The Ashes 2013-14: Australia v England [21st Nov - 2nd Feb] *** spoilers ***

[Yas786]

Shock to see Trott leave the tour for stress :/...from what i saw of him, he looked scared as hell out there.

Hope he gets better soon...he could very well turn out to be the next Trescothick if England arent careful and treat him properly.

 

[Yas786]

Aussies win one game and the arrogance starts from their players, lets not forget who's been dominated in recent years.

Get well Soon Trott.

Even when they were losing they still had an air of arrogance about them, thats what made them one of the best teams in the world. Fact is England have dominated the Aussies in recent years but on the otherhand, lets not forget it took England nearly 20 odd years before they could beat the Aussies easily.

Nothing wrong with arrogance imho, its how you use it to rattle the other team and the Aussies are bloody good at it.

 

[One More Solo]

I think at Trott's age that will be it, realistically. It seems very similar to the Tresco situation.

Nice to see class runs in the whole Warner family... not

 

[Locky]

Even when they were losing they still had an air of arrogance about them, thats what made them one of the best teams in the world. Fact is England have dominated the Aussies in recent years but on the otherhand, lets not forget it took England nearly 20 odd years before they could beat the Aussies easily.

Nothing wrong with arrogance imho, its how you use it to rattle the other team and the Aussies are bloody good at it.

Banter on the pitch is fine, but taking it to a personal level like the Aussies did is much much different.

 

[manic111]

Banter on the pitch is fine, but taking it to a personal level like the Aussies did is much much different.

Yes and no. Warner pretty much came out and said that Trott looked scared and was mentally weak. He looked exactly that, and it wasn't that ridiculous a thing to say, given how poorly he was fending off fast bowling.

I can understand why the England camp didn't like it, particularly in light of this morning's revelations, but it was far from the worst thing I've ever heard.

As for the stuff said by Michael Clarke, I've played cricket to a reasonable level and have heard far worse chat on the pitch.

 

[Yas786]

Banter on the pitch is fine, but taking it to a personal level like the Aussies did is much much different.

I kinda agree with you, i think the personal stuff said on the pitch isnt needed and Clarke getting fined for his match fee was the right punishment imho.

But as i said, this is how the Aussies dominate other teams mentally. I dont agree with it but its how they are.

Fact is poor ikkle England need to toughen up otherwise they are going to get spanked if they let the Aussies get on top of them mentally and physically.

2nd test should be another good match between the 2, still think England have that little bit more quality bowling and batting wise in their team.

 

[manic111]

I kinda agree with you, i think the personal stuff said on the pitch isnt needed and Clarke getting fined for his match fee was the right punishment imho.

He told Jimmy that he's going to have his arm broken. Obviously (I assume), this was not a threat to assault him in the night, so all it meant was "we're going to bowl really fast at you". I don't see the problem.

 

[a1ex2001]

Gutted for Trott, clearly he looked shot for a deeper reason hope he gets back to a place where he is happy even if that doesn't mean him playing top class international cricket again. Mental illness is a cruel thing and will be a real battle for him to overcome.

Not sure where this leaves England, none of the options in the squad fill me with optimism! It looks likely that Bell will move to three with Bairstow or Ballance comming in down the order, if they go that way it has to be Ballance as I think Bairstow has had his chance for now and needs to go and get some runs in county cricket before England consider him as a specialist batsman again. Personally I'd get Compton in from the develoment squad and play him at number 3 he is more of a like for like replacement and a lower risk option. Don't think we can afford to go for the extra bowler with to many question marks overthe form of the front line batsmen and Prior looking like a revolving door to the tail.

 

[Sankari]

I kinda agree with you, i think the personal stuff said on the pitch isnt needed and Clarke getting fined for his match fee was the right punishment imho.

I agree with that, and frankly England is just as bad as Australia when it comes to this kind of talk (particularly Anderson) so they can't claim the moral high ground or take refuge in appeals to fragility.

In my view, sledging is stupid and immature. It goes far beyond mere banter and becomes too personal, too quickly. I think it's against the spirit of the game and should be banned completely.

Players should let their bat & ball do the talking.

 

[manic111]

I agree with that, and frankly England is just as bad as Australia when it comes to this kind of talk (particularly Anderson) so they can't claim the moral high ground or take refuge in appeals to fragility.

In my view, sledging is stupid and immature. It goes far beyond mere banter and becomes too personal, too quickly. I think it's against the spirit of the game and should be banned completely.

Players should let their bat & ball do the talking.

Interesting view for an Aussie

I disagree almost entirely - cricket, particularly between bowler and batsman, is one of the most combative sports around, and sledging is part of the game, just like the (usually atrocious) trash talk is in boxing, or the mind games between managers is in football.

Some of the greatest battles between bowler and batsman have had sledging at their heart. Getting rid of it would be to remove a huge chunk of cricket's personality.

 

[oli collett]

I agree with that, and frankly England is just as bad as Australia when it comes to this kind of talk (particularly Anderson) so they can't claim the moral high ground or take refuge in appeals to fragility.

In my view, sledging is stupid and immature. It goes far beyond mere banter and becomes too personal, too quickly. I think it's against the spirit of the game and should be banned completely.

Players should let their bat & ball do the talking.

Agreed, I thought it was daft that Clarke got fined as I suspect there was as much coming from Anderson, just it wasn't picked up by the TV!

 

[a1ex2001]

Agreed, I thought it was daft that Clarke got fined as I suspect there was as much coming from Anderson, just it wasn't picked up by the TV!

Everything is recorded via the stump mikes so if Anderson was giving it large then that will be on record. It wasn't reported by the TV it was one of the on field and the third umpires that reported it.

Sledging for me is part of the game but the Aussies are widly regarded as taking it to far, personally I'd like to see England blank it out and get on with the game sledging only has any effect if you let it and for me they should be much more foccussed on hitting the bad ball and surving the rest than getting involved in cheap insult trading.

 

[Sankari]

Interesting view for an Aussie

I'm atypical, and proud of it.

Cricket is a gentleman's game. That doesn't preclude aggression and banter, but it should mean a high standard of sportsmanship.

Agreed, I thought it was daft that Clarke got fined as I suspect there was as much coming from Anderson, just it wasn't picked up by the TV!

I thought it was reasonable. Clarke shouldn't have said what he did in the first place—regardless of whether or not a mic was nearby—and if he wanted Anderson penalised he should have appealed to the umpires.

It wasn't reported by the TV it was one of the on field and the third umpires that reported it.

It's on YouTube. Direct video straight from the TV, complete with commentators' response (click here). The TV station didn't 'report it'; they broadcasted it live!

but the Aussies are widly regarded as taking it to far, personally I'd like to see England blank it out and get on with the game sledging only has any effect if you let it and for me they should be much more foccussed on hitting the bad ball and surving the rest than getting involved in cheap insult trading.

^^ This.

 

[Yas786]

He told Jimmy that he's going to have his arm broken. Obviously (I assume), this was not a threat to assault him in the night, so all it meant was "we're going to bowl really fast at you". I don't see the problem.

Well of course it wasnt a threat to assault him, it was just a warning that my guy is going to bowl stupid fast at you ie trying to make him a bit nervous.

Evangelion is right though, its ok for England to talk their rubbish and no one says anything but yet when its the Aussies...the media and everyone gets on their backs about it.

Fact is if you can dish out then be prepared to get some back as well and dont cry about it. Just laugh it off if you can and get on with the game. Personally if Clarke said that to me, i would have laughed and said alright mate, lets 'ave some then then promptly smack him for a 4 or a 6

 

[manic111]

I'm atypical, and proud of it.

Cricket is a gentleman's game. That doesn't preclude aggression and banter, but it should mean a high standard of sportsmanship.

I totally agree with that. I love cricket and, for the most part, believe that it is played by good people. Particularly when I played for my university, the banter was occasionally pretty vicious, but it was an awful lot of fun - you realised that most of the people giving you chat had never met you before, were doing it purely to wind you up, and you got on with it, before going for a beer with the opponents after the game.

I appreciate that it may be different for a professional, whose job it is to score runs, it may be different. It will, I imagine weigh much more heavily on them if they are out of nick, but by and large what is said is still banter - look at the 2005 series, when Lee and Flintoff were taking chunks out of each other.

There are certain things that cross the line. Andrew Symond's racism in 2007, for instance. However, in my opinion what was said by both Clarke and Warner were about things which were going on on the pitch. Clarke was saying "we'll be bowling hard and fast", and Warner was saying that Trott looked like he was struggling mentally. Both were true. For me, that sort of chat is far more gentlemanly than the "your mum/wife/belly" jokes which have proved so popular down the years.

 

[Sankari]

Personally if Clarke said that to me, i would have laughed and said alright mate, lets 'ave some then then promptly smack him for a 4 or a 6

Except you wouldn't be facing Clarke, you'd be facing Johnson—and he'd probably have your eye out with a bouncer.

 

[Yas786]

Except you wouldn't be facing Clarke, you'd be facing Johnson—and he'd probably have your eye out with a bouncer.

Well thats what i meant to say, Johnson rather than Clarke.

Nah id just run like a little girl soon as he started his run up

 

[manic111]

Except you wouldn't be facing Clarke, you'd be facing Johnson—and he'd probably have your eye out with a bouncer.

He'd only have your eye out if he was aiming for your arm

 

[Sankari]

He'd only have your eye out if he was aiming for your arm

 

[Rich_L]

It's a real shame about Trott - huge loss if he was on form but he hasn't been for a while now so an opportunity for one of the young lads to step up now. Puts a bit more pressure on us too for the next Test and good performances needed from the more experienced players.

I don't have any problem with what Warner said - I remember Johnson being thrashed all over the ground not too long ago and I can't remember a huge amount of sympathy for him at the time