Legal Highs 'More Lethal Than Heroin' Warning

[ubern00b]

Which brings me to a favourite question for all the druggies: how do you know you have ever taken a drug that you believe it to be? That tablet that you really liked, so you assumed it was MDMA, for example. How do you know it was? Please don't say "I tested it", because unless the test was done by a reputable laboratory with at least one EI mass spec and a good library I'm just going to laugh at your naiveté. And don't say that you saw the results of a test on an identical tablet, because that's nonsense as well.

I can say "it was tested" because it was. There are 5 reagent tests to test for MDMA and using all 5 will without a doubt tell you what is in your substance. Also there are harm reduction sites out there that report on pills including results from test centres (dotted around Europe, Holland Switzerland being the most prominent) that will tell you the amount of the chemical in your pill (excluding binder etc). They also report on multiple of the same pill and build up a database of the "spread".

You can laugh at my (our?) naiveté all you like but from a harm reduction point of view all of these things combined has done us as a community quite well for many many years. Just because you choose to sit on a high horse doesn't mean these things don't work and don't save lives.

Some of us "druggies" aren't your average idiot who will buy anything from the local corner man and don't really care what it is they are actually buying, as long as it gets them high. But, you know, don't let that get in the way of your crusade or anything.

 

[Meridian]

Yup. But that's all surely the result of the laws forcing supply into the hands of criminals?

Er - they were doing this when these drugs were still legal. It's called Capitalism.

 

[Meridian]

I don't know about psychotomimetics, but based on what I've seen of the GC-MS results the current benzodiazepines and etizolam on the market are almost always the real thing, in fact the pills seem to be identical in composition to the ones supplied by pharmaceutic companies so I'd assume they were being obtained from them. It probably varies by drug class and whether the drug is only a research chemical or is actually a pharmaceutical in foreign countries.

I'm assuming that you aren't counting all the fake diazepam out there? Including the ones being dispensed by less than scrupulous pharmacies? (In their defence, there's no proof that they know the tablets are fake, and they come in official-looking packaging. The less than scrupulous is the lack of questions about why the price looks so good.)

 

[Meridian]

I can say "it was tested" because it was. There are 5 reagent tests to test for MDMA and using all 5 will without a doubt tell you what is in your substance.

Do you remember that bit where I promised to laugh in your face if anyone said spot testing? Here it is: ha, ha, ha. Seriously, that is cobblers. Do you think that it was that simple the courts wouldn't accept it as evidence? Not pay proper labs to do the job properly? Because at the very best all you will get is a range of related drugs. Have you any idea how many phenethylamines there are out there? I will accept that you can tell primary from secondary amines by spot test, but length of side-chain? Which of the two side chains has two carbons, and which has one (cf. MDEA and MBDB, for example)? Just because someone is selling a pill-popper over-prices spot tests doesn't mean that they work.

And my "crusade" is purely to cut down on the amount of ignorance on the subject, which is pretty evenly balanced between the sides. I don't even have skin in the game any more.

 

[badcompany]

Cigarettes are more dangerous than heroin

 

[CREATIVE!11]

Cigarettes are more dangerous than heroin

 

[ubern00b]

Do you remember that bit where I promised to laugh in your face if anyone said spot testing? Here it is: ha, ha, ha. Seriously, that is cobblers. Do you think that it was that simple the courts wouldn't accept it as evidence? Not pay proper labs to do the job properly? Because at the very best all you will get is a range of related drugs. Have you any idea how many phenethylamines there are out there? I will accept that you can tell primary from secondary amines by spot test, but length of side-chain? Which of the two side chains has two carbons, and which has one (cf. MDEA and MBDB, for example)? Just because someone is selling a pill-popper over-prices spot tests doesn't mean that they work.

And my "crusade" is purely to cut down on the amount of ignorance on the subject, which is pretty evenly balanced between the sides. I don't even have skin in the game any more.

Fine, if you want to be completely pedantic I SHOULD have said MDxx but the rest of my post still stands. You didn't come across as even remotely interested in cutting down ignorance on both sides, merely lambasting those of us who try our best to be as safe as possible given the resources we have.

 

[badcompany]

I took xtc 1990-2003 pretty much every weekend, it's coke or rather crack and heroin that ruin lives. Legal highs I wouldn't touch with a barge pole.

DMT now that is something I do want to try and it's found naturally in our bodies and it's the strongest hallucinogen known to man.

 

[badcompany]

More people die through to tobacco, it's also more addictive.

 

[CREATIVE!11]

Do you remember that bit where I promised to laugh in your face if anyone said spot testing? Here it is: ha, ha, ha. Seriously, that is cobblers. Do you think that it was that simple the courts wouldn't accept it as evidence? Not pay proper labs to do the job properly? Because at the very best all you will get is a range of related drugs. Have you any idea how many phenethylamines there are out there? I will accept that you can tell primary from secondary amines by spot test, but length of side-chain? Which of the two side chains has two carbons, and which has one (cf. MDEA and MBDB, for example)? Just because someone is selling a pill-popper over-prices spot tests doesn't mean that they work.

And my "crusade" is purely to cut down on the amount of ignorance on the subject, which is pretty evenly balanced between the sides. I don't even have skin in the game any more.

Can you elaborate a bit more? what did you used to do that involved all this knowledge?

I researched it a lot but it's patchy as it was a while ago, so you have MDMA I take it yes and then there are a tonne of molecular variants? how many? do their effects differ to actual MDMA?

That is the problem with drugs. If there was pharmaceutical grade MDMA of course it'd be a lot better for peoples health.

More people did through to tobacco, it's also more addictive.

Fine, if you want to be completely pedantic I SHOULD have said MDxx but the rest of my post still stands. You didn't come across as even remotely interested in cutting down ignorance on both sides, merely lambasting those of us who try our best to be as safe as possible given the resources we have.

If you ever want MDMA tested you can send it to http://www.wedinos.org/ I think they test it properly.

 

[ubern00b]

I researched it a lot but it's patchy as it was a while ago, so you have MDMA I take it yes and then there are a tonne of molecular variants? how many? do their effects differ to actual MDMA?

Remember "Bath Salts"? That was MDPV and is most certainly very different to MDMA. That is why it isn't usually classed in the MDxx group, but as you can see it is still a "MD##" chemical.

For the others, an exhaustive list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substituted_methylenedioxyphenethylamines

If you ever want MDMA tested you can send it to http://www.wedinos.org/ I think they test it properly for all of its elements.

Fully aware of where to get things tested but thank you all the same

 

[CREATIVE!11]

Remember "Bath Salts"? That was MDPV and is most certainly very different to MDMA. That is why it isn't usually classed in the MDxx group, but as you can see it is still a "MD##" chemical.

For the others, an exhaustive list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substituted_methylenedioxyphenethylamines

 

[Guest2]

I bought Mephedrone when it was legal a few years ago from a website. 10g was £50 I think and it stated it was 99.9% pure. Jesus it was strong!

The 10g lasted me about the year and a half it stayed legal. I did try it again when people were buying it illegally but it was no-where near as good.

I (we) had some fantastic nights off ~200mg of Mephedrone. It was harsh in the way it brought you up like a rocket then crashing through the floor hard but we knew this.

I also purchased a 'Benzo Fury' 'Research chemical pellet' a few years ago but have never taken it because I read bad things (and some good) On the back it says it contains '120mg 1-benzofuran-6-ylpropan-2-amine' the pellet is light green in colour with no markings

Like this

 

[ubern00b]

I read far too much over shadowing bad than good when it came to 6-APB.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Which brings me to a favourite question for all the druggies: how do you know you have ever taken a drug that you believe it to be? That tablet that you really liked, so you assumed it was MDMA, for example. How do you know it was? Please don't say "I tested it", because unless the test was done by a reputable laboratory with at least one EI mass spec and a good library I'm just going to laugh at your naiveté. And don't say that you saw the results of a test on an identical tablet, because that's nonsense as well.

Hampshire have a few Bruker ALPHA FT-IR Spectrometer for analysing substances onsite at festivals. I had a very angry response when I told someone their MDNA was only 16.8% pure.

 

[Burnsy2023]

I also purchased a 'Benzo Fury' 'Research chemical pellet' a few years ago but have never taken it because I read bad things (and some good) On the back it says it contains '120mg 1-benzofuran-6-ylpropan-2-amine' the pellet is light green in colour with no markings

Benzo Fury is currently a class B drug, I'd suggest you get rid.

 

[Johno please?]

Some chav in swindon took a loooooad of them and died

 

[Guest2]

I read far too much over shadowing bad than good when it came to 6-APB.

I didn't do that much reading but do find it interesting from a chemistry point of view. Not that I understand much of it but whoever comes up with a new legal form of MDMA or something maybe even better in my eyes is god!

 

[Guest2]

Benzo Fury is currently a class B drug, I'd suggest you get rid.

Thanks. I have just flushed it down the toilet

Some chav in swindon took a loooooad of them and died

Why is that funny? You could die off taking a load of anything. Downing a bottle of spirits for example. Didnt a girl recently die from too many jager bombs... BAN THEM

Slightly off topic but why are there pictures of tumors etc. on cigarette packets but not on alcohol adverts? I'm not a smoker but it's your choice if you smoke, drink, take drugs, drive fast cars...

 

[ubern00b]

I didn't do that much reading but do find it interesting from a chemistry point of view. Not that I understand much of it but whoever comes up with a new legal form of MDMA or something maybe even better in my eyes is god!

Anything even remotely similar would eventually be classified. The only real "God" is Alexander Shulgin