AMD signs up 40 development studios for Mantle

GoogalyMoogaly · 11 May 2014 at 21:36

TheRealDeal said:
They don't make much money from the hardware and usually make a loss at launch. The profits are made from games, online service's and peripheral's.

I realise you may not have the answers, but do they make money on all games released on the system or just the ones they're involved in?
Do they make any money from PC games?
If not, it seems they are encouraging people to make games for Windows as it won't cost them so much. Or if you consider the cost will just be passed on to the end user then they're charging their console customers more. Seems like a good deal being a PC gamer!

TheRealDeal · 11 May 2014 at 21:56

GoogalyMoogaly said:
I realise you may not have the answers, but do they make money on all games released on the system or just the ones they're involved in?
Do they make any money from PC games?
If not, it seems they are encouraging people to make games for Windows as it won't cost them so much. Or if you consider the cost will just be passed on to the end user then they're charging their console customers more. Seems like a good deal being a PC gamer!

Yea i can't really answer this 100%. On the pc side Microsoft don't own the hardware so i guess they don't make money from games. The PC is pretty much an open system so for me the only people to make money on the game are those that make them.

Marine-RX179 · 11 May 2014 at 22:51

AlamoX said:
personaly i think Mantle brings a lot for no cost at all, i dont understand why some ppl might be against it, it doesnt cost them anything, they still have DX, it's not like the games go Mantle and cancels Dx version, so other than being simply jealous, i dont see the reason to be against Mantle, and even it helped bring them Dx12, so instead of the hate they should be glad that AMD brought Mantle to the PC gaming veryone stands to win from it even Nvidia players.

...and dx12 isn't going to free for people who are still happy with using Windows 7...they'd have to pay for upgrading to newer Windows (despite they might not feel the need to) in order to get dx12, and "upgrading" Windows from 7 to above ain't free.

GoogalyMoogaly · 11 May 2014 at 23:02

I believe Mantle was an advertised feature of my 290s, so I don't consider it to be free, but included with the price.

Final8y · 11 May 2014 at 23:09

GoogalyMoogaly said:
I believe Mantle was an advertised feature of my 290s, so I don't consider it to be free, but included with the price.

So the 290 users all got charged for Mantle in your opinion and all the cards below got mantle for free because Mantle is not an advertised feature in the specs on the other cards.

tommybhoy · 11 May 2014 at 23:11

Your 7950s got it for free for sure.

Amd provided what feels like a massive discount for the cost of comparative Nvidia performance, so I'll personally consider Mantle as a freebie.

God help the waiter at your table googly.

GoogalyMoogaly · 11 May 2014 at 23:15

tommybhoy said:
Your 7950s got it for free for sure.

Amd provided what feels like a massive discount for the cost of comparative Nvidia performance, so I'll personally consider Mantle as a freebie.

God help the waiter at your table googly.

Oh yeah, it wasn't advertised as a feature for my 7950s, but it also doesn't seem to work well on my 7950s, so just as well.

Regarding DX12 not being free if you don't own a version of Windows (8/8.1?) that supports it, if you don't own an AMD card that supports Mantle then Mantle isn't gonna really be free either is it as you'll have to buy a graphics card. Which will probably be more expensive than Windows. Yes, you could argue that Mantle is still free it's the card you're paying for, but wouldn't DirectX also be free and it's the OS you'd be paying for?

triss · 11 May 2014 at 23:20

Marine-RX179 said:
...and dx12 isn't going to free for people who are still happy with using Windows 7...they'd have to pay for upgrading to newer Windows (despite they might not feel the need to) in order to get dx12, and "upgrading" Windows from 7 to above ain't free.

This all depends what DX12 will be tied to. It has been rumored its win 7 up

jh30uk · 11 May 2014 at 23:47

Win8+

Win 7 is not to even get DX11.2 (if it appears).

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/gaming/2013/06/28/directx-11-2/

Final8y · 12 May 2014 at 00:04

GoogalyMoogaly said:
Oh yeah, it wasn't advertised as a feature for my 7950s, but it also doesn't seem to work well on my 7950s, so just as well.

Works fine on my trifire 7950s, it works better than DX11 in the same game on my trifire 7950s, so if that's not working well and its better than DX11 what does that say about DX11.

Final8y · 12 May 2014 at 00:11

GoogalyMoogaly said:
Oh yeah, it wasn't advertised as a feature for my 7950s, but it also doesn't seem to work well on my 7950s, so just as well.

Regarding DX12 not being free if you don't own a version of Windows (8/8.1?) that supports it, if you don't own an AMD card that supports Mantle then Mantle isn't gonna really be free either is it as you'll have to buy a graphics card. Which will probably be more expensive than Windows. Yes, you could argue that Mantle is still free it's the card you're paying for, but wouldn't DirectX also be free and it's the OS you'd be paying for?

Not if DX is the reason for the upgrade.
most Users are not buying new gfx cards because of mantle or any other tickbox feature, performance over what they had is the reason for buying a new gfx card first and foremost, features just helps them choose which one.

humbug · 12 May 2014 at 00:15

What are we supposed to be talking about now?

How did it become "Mantle is not free" Do these idea's come off a ticketing system? whats next? or dare i ask.

triss · 12 May 2014 at 00:25

Mantle is as free as physx or any other propriety gpu tech.

bru · 12 May 2014 at 01:26

humbug said:
How did it become "Mantle is not free" Do these idea's come off a ticketing system? whats next? or dare i ask.

Yes Mantle is free, unless your using Final8y's reasoning.
If I was to decide I want to try Mantle, then because I would have to buy an AMD card, Mantle is going to cost me a bomb.

GoogalyMoogaly said:
but wouldn't DirectX also be free and it's the OS you'd be paying for?

Final8y said:
Not if DX is the reason for the upgrade.
most Users are not buying new gfx cards because of mantle or any other tickbox feature, performance over what they had is the reason for buying a new gfx card first and foremost, features just helps them choose which one.

humbug · 12 May 2014 at 01:30

I have a headache

GoogalyMoogaly · 12 May 2014 at 01:35

Final8y said:
Works fine on my trifire 7950s, it works better than DX11 in the same game on my trifire 7950s, so if that's not working well and its better than DX11 what does that say about DX11.

Oh well if it works for you I guess it must work for everyone!
I was told that Thief didn't support multi GPUs using Mantle, but it does for you?
I also found that in BF4 it caused me to hit a VRAM limit when using Ultra settings (unlike DirectX), but I guess if it's OK for you I must be mistaken...

humbug said:
What are we supposed to be talking about now?

How did it become "Mantle is not free" Do these idea's come off a ticketing system? whats next? or dare i ask.

Seemed like a natural follow on from "DirectX is not free".

And as bru stated, if DirectX is the reason for the upgrade and that makes it not free, the same would be true if you bought an AMD card for Mantle.

humbug · 12 May 2014 at 01:37

GoogalyMoogaly said:
Oh well if it works for you I guess it must work for everyone!
I was told that Thief didn't support multi GPUs using Mantle, but it does for you?
I also found that in BF4 it caused me to hit a VRAM limit when using Ultra settings (unlike DirectX), but I guess if it's OK for you I must be mistaken...

Seemed like a natural follow on from "DirectX is not free".

And as bru stated, if DirectX is the reason for the upgrade and that makes it not free, the same would be true if you bought an AMD card for Mantle.

Isn't it all just a bit pointless? what a thing to get into a debate over, if i buy a Bobble Hat is the Bobble free?

GoogalyMoogaly · 12 May 2014 at 01:42

humbug said:
Isn't it all just a bit pointless? what a thing to get into a debate over, if i buy a Bobble Hat is the Bobble free?

I don't think it's the only thing on the forums that this could be said about.
Like I said, I didn't start it though.

Final8y · 12 May 2014 at 02:52

GoogalyMoogaly said:
Oh well if it works for you I guess it must work for everyone!
I was told that Thief didn't support multi GPUs using Mantle, but it does for you?
I also found that in BF4 it caused me to hit a VRAM limit when using Ultra settings (unlike DirectX), but I guess if it's OK for you I must be mistaken...

Seemed like a natural follow on from "DirectX is not free".

And as bru stated, if DirectX is the reason for the upgrade and that makes it not free, the same would be true if you bought an AMD card for Mantle.

Stop with putting words into my mouth and making up stuff which i have not said or implied.

I said Mantle it works fine on MY trifire 7950s, i said nothing of everyone and said nothing of Thief as i dont even have that game and Mantle is not exclusive to multi GPU so Multi GPU does not have to be supported in every Mantle game for Mantle to be working properly which is no different than DX or OpenGL doesn't have to have multi GPU working in every game for DX or OpenGL to be considered working properly when its down to the developers of the game for multi GPU support including the bugs.

Does everyone running DX and OpenGL games have no issues, no there will always be people having particular issues while others dont and developer bugs in games the same goes for Mantle.

And as bru stated, if DirectX is the reason for the upgrade and that makes it not free, the same would be true if you bought an AMD card for Mantle.

Yes that would be true but i have already answered that question already because most would not buy a new card because of mantle but because of performance, but Mantle may make them choose AMD over NV when its time for them to upgrade, or Shadowplay may make them choose NV over AMD when its time for a performance upgrade.

GoogalyMoogaly · 12 May 2014 at 12:58

Final8y said:
Stop with putting words into my mouth and making up stuff which i have not said or implied.

I said Mantle it works fine on MY trifire 7950s, i said nothing of everyone and said nothing of Thief as i dont even have that game and Mantle is not exclusive to multi GPU so Multi GPU does not have to be supported in every Mantle game for Mantle to be working properly which is no different than DX or OpenGL doesn't have to have multi GPU working in every game for DX or OpenGL to be considered working properly when its down to the developers of the game for multi GPU support including the bugs.

Does everyone running DX and OpenGL games have no issues, no there will always be people having particular issues while others dont and developer bugs in games the same goes for Mantle.

And as bru stated, if DirectX is the reason for the upgrade and that makes it not free, the same would be true if you bought an AMD card for Mantle.

Yes that would be true but i have already answered that question already because most would not buy a new card because of mantle but because of performance, but Mantle may make them choose AMD over NV when its time for them to upgrade, or Shadowplay may make them choose NV over AMD when its time for a performance upgrade.

Fair enough, probably did over-react a little there, sorry.

As for the last point, i'd hope nobody upgrades Windows just for DirectX either. I know I didn't go to Win8 just to get DX 11.2.
If people do, maybe that says more about them than Microsoft or anyone else?