!MUSLIM SAMWICH ARMYGEDDON!

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<5% so why all the kerfuffle?

The kerfuffle is being made by you and only you along with the media, as demonstrated by this thread. Subways decide, on their own, that it is economically beneficial for them to offer a service to a different segment of society. You throw a tantrum, muslims on the other hand weren't out protesting subways, subways chose themselves for financial reasons.
 
The kerfuffle is being made by you and only you along with the media, as demonstrated by this thread. Subways decide, on their own, that it is economically beneficial for them to offer a service to a different segment of society. You throw a tantrum, muslims on the other hand weren't out protesting subways, subways chose themselves for financial reasons.

They should have offered a choice. I would never choose halal meat as I do not agree with the barbaric practice it has no place in the 21st century.
 
Because it is your opinion and your opinion that others that don't share your opinion are wrong.

Quote mining won't win you the argument. You've deliberately quoted a tiny portion of what I posted and simply ignored the rest in order to twist the argument in your favour. I've made lots of valid points in this thread and you've ignored almost all of them. The fact that you haven't addressed any of them is evidence that either you can't or you agree but your pride prevents you from conceding a point and then moving on.

There is a difference between opinion based on fact (objective) and opinion based on faith (subjective). My opinions are based on facts and as such they trump any faith based opinions.
 
Quote mining won't win you the argument. You've deliberately quoted a tiny portion of what I posted and simply ignored the rest in order to twist the argument in your favour. I've made lots of valid points in this thread and you've ignored almost all of them. The fact that you haven't addressed any of them is evidence that either you can't or you agree but your pride prevents you from conceding a point and then moving on.

There is a difference between opinion based on fact (objective) and opinion based on faith (subjective). My opinions are based on facts and as such they trump any faith based opinions.

Quote selecting as I'm not arguing with you elsewhere, I only pointed out the for a fact your statement was untrue which you are asserting is true based off your opinion and judgements of others even though you have stated you are no expert.
 
Quote selecting as I'm not arguing with you elsewhere, I only pointed out the for a fact your statement was untrue which you are asserting is true based off your opinion and judgements of others even though you have stated you are no expert.

Ok. Well if you're so sure I'm wrong and that you are right. Go public with your esoteric knowledge ( I say esoteric because so far you've brought nothing to the table) and show the world that god exists and claim your fame and your Nobel Prize. The burden of proof after all is always on those making the claim. Always. ;)
 
Quote mining won't win you the argument. You've deliberately quoted a tiny portion of what I posted and simply ignored the rest in order to twist the argument in your favour. I've made lots of valid points in this thread and you've ignored almost all of them. The fact that you haven't addressed any of them is evidence that either you can't or you agree but your pride prevents you from conceding a point and then moving on.

There is a difference between opinion based on fact (objective) and opinion based on faith (subjective). My opinions are based on facts and as such they trump any faith based opinions.

Your opinions are based on things you take on faith to be facts. Too many people don't understand this important part.
 
Ok. Well if you're so sure I'm wrong and that you are right. Go public with your esoteric knowledge ( I say esoteric because so far you've brought nothing to the table) and show the world that god exists and claim your fame and your Nobel Prize. The burden of proof after all is always on those making the claim. Always. ;)

I never argued that
 
Your opinions are based on things you take on faith to be facts. Too many people don't understand this important part.

Wrong. I don't do faith but thanks for making the unfounded assumption that I did. I have a certain amount of trust in people, not faith, trust, and this is built up slowly over time by being able to listen to what they say and then later demonstrate that it was true.

Example:

If my friend of 20 years says to me, I've just bought a new puppy. I'll probably take him on his word. I won't really require any more evidence because it's such a trivial claim and because I've known him a long time and found him to be truthful and reliable. That isn't faith, it's trust based on acquired evidence over time.

However, If the same friend comes to me and says, I have an invisible pet dragon in my back garden. I'm not going to take him at his word. I will require a little more than that. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'm going to want to visit his back garden and check for myself. I'll be looking for dragon footprints, dragon poop, dragon sounds. Can I touch the dragon to prove he's there ? Get the idea ?

So my trust in science and the truth of atheism is not faith. It's trust. When scientists publish their journals, I know they will be peer reviewed and scrutinised and attempts will be made to falsify them. If after this the journal stands up, it becomes our best explanation of the observed phenomenon given the evidence we have. So when a scientist like Lawrence Krauss or Richard Dawkins speaks about the vast improbability of a gods existence, I trust them. I verify this trust by reading their books and listening to their arguments and then listening to other peoples challenges to those arguments. If those challenges fall down, and they do when it comes to god, then the best explanation is the one which stands up. Nothing changes the debate except new evidence. For the god squad, so far there is none. So the default position is to reject religious claims of deities till they can demonstrate them to be true.
 
Wow, guys, still at it ? :)

I don't believe in God. I don't have a problem with people who do (I have a cousin who is Reverend Doctor in the Church of Scotland, his thesis was on Creationism; we discussed it once and agreed to disagree). I do, however, have a problem with people who subvert religion to achieve their own ends.

In my opinion Christianity used to be used as an excuse for all sorts of wrongs in much the same way that some posters in this thread seem to think Islam is doing. Christianity, however, has been forced to chill out since the Enlightenment, and people are less inclined to accept socio-political engineering disguised as Christianity. Islam is a much younger religion (600 years or so ?) and has yet to go through its own Enlightenment. Give it time and people will realise. Banning it will, in my opinion, set this natural process back and fan the flames of extremisim.

Let it run its course. Educate and wait :cool:
 
Wrong. I don't do faith but thanks for making the unfounded assumption that I did. I have a certain amount of trust in people, not faith, trust, and this is built up slowly over time by being able to listen to what they say and then later demonstrate that it was true.

Example:

If my friend of 20 years says to me, I've just bought a new puppy. I'll probably take him on his word. I won't really require any more evidence because it's such a trivial claim and because I've known him a long time and found him to be truthful and reliable. That isn't faith, it's trust based on acquired evidence over time.

However, If the same friend comes to me and says, I have an invisible pet dragon in my back garden. I'm not going to take him at his word. I will require a little more than that. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'm going to want to visit his back garden and check for myself. I'll be looking for dragon footprints, dragon poop, dragon sounds. Can I touch the dragon to prove he's there ? Get the idea ?

So my trust in science and the truth of atheism is not faith. It's trust. When scientists publish their journals, I know they will be peer reviewed and scrutinised and attempts will be made to falsify them. If after this the journal stands up, it becomes our best explanation of the observed phenomenon given the evidence we have. So when a scientist like Lawrence Krauss or Richard Dawkins speaks about the vast improbability of a gods existence, I trust them. I verify this trust by reading their books and listening to their arguments and then listening to other peoples challenges to those arguments. If those challenges fall down, and they do when it comes to god, then the best explanation is the one which stands up. Nothing changes the debate except new evidence. For the god squad, so far there is none. So the default position is to reject religious claims of deities till they can demonstrate them to be true.

In short, you don't know what faith means, as you are putting faith in people's words but insisting it's not faith.
 
Except that you're taking on faith that the evidence is correct. I am not religious, but I find it frustrating that the vocal/militant Atheists or Anti-theists twist and change things to suit their viewpoint and try and disregard what it actually is, ergo substituting reality with their own, whilst then whinging about how the religious folk do it.
 
So when a scientist like Lawrence Krauss or Richard Dawkins speaks about the vast improbability of a gods existence, I trust them.

Yet when Zoomee's article linked to a peer-reviewed article by German scientists about the pain in slaughter you weren't interested :confused: You either trust the scientific method or not :p
 
In short, you don't know what faith means, as you are putting faith in people's words but insisting it's not faith.

In short no and you know it. If you can't defend your argument then either concede the point and move on or shut up if your pride won't allow you to do that. All you're doing is reading my explanations of my position and coming back with a flaccid one liner which you think debunks my entire argument. It's pathetic.
 
In short no and you know it. If you can't defend your argument then either concede the point and move on or shut up if your pride won't allow you to do that. All you're doing is reading my explanations of my position and coming back with a flaccid one liner which you think debunks my entire argument. It's pathetic.

Nope. You just don't understand what faith means.
 
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