And if the gun had been real and the kid had gone on a spree?
Justified or gun happy?
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And if the gun had been real and the kid had gone on a spree?
Precisely.
It seems like many people have it in for the police and that they can't really win.
Respond decisively to a potential gunman that later turns out to be just a kid with a toy = they should have known it was a fake.
Don't respond decisively to a potential kid with a toy that later turns out to be a gunman = they should have stopped him.
I'm not by any means saying that the police are infallible and there aren't some power hungry/corrupt ones out there, but it's all to easy to jump on them and criticise their actions with the benefit of hindsight.
But he didn't, that's another hypothetical like Platypus's post. He acted like an absolute ********, but that doesn't justify a been killed.
The officers didn't know that at the time.
No, He acted like an absolute ******** with an automatic pistol!
This makes a huge diference.
They had no way to know the gun wasn't real. The youngest school shooter in the US was just six when he shot a fellow student. Kids blow each others brains out in the US with a scary regularity. Whether it's through accidental discharge, intentional murder / gang violence or spree shootings. Nathan Ferris was 12 when he killed another student and then himself because he was bullied.
These two were 11 and 13: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_Johnson_and_Andrew_Golden
When you're called to reports of someone with a gun intentionally scaring other people, you don't **** around in the US, regardless of what age they might be.
That doesn't change the fact that they had to make that decision. Delay and risk the gun being real, with the potential outcome of other people dying, or stop the person waving the gun around there and then.
Kids younger than 12 are more than capable of murder, you can't just assume he's just playing because he's 12.
Given the situation I think it was justified. A massive shame for everyone involved, including the police officer who has to live with "needlessly" killing a 12 year old boy.
The resounding conclusion as always is that America need to sort their act out when it comes to guns and make the decision to let go of that stupid 2nd amendment.
This isnt really just a US problem though is it?
What would happen if the exact same incident played out in a public park in central London?
I'd imagine that the youth would be just as dead!
Doesn't even need to be a gun...
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/n...psni-officer-right-to-open-fire-28921771.html
Soldato
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Justified... But that's not saying that the community will acknowledge it. It wouldn't surprise me if there is retribution or riots etc.
You only need to watch movies and tv now to see kids as young at 10 killing people and children. They don't get the ideas for the story from their imagination, it really does happen. Kids as young as 10 in gang and heavy crime ridden areas are recruited and used to commit murder as a way of initiation. Its not a surprise at all that someone has been killed by waving a fake gun about in public. The police really just cannot take the chance that it is real and that the person waving it about isn't about to kill several children.
You only need to watch movies and tv now to see kids as young at 10 killing people and children. They don't get the ideas for the story from their imagination, it really does happen. Kids as young as 10 in gang and heavy crime ridden areas are recruited and used to commit murder as a way of initiation. Its not a surprise at all that someone has been killed by waving a fake gun about in public. The police really just cannot take the chance that it is real and that the person waving it about isn't about to kill several children.
Why? Because he's black?
In any case, (I'm not exactly clued up on rap, but...) isn't it 20 years since Tupac and Biggie? Are guns even mentioned in modern popular hip-hop any more?
Mentioned on the radio this morning that the officer new that it was a boy (not an adult) and had been informed that it was likely a toy gun.
I'm not saying it means it's the officers fault but obviously it would change things slightly, the lad may simply have taken it out to show it's a toy without thinking, it's the sort of daft things kids do when told to do one thing - they do something else.
Perhaps the response was incorrect, how would the UK police have responded? perhaps with a couple of armed officers, but would they treat it differently?
I'm not saying it means it's the officers fault but obviously it would change things slightly, the lad may simply have taken it out to show it's a toy without thinking, it's the sort of daft things kids do when told to do one thing - they do something else.
Perhaps the response was incorrect, how would the UK police have responded? perhaps with a couple of armed officers, but would they treat it differently?
If he was going to start shooting he had ample time to do so. If they had none lethal weapons then they should've used them.
Also give the U.S police's record for shooting first and distorting the truth to cover their own backs then questions need to be asked by the American public.
Also give the U.S police's record for shooting first and distorting the truth to cover their own backs then questions need to be asked by the American public.
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Indeed, an article about an armed robber caught in the middle of a robbery is a completely similar example
Whilst I'd like to hope that due to the less prevalent gun culture here, the police would be slightly more hesitant in shooting, ultimately, I'd rather the idiot who thought it was a good idea to play with a realistic replica gun in public and ignore police instructions got shot, than an actual gunman was allowed to shoot bystanders because the police were too worried about repercussions to do anything about it.
Lets face it, playing with a realistic replica gun in public is stupid.
Ignoring the instructions of armed police when they have their weapons pointed at you because you're stupid enough to be playing with a realistic replica gun in public is begging for a Darwin Award.
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This is the only other option really.
Faced with the situation at hand, the officer had to shoot. If he had some non-lethal way of stopping the kid, he could have done so. Unfortunately he didn't.
Whilst I'd like to hope that due to the less prevalent gun culture here, the police would be slightly more hesitant in shooting, ultimately, I'd rather the idiot who thought it was a good idea to play with a realistic replica gun in public and ignore police instructions got shot, than an actual gunman was allowed to shoot bystanders because the police were too worried about repercussions to do anything about it.
Lets face it, playing with a realistic replica gun in public is stupid.
Ignoring the instructions of armed police when they have their weapons pointed at you because you're stupid enough to be playing with a realistic replica gun in public is begging for a Darwin Award.
I would rather police were certain that a boy with a gun is an active threat before slaying him. If that means waiting until a moment of aggression, so be it (surely kids with toy guns are miles more common than actual murderous children?!). Killing kids with toy guns is not preferable to waiting a few moments to gain absolute certainty. They shot him because he didn't put his hands up - he didn't point the gun at anyone. And he was 12 - a child. If it was sex we were talking about, it would be statutory rape - children that young need added protection from the law, even if it means giving them some benefit of the doubt when apparently carrying a firearm.
If what the police are saying is true then they did as much as could be expected. He was told to put his hands up and didn't. If he had a real gun and killed someone then they would have been rightly crucified. To those saying about non-lethal force, how close do you think you have to be to use a taser or beanbag shot. They don't use them against suspects armed with guns because that is like fighting a man with a sword using a knife. Also beanbag shot can kill, especially against a child.
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It takes fractions of a second to point a gun and fire it.
The Cops did right, better safe than sorry, when it comes to guns
Exactly, good post.