New tax rules - Double tax

i5aces · 25 Sep 2014 at 08:05

If I buy a car/bike after 01/10/14 and it already has tax on it I have to retax it in my name, and the seller get's refunded for any tax still left.
but only for full month's, so say I buy a car with 10 months tax on it on 05/10/14 I have to tax it that day so for the month of Oct it is double taxed as the seller will not get that month back.

Nathan · 25 Sep 2014 at 08:06

Correct.

Rybo89 · 25 Sep 2014 at 08:08

Forgot about this. Just another stupid idea that just makes selling/buying a car more of a nuisance.

i5aces · 25 Sep 2014 at 08:12

Ah now I understand the REAL reason for the change.

ICDP · 25 Sep 2014 at 08:53

i5aces said:
Ah now I understand the REAL reason for the change.

Yep, the Govt finds another way to shaft motorists by making tax non-transferable and they end up making millions per year in this fashion.

If you or I conned someone like this we would be sent to jail. :mad:

chanjy · 25 Sep 2014 at 09:25

Dramatic much? You're hardly being shafted, the maximum damage it could be is around £40 and in the vast majority of cases much less than that.

ICDP · 25 Sep 2014 at 10:47

chanjy said:
Dramatic much? You're hardly being shafted, the maximum damage it could be is around £40 and in the vast majority of cases much less than that.

The word motorists is plural, meaning many.

It is not about me being shafted, it is about many thousands of motorists being shafted every single month in the UK. One person it is not seen as a problem as they have only lost a few quid. Now multiply that by thousands every month and you can image the millions the Govt are going to make by this subtle little con.

IAmATeaf · 25 Sep 2014 at 10:56

chanjy said:
Dramatic much? You're hardly being shafted, the maximum damage it could be is around £40 and in the vast majority of cases much less than that.

According to the BCA, in 2012 around 7.1 million used cars were sold and don't forgot not only does the seller not get part of the month, the buyer also has to pay for the full month. So double bubble and a ding-ding-win as for the switchover month the tax on the car is being paid for twice!

Akagi · 25 Sep 2014 at 10:58

As far as I am aware, you get your remaining tax refunded when you sell a car. So its swings and roundabouts.

antijoke · 25 Sep 2014 at 11:02

What is the logic behind this being introduced?

chanjy · 25 Sep 2014 at 11:04

ICDP said:
The word motorists is plural, meaning many.

It is not about me being shafted, it is about many thousands of motorists being shafted every single month in the UK. One person it is not seen as a problem as they have only lost a few quid. Now multiply that by thousands every month and you can image the millions the Govt are going to make by this subtle little con.

Government doesn't 'make money'

It raises revenue to spend on public services, debt repayment etc. and this is really fiddling around the margins. Hardly a scam designed to fleece motorists - if they wanted to do that they would keep increasing fuel duty.

Enough of the outrage already, it's boring.

tom_e · 25 Sep 2014 at 11:13

Acme said:
As far as I am aware, you get your remaining tax refunded when you sell a car. So its swings and roundabouts.

You get any full months left, so unless you time it perfectly they're always going to be getting a little extra tax money.

Firestar_3x · 25 Sep 2014 at 11:14

tom_e said:
You get any full months left, so unless you time it perfectly they're always going to be getting a little extra tax money.

So the same as it works with the paper discs then?

Akagi · 25 Sep 2014 at 11:14

tom_e said:
You get any full months left, so unless you time it perfectly they're always going to be getting a little extra tax money.

Ah OK.

Worst case scenario then, you have a car which is £500 to tax, and you sell it on the 1st, and are £40 ish down?

Firestar_3x said:
So the same as it works with the paper discs then?

I think that is how it works if you scrap a car (?), but ordinarily if you sell a car, the remaining tax goes with it of course.

Dogbreath · 25 Sep 2014 at 12:21

i5aces said:
If I buy a car/bike after 01/10/14 and it already has tax on it I have to retax it in my name, and the seller get's refunded for any tax still left.
but only for full month's, so say I buy a car with 10 months tax on it on 05/10/14 I have to tax it that day so for the month of Oct it is double taxed as the seller will not get that month back.

This is exactly how it has always been if you want to buy or refund tax, i.e. you only get whole months refunded, and if you tax the car part way through a month you effectively lose part of that months tax.

The only thing that has changed is that it is now compulsory to get the refund and for the new seller to buy the tax.

IvanDobskey · 25 Sep 2014 at 12:57

Dogbreath said:
This is exactly how it has always been if you want to buy or refund tax, i.e. you only get whole months refunded, and if you tax the car part way through a month you effectively lose part of that months tax.

The only thing that has changed is that it is now compulsory to get the refund and for the new seller to buy the tax.

This

i5aces · 25 Sep 2014 at 13:28

Dogbreath said:
This is exactly how it has always been if you want to buy or refund tax,

I can only think of one time I have ever wanted tax refunded, and that was when I wrote off a car.

but all the cars and bikes i have bought in the past have had some tax remaining so I bought the car registered it in my name then renewed the tax once it expires.

Never have I had a car thats taxed twice at the same time.

Gaygle · 25 Sep 2014 at 13:45

Dogbreath said:
This is exactly how it has always been if you want to buy or refund tax, i.e. you only get whole months refunded, and if you tax the car part way through a month you effectively lose part of that months tax.

Correct, but that wasn't a problem before because when you bought a car, it came with the tax disc 99% of the time. The problem is below, which now forces this charge upon everyone.

Dogbreath said:
The only thing that has changed is that it is now compulsory to get the refund and for the new seller to buy the tax.

chanjy said:
Dramatic much? You're hardly being shafted, the maximum damage it could be is around £40 and in the vast majority of cases much less than that.

Acme said:
Ah OK.

Worst case scenario then, you have a car which is £500 to tax, and you sell it on the 1st, and are £40 ish down?

Yeh. For most people, the most they'll lose is around £20. However, it is just another £20 that is going to the government out of the public's pocket. £20 x 7.1 million car sales/annum = £140million per year.

And this is forgetting that the government are likely to change the VED thresholds again because car manufacturers have become too clever resulting in lost taxation. So soon, your car that costs £190pa to tax could be far higher. A bit like the poor buggers back in 2006 who bought cars that emit over 225g/km CO2, but only expected to pay £250~ until in 2008 the government decided to change it so that they paid ~£450 a year to drive their average, run of the mill car, just "because".

ubersonic · 25 Sep 2014 at 13:48

7.1 million cars sold each year, average tax disc price £175, divided by 12 months = £14.58, multiply that by 7.1 million equals £103,541,666. This change is set to ~~earn the government~~ raise over £100 million each year.

Gaygle · 25 Sep 2014 at 13:53

ubersonic said:
7.1 million cars sold each year, average tax disc price £175, divided by 12 months = £14.58, multiply that by 7.1 million equals £103,541,666. This change is set to ~~earn the government~~ raise over £100 million each year.

To be fair, that is assuming that every of those 7.1 million cars is sold at the beginning of the month.

I should think realistically it'd be about £50 million raised.