Poll: which party are you going to vote in up coming elections?

Who will you be voting for?

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Meridian said:
I think the best definition of UKIP voters I've heard was said by (IIRC) a UKIP official (who is not named). The gist of it was: UKIP voters are people who have failed in life, and want someone to blame for it. This has always been a fertile recruiting area for extremist parties of all stamps, with the majority of members of such parties coming from lower-middle and working class backgrounds, doing low-skill and poorly paid jobs. They are convinced that something other than their own inadequacy is holding them back from a well-paid meaningful career and they have found a scapegoat. In time past it has been the underclass, Jews, Huguenots (yes, really), immigrants, and well, immigrants. Anyone but yourself. UKIP is just another round of this. Add a huge dash of old-fashioned (literally) conservatism (small c intended) and UKIP is just the latest bunch from a long line of narrow-minded bigotted Little Englanders.

However...

I do understand the frustration with the current politics and why people think "none of the above" should be a valid ballot option. Blair steered Labour away from poor people towards Tory Lite and support of Big Business. That leaves all the main three parties looking pretty much the same, with the feeling that no matter who you vote for you're going to get the same. Cameron is a Toff with no idea of real life, Glegg is a man who sold what little soul he has for power, and Milliband is so in hock to his spin doctors I simply have no idea what he wants or why. Politicians still haven't understood why the public have such contempt for them. So they just keep doing the same wrong thins and say that they are misunderstood. No, the problem is that we understand you very well, that's why we hate you.

That said, how a public-school educated stockbroker came to be seen as an "outsider" in all this is beyond me. It's even more mystifying that why people seem utterly unable to see through Boris Johnson's act.
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On a similar note, another apparent quote attributed to UKIP is that they failed t get many votes inside the M25 because everyone is young, cultured and educated.:D

Perhaps the solution is to get rid of career politicians? People need a grounding in real life before they become politicians and lead a country that is full of "real life" people. There are some MP's and elected officials that are from normal backgrounds, unfortunately they are the minority. The majority get into politics at a young age and work their way up in the political arena without touching an outside job. It's one of the reason the House of Lords seems to be becoming more in touch with "common" person every day. The increase in Life peers with decades of experience in real life jobs bringing a semblance of sense into the proceedings.
 
altus said:
Does anyone here believe this country would have an open door immigration policy if the EU did not exist?
UKIP is purely about having our own democracy and making our own decisions, it is not about left\right wing, this is where he have been going wrong imo , we are divided by left and right, surely we need to get away from that.
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Yet the most vocal in this thread appear to be complaining about Asians and Muslims, neither of who will be affected by the so called open door policy being part of the EU brings...
 
altus said:
Does anyone here believe this country would have an open door immigration policy if the EU did not exist?
UKIP is purely about having our own democracy and making our own decisions, it is not about left\right wing, this is where he have been going wrong imo , we are divided by left and right, surely we need to get away from that.
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What does the EU have to do with (2011 census):

729,000 from India
457,000 Pakistan
230,000 Bangladesh
211,000 South Africa
190,000 Nigeria
Australia, Philippines, Jamaica, Kenya, China, Zimbabwe, Somalia, all above 100k

EU numbers:
Poland 643,000
Ireland 457,000
Germany 297,000
France 137,000
Italy 124,000

Basically, the only significant population from "unpopular" countries (I assume countries such as Germany are considered Ok, seeing how Nigel is married to one) are the Polish. You can blame the EU for those but you can't blame the EU for the rest.

If the UK has immigration problems, the EU has nothing to do with them, most of the unskilled immigrants come from elsewhere. This has been brought up so many times but it seems explaining anything to UKIP fans is like talking to walls.
 
I haven't read much of this thread but I'm kinda nervous by the sudden surge in UKIP popularity. They're nothing but far right policies covered up underneath a stance on immigration that honestly tends to appeal to racists.

Any middle class working man who seriously votes for them has lost me. (At the moment you can't win no matter who you vote for but that doesn't mean you should throw yourself head first into the fire)
 
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Caged said:
I think you missed the sarcasm
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Sorry about that :p some of stuff in here though it wouldn't have shocked me if it were a true view.

Outcast said:
So Who was doing those jobs before ?

Have those jobs only just been invented ?
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The only job I labelled specifically was the NHS. I challenge you to go out and find a dole queue inhabited by all those unemployed doctors because of those dastardly foreigners.

The (now I realise sarcastic) proposal was foreigners out and pay British people loads of money. We live in a global world, how many companies would hang round if they were suddenly told they had to hugely increase their staff payments? All thee foreign companies who are probably wholly are partially foreign owned are going to take that hit for the "good of the country"?

Are you really that niave?

Jobs are there as Britain is competitive in a global market. Labour destroyed our remaining industry so how do we compete globally when everyone is paid loads? We don't. Or we could go the labour route and give everyone overpaid none jobs and..... Oh wait we did that and here we are now still trying to fix things!
 
Zethor said:
What does the EU have to do with (2011 census):

729,000 from India
457,000 Pakistan
230,000 Bangladesh
211,000 South Africa
190,000 Nigeria
Australia, Philippines, Jamaica, Kenya, China, Zimbabwe, Somalia, all above 100k

EU numbers:
Poland 643,000
Ireland 457,000
Germany 297,000
France 137,000
Italy 124,000

Basically, the only significant population from "unpopular" countries (I assume countries such as Germany are considered Ok, seeing how Nigel is married to one) are the Polish. You can blame the EU for those but you can't blame the EU for the rest.

If the UK has immigration problems, the EU has nothing to do with them, most of the unskilled immigrants come from elsewhere. This has been brought up so many times but it seems explaining anything to UKIP fans is like talking to walls.
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You missed the point, we do not have an open door policy with the rest of the world, we get to make our own rules about immigration from other countries.
 
Amp34 said:
Yet the most vocal in this thread appear to be complaining about Asians and Muslims, neither of who will be affected by the so called open door policy being part of the EU brings...
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Well they are missing the point , its not about Asians and Muslims or any other type you can think of, its about having some control over who comes and when they come.
The EU denies us that control.
 
altus said:
You missed the point, we do not have an open door policy with the rest of the world, we get to make our own rules about immigration from other countries.
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altus said:
Well they are missing the point , its not about Asians and Muslims or any other type you can think of, its about having some control over who comes and when they come.
The EU denies us that control.
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What Zethor is pointing out is that EU has nothing to do with immigration from outside of EU27 as UK is not part of Schengen agreement and currently has ( and always had) 100%/full control over it's borders when it comes to non EU citizens. EU migration was never main source of immigration to UK and at the moment majority of immigrants entering UK are outside of regulations dictated or related to EU membership.

UKIP immigration ideas as presented in their manifesto are simply not workable without creating multi-tier residence status system where immigrants from EU that currently have permanent resident status in UK are treated differently upon entry to visitors from EU countries who entered after change of rules. Identical system would need to apply to migrants from the rest of the world. This would require centralised database accessible at all entry points and some form of verifiable multi-tier national registration or ID, to avoid the situation where business, land and home owners without British citizenship get denied entry to their place of business, land or home within UK. Similar issue applies to members of multinational families and children with multiple nationalities. Then you have new immigrants with unlimited right to remain and employment, with right to remain but no right to employment and with limited right to remain, with or without employment. It's basically visa system for 100% of visitors.

It's simple to imagine why freedom of movement was one of the first things established in EU. Without skipping the checks, the immigration enforcement around Britain would have to become the largest taskforce in the land. What you would have to imagine is border control at Calais or Heathrow multiplied by a hundred. Fields and fields of booths, Border Agency staff, desks and computers where every delivery trucker, every car and every passenger on every bus gets full interview followed by verification and retrieval of data confirming their status of residence in UK, followed by stamp in passport and/or update of centralised database. Miles and miles or queues, hours and hours of waiting to enter. And the same would happen to UK citizens leaving and entering mainland continent.
 
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Off the record chat and leaks coming out now on Twitter... National Front in France and UKIP are goers apparently. :/ Danish People's Party has done it as well according to reports.
 
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v0n said:
What Zethor is pointing out is that EU has nothing to do with immigration from outside of EU27 as UK is not part of Schengen agreement and currently has ( and always had) 100%/full control over it's borders when it comes to non EU citizens. EU migration was never main source of immigration to UK and at the moment majority of immigrants entering UK are outside of regulations dictated or related to EU membership.

UKIP immigration ideas as presented in their manifesto are simply not workable without creating multi-tier residence status system where immigrants from EU that currently have permanent resident status in UK are treated differently upon entry to visitors from EU countries who entered after change of rules. Identical system would need to apply to migrants from the rest of the world. This would require centralised database accessible at all entry points and some form of verifiable multi-tier national registration or ID, to avoid the situation where business, land and home owners without British citizenship get denied entry to their place of business, land or home within UK. Similar issue applies to members of multinational families and children with multiple nationalities. Then you have new immigrants with unlimited right to remain and employment, with right to remain but no right to employment and with limited right to remain, with or without employment. It's basically visa system for 100% of visitors.

It's simple to imagine why freedom of movement was one of the first things established in EU. Without skipping the checks, the immigration enforcement around Britain would have to become the largest taskforce in the land. What you would have to imagine is border control at Calais or Heathrow multiplied by a hundred. Fields and fields of booths, Border Agency staff, desks and computers where every delivery trucker, every car and every passenger on every bus gets full interview followed by verification and retrieval of data confirming their status of residence in UK, followed by stamp in passport and/or update of centralised database. Miles and miles or queues, hours and hours of waiting to enter. And the same would happen to UK citizens leaving and entering mainland continent.
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Very long way of missing the point again, we do not want or need the EU to decide our immigration policy, why is that hard to understand.
 
Azza said:
Off the record chat and leaks coming out now on Twitter... National Front in France and UKIP are goers apparently. :/ Danish People's Party has done it as well according to reports.
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The people have had enough and so have I.

Byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
 
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