another credit bubble brewing in the form of low-deposit mortgages for new buyers, but with banks having to capitalise themselves far higher than before and the government guaranteeing the mortgages, I am not sure this could impact us to the same degree as 2008.

And mortgages are cheaper than rent now, so anyone who can afford to rent can probably afford a mortgage. The problem most buyers have is getting a deposit, as saving £10k is a big job for a young couple living hand to mouth. I don't think housing is that big an issue in the longrun.

Yes, absolutely.

I don't get the hang up with owning your own home. In Germany you can rent a house on fixed length leases (upto 25 years) and a 3 bed semi equates to about £400 pcm. That's a system worth aspiring to imho.

Care to source that? It's not that I don't believe you, it's just my own sources say otherwise.

It doesn't change much though, it's still better to be paying a mortgage than rent, no matter how long the period. When you reach 65 and your income drops, you don't want to be paying rent.. you want your property secure and as an asset to pass onto your kids when you die.

 

[Rroff]

Definitely think there needs to be better distinction made between the unlucky and lazy as someone said above.

Also not a fan of the whole make them work for their benefits, yada yada attitude as again it doesn't distinguish very well and from my albeit brief experience does more to hinder people who are genuinely trying to find work than it does help them. On the flipside though I do think there should be more done to get people up and out and doing stuff as a fair few people stagnate in that situation and get into a locked in circle they are unable to break out of.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

Work for ma dole, whaaa??? you madting?

 

[realBabelfish]

i got forced to do a job search course. the tutor bloke had such a basic grasp of english it was embarrassing (and he was english too). the CV he got me to write was garbage. in he end i ended up teaching everyone how to write one as i had better skills than him.

if people like that are responsible for people finding jobs heaven help us all.

 

[areksnumbr1sxylady]

i got forced to do a job search course. the tutor bloke had such a basic grasp of english it was embarrassing (and he was english too). the CV he got me to write was garbage. in he end i ended up teaching everyone how to write one as i had better skills than him.

if people like that are responsible for people finding jobs heaven help us all.

With that kind of grammar coming from you, I guess the tutor bloke did not speak a word of English??

 

[realBabelfish]

Well it depends how much the difference is, but generally speaking a mortgage is always better than rent.

For example if I pay £500 for a mortgage and you pay £250 for a rent. Over 10 years you'll have £30k more than me in your pocket, but no assets. I'll have £30k less in my pocket, but a £60k asset. So in effect, I am £30k up as I could liquidate my asset and start renting.

Obviously there is interest and house prices to consider, but I am excluding those as argubally they could be either good or bad for the scenario.

But anyway, I think you'll find German rental prices are similar to our own. Google it.

its not even that comparable. my last house i was paying mortgage of £330 but could rent it out for £550. new house its £480 and i could rent it out for nearly £1k.