Soldato
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- 27 Apr 2013
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I suspect he meant 'intellectual' in the political context.
Will UKIP win its first seat in parliament tonight?
- Thread starter Danthus
- Start date
I suspect he meant 'intellectual' in the political context.
So you don't know of any problems then? just trying to stir things up. Lots of people came in to the UK years ago.
And UKIP are not stopping immigration they are just being picky who comes in like most countries do.
Really?, I suspect it's indicative of the usual anti-intellectual rhetoric you see from the socially right leaning.
A good reason for them to ignore facts, statistics & reality if it's being pushed by those 'shifty eggheads'. More so when reality tends to have a liberal bias.
Scorza is actually a leftist as far as I know. It's just that he dislikes immigrants (particularly Muslims).
UKIP's message resonates on both right and left due to its simplicity: your life isn't as good as it can be because of "those different people", we'll take care of them and life will be great.
Immigration is putting unsustainable pressure on all three of those areas?
Is it?
http://www.cream-migration.org/publ_uploads/CDP_22_13.pdf
Overall, our findings indicate that EEA immigrants have made a positive fiscal
contribution, even during periods when the UK was running budget deficits.
This positive contribution is particularly noticeable for more recent immigrants
that arrived since 2000 in particular from EEA (European Economic
Area) countries.
Don't let the facts get in the way of your irrational fears and concerns tho.
Why would it be unsustainable?
And the economy is doing fine (presumably that's one of your three areas(?))
Wait what? Right wing people are anti-intellectual? Eh?
Soldato
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Although it's true that those of us on the right tend to view intellectuals with scepticism, it has absolutely nothing to do with ignoring facts and statistics. Intellectuals rarely deal in objective truths after all. And it's not just the right who are critical of intellectuals, but many on the left also, for example Chomsky.
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Conservatives have anti-intellectual tendencies, yes. In some countries, such as certain Eastern EU ones, the conservatives are actually left wing (former elements of the Communist parties) but they display similar reluctance towards intellectuals because they're the ones who usually put forward progressive ideas.
Is it?
http://www.cream-migration.org/publ_uploads/CDP_22_13.pdf
Overall, our findings indicate that EEA immigrants have made a positive fiscal
contribution, even during periods when the UK was running budget deficits.
This positive contribution is particularly noticeable for more recent immigrants
that arrived since 2000 in particular from EEA (European Economic
Area) countries.
Don't let the facts get in the way of your irrational fears and concerns tho.
Not that I am anti-immigration, but positive fiscal contribution doesn't mean they do not put a strain on the NHS? Or education?
But then this comes down to an allocation of funds and failings on the Government.
Yes larger numbers are straining the NHS because of immigration, but the same could happen if we have a massive baby boom.
'Sending them all home' might take a bit of pressure of the NHS, but at the cost of far more worrying consequences.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/oct/22/temporary-migrants-nhs-cost-study
http://news.sky.com/story/1188138/maternity-tourists-using-nhs-for-free-care
at least £2 Billion used by NHS on treating NHS tourists.
As for education, I see it first hand as I work in education. Migrants arriving with 5+ kids (that's just one family, there were 5-10 families looking for 34 childrens school primary places in Sept 14 this year alone in the one school I am aware of....IN JUST ONE SINGLE SCHOOL) and they all have to be schooled. Schools at breaking point due to having to divert cash from teaching to interpreters/classroom assistants for the new pupils. Laying off staff to save money that then has to be spent on interpreters. Teachers having to do more 1 to 1 coaching with the migrant pupils to try and help them and the other pupils in the class don't get as much quality teaching time (only so many hours in a school day)...but hey...don't let actual real life experiences get in the way of an academic paper
http://news.sky.com/story/1188138/maternity-tourists-using-nhs-for-free-care
at least £2 Billion used by NHS on treating NHS tourists.
As for education, I see it first hand as I work in education. Migrants arriving with 5+ kids (that's just one family, there were 5-10 families looking for 34 childrens school primary places in Sept 14 this year alone in the one school I am aware of....IN JUST ONE SINGLE SCHOOL) and they all have to be schooled. Schools at breaking point due to having to divert cash from teaching to interpreters/classroom assistants for the new pupils. Laying off staff to save money that then has to be spent on interpreters. Teachers having to do more 1 to 1 coaching with the migrant pupils to try and help them and the other pupils in the class don't get as much quality teaching time (only so many hours in a school day)...but hey...don't let actual real life experiences get in the way of an academic paper
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Hmmm, never really noticed it. I just read it on a very simple level that Conservatives do not like smart people. Their love for private sectors kind of opposed that view.
Looks like I have some learning/ reading to do.
Makes me laugh how Ed and Nick are sounding off on the bbc..... these two are obsolete now, they will be replaced soon.
Its time for the parties to choose the leaders and messages they will present at the election, they are just wasting time. All 3 main parties now have leaders who are a liability rather than an asset!
All 3 are proven to be not upto the job... either useless, backtracking or outright liars.
A strong, well spoken leader with a firm direction and sensible ideas would wipe out ukip overnight. People just want someone they can trust in, and sadly farage is the only one who is UNTESTED and therefore best of a bad bunch to the average voter.
Its time for the parties to choose the leaders and messages they will present at the election, they are just wasting time. All 3 main parties now have leaders who are a liability rather than an asset!
All 3 are proven to be not upto the job... either useless, backtracking or outright liars.
A strong, well spoken leader with a firm direction and sensible ideas would wipe out ukip overnight. People just want someone they can trust in, and sadly farage is the only one who is UNTESTED and therefore best of a bad bunch to the average voter.
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The claim was immigrant pressure on the NHS, Education or the economy. I've proved the latter was a false claim (I can give you 10 more links showing it) which makes the first two claims false as both the NHS and Education in general are state funded and the "pressure" is actually lack of funds. Funds which come from the state budget, to which the immigrants have a net contribution (they pay more than they take out).
This is a problem. I welcome the immigrants (with reason) but there is no getting away from this. Especially when you start looking at the figures with schools hiring interpreters. My nan is on the board of Governors for schools in Havering and she says it's getting out of hand, and there isn't a way to really fund it. Hence, as you mentioned, cuts.
I see what you are saying, that must mean there was a problem with the NHS before immigration woes? Seeing as they are net contributors.
Soldato
- Joined
- 27 Apr 2013
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Being 'anti-intellectual' is not the same as being 'anti-intelligent'. And it's a feature of the left as well as the right.
These days I think it's more commonly called anti pseudointellectualism to make the distinction clearer.
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What's the point? I remember the first few years I could vote and it seemed exciting. The debates featuring Nick Clegg where he seemed like a breath of fresh air and like things could actually happen... Then nothing. I lost faith in this system that day.
I may not be for UKIP's ideas, some are good some are bad but I think it's great people are voting for a person and not a party. The system needs a shake up!
I may not be for UKIP's ideas, some are good some are bad but I think it's great people are voting for a person and not a party. The system needs a shake up!
ok give me "proof" on the education slant please
I work in it and can give you countless real life aspects that some academic study can "disprove" but in reality, it's happening, it's real and people are trying to say it's not a problem when it really really is.