AMD signs up 40 development studios for Mantle

[Marine-RX179]

Hopefully not, competition is a good thing. That said, let's wait 15-20 years before concluding it's not a fad!

Are these studios signed up exclusively for Mantle or will they use DX11/DX12 too?
I think that's what will decide which has been most successful, which one is supported by the most games.

Still I think that DX12 doing what Microsoft claim is actually better for Mantle in the long run than if DX12 fails. Partly because while games have to run on DX11 for the majority of users, they will overall still be constrained by the same things. Yes Mantle will probably give better FPS for most people (assuming developers get the VRAM usage under control and figure out how to implement crossfire) and may be able to offer a few extra shiny bits here and there. However I think if DX12 comes along and removes the CPU bottleneck it will allow developers to really push things and I think that's what we really need.

Still, even if DX12 removes the CPU bottleneck like Mantle does, that's not gonna stop me buying powerful CPUs or GPUs.

IMO dx12 is still a long way away, and Mantle would a good alternative to use until then; let it roll and see how it goes. By the time dx12 is out, we will see how it does comparing to Mantle; if it's amazing and better than Mantle, great everyone jump aboard; if it's just more hyped than it turned out to be, at least people would have the option to fall back to using Mantle as alternative (unless if you were Nvidia user of course). But at the end of the day, Nvidia users would most likely benefit from dx12 comparing to dx11...but if dx12 doesn't match up to the performance of Mantle, people should be blaming M$, not AMD.

How we predict Mantle would do in the future is irrelevant, as time will surely tell anyway. But at this moment, you cannot help but to agree it is looking pretty good- for the near future at least. As for the long run? We will wait and see.

I too think dx12 beating Mantle would actually be better for everyone, however comparing to AMD focusing Mantle on solely improving PC gaming experience and performance, dx12 unfortunately is not...with it trying to support XBone, Windows phones and tablets at the same time as well.

 

[spoffle]

I love how people champion OpenGL even though the list of recent AAA titles that use it is shorter than the number of current Mantle games. I'm all for a decent API that is not locked down to any one vendor, but unfortunately it isn't OpenGl.

For now Mantle is at least getting support and is clearly gaining support. When DX12 comes out I will be ready for it. In the meantime I have the option of DX11 or Mantle.

You'd be surprised at how many games actually use OpenGL, I think Valve has been moving all of their games over to running on it in anticipation of Linux/Steam OS integration.

 

[flopper]

Mantle make it relatively easy to make a developer to implement and use.
I know if I made games I jump on it from the start.
Best and biggest thing that has happen for PC gaming since DX was formed.

 

[spoffle]

Hopefully not, competition is a good thing. That said, let's wait 15-20 years before concluding it's not a fad!

Are these studios signed up exclusively for Mantle or will they use DX11/DX12 too?
I think that's what will decide which has been most successful, which one is supported by the most games.

Still I think that DX12 doing what Microsoft claim is actually better for Mantle in the long run than if DX12 fails. Partly because while games have to run on DX11 for the majority of users, they will overall still be constrained by the same things. Yes Mantle will probably give better FPS for most people (assuming developers get the VRAM usage under control and figure out how to implement crossfire) and may be able to offer a few extra shiny bits here and there. However I think if DX12 comes along and removes the CPU bottleneck it will allow developers to really push things and I think that's what we really need.

Still, even if DX12 removes the CPU bottleneck like Mantle does, that's not gonna stop me buying powerful CPUs or GPUs.

No devs will sign up for Mantle exclusively, because, just like Physx, only a portion of the market could run it at all. AMD obviously know it will have to be universally supported by all GPU manufacturers for this to happen, and they know that it's obviously in their best interests to push it in this direction, especially considering all the things they have complained about with regards to nVidia and how proprietary standards just don't work or last.

However, I can't imagine nVidia will be on board with support, at least willingly, due to their own pride (read ego) and would likely have concerns that their hardware may be gimped in terms of performance due to it being controlled by AMD, as we all know they would (and do) do the same themselves.

 

[ICDP]

You'd be surprised at how many games actually use OpenGL, I think Valve has been moving all of their games over to running on it in anticipation of Linux/Steam OS integration.

I'm specifically referring to AAA titles on the PC. OpenGL is the poster child of only the desperate who insist it is still a "contender" for AAA PC games. It is by and large irrelevant and has been for close to a decade as far as AAA titles go.

If OpenGL was all that, why is it 100% unrepresented in AAA games. At least mantle has a foothold and is gaining traction. If it becomes widely adopted I'm not going to complain. I have used it enough to see that it has serious improvements over DX even on a high end rig.

 

[spoffle]

I'm not poopooing Mantle or anything, and I know you're talking about AAA in the PC space, I'm just pointing out that OpenGL plays a much bigger part than you realise, or have given credit for.

 

[LtMatt]

AMD Ready to Provide Mantle Support for PS4 and Xbox One

Month old article but couple of weeks after DX12 was announced, i think.

AMD Ready to Provide Mantle Support for PS4 and Xbox One

Neal talked about the fact that Mantle is intended for use on Radeon graphics in a PC. However, we said that Mantle was designed from the beginning to be extensible to other platforms, as well. AMD stands ready to share the technology with our [console] partners should they choose to want it.

http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/03...x-one-could-push-performance-of-both-further/

 

[humbug]

Month old article but couple of weeks after DX12 was announced, i think.

AMD Ready to Provide Mantle Support for PS4 and Xbox One



http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/03...x-one-could-push-performance-of-both-further/

Sony might, Microsoft would first have to forgive AMD for urinating on their camp-fire, they would rather biol their own heads.

 

[shankly1985]

Month old article but couple of weeks after DX12 was announced, i think.

AMD Ready to Provide Mantle Support for PS4 and Xbox One



http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/03...x-one-could-push-performance-of-both-further/

PS4 that sure would help boost the amount of games support. Run PS4 game on Mantle should = PC game also run Mantle = more games = We win

 

[tommybhoy]

Sony might, Microsoft would first have to forgive AMD for urinating on their camp-fire, they would rather biol their own heads.

Don't think MS need to forgive AMD for Mantle, that's like saying MS would have to forgive Nvidia for upping their push for OGL(Cryengine and Unreal Engine4 will have native OGL support).

Mantle hasn't replaced DX, DX is under fire from Mantle, Steam OS and to OGL.

They have to work closely with MS on drivers and I imagine they also wouldn't risk losing a multi $million contract on the next console tender by ******* on MS.

The goals/delivery are more or less the same if you compare feature slides, where do you think MS got them from?

Have you been suckered with Nvidia's DX 12 marketing spin?

 

[humbug]

Don't think MS need to forgive AMD for Mantle, that's like saying MS would have to forgive Nvidia for upping their push for OGL(Cryengine and Unreal Engine4 will have native OGL support).

Mantle hasn't replaced DX, DX is under fire from Mantle, Steam OS and to OGL.

They have to work closely with MS on drivers and I imagine they also wouldn't risk losing a multi $million contract on the next console tender by ******* on MS.

The goals/delivery are more or less the same if you compare feature slides, where do you think MS got them from?

Have you been suckered with Nvidia's DX 12 marketing spin?

Fair point.

 

[LtMatt]

It looks like another studio might provide Mantle support, thought they've not officially announced it yet. Interestingly this was the exact same reply Crytek gave when asked about Mantle a few months back. Perhaps an omen. This time its Creative Assembly and the game is Alien Isolation. Looks like a scary, survival horror single player game and one for Aliens fans.

Trailer 1 - Console Footage

Trailer 2 - Console Footage

Will your game offer support for AMDs Mantel-API? If you have decided to utilize the AMD API what are the main advantages from a developers point view? How difficult and time consuming has it been to integrate such fundamentally different technology into a renderer? How much performance gain can we expect by applying this technology? Can you already give precise results?

We are considering Mantle at the moment. It looks really interesting.

Unfortunately for our green friends they won't be adding Physx though.

Will you utilize Nvidia's PhysX Engine or have you integrated you own solution/Havok/ODE, etc.? If PhysX is applied will you even support GPU accelerated physics including the APEX modules? If physic is calculated by CPU only what different features will this be? Do your physics modules even profit from multithreading?

We don't use PhysX but our physics solution is highly multi-threaded. Many of the 'scalable' GPU style physics behaviors are also do-able as particle effects which use the G buffer to compute physical interactions with the world.

Full Interview
http://www.pcgameshardware.de/Alien...ien-Isolation-Exklusives-Interview-1116956/2/

 

[shankly1985]

Nice
I had my doubts about this game but the more I see of it the more its looking stunning. Seems the bring back the fear to the Aliens series

 

[LtMatt]

Nice
I had my doubts about this game but the more I see of it the more its looking stunning. Seems the bring back the fear to the Aliens series

I hope so. Big fan of Aliens here but Aliens Colonial Marines was dire. I made lots of people buy that and many still have not forgiven me.

This does look good though, i like these type of games.

 

[whyscotty]

I made lots of people buy that and many still have not forgiven me.

 

[LtMatt]

You as well?

 

[~Mike~]

I made lots of people buy that and many still have not forgiven me.

Not I, I wasn't stupid enough to listen to you and I don't blame them for not forgiving you!
Same with MoHW. Even poor Chip paid for a server!

Not believe everything the Lt says.

 

[whyscotty]

Not believe everything the Lt says.

I'm too trusting - but I'm learning

 

[Krisali]

Now all they to do is sign up someone decent to design their coolers..

And CPU's

 

[Sin_Chase]

And CPU's

They have already admitted their current architecture is trash and are going back to a different architecture. Unfortunately it leaves them a year behind in R&D.