Will UKIP win its first seat in parliament tonight?

[Zethor]

why exactly is socialism on the rise ? people seem disenfranchised and are complaining about the state of the UK

What is the problem ? I go to work, I get paid and have a good lifestyle .. I get by, I am both self taught and have paid for my own education. I didn't go to a fancy school, I grafted.
I don't require welfare, social housing, child benefit .. any benefits to speak of. The taxation only hits me if the petrol prices go up which they aren't,

just what the hell are people whining about ? The only legitimate thing people need is a cheap ( but not free ) health service and incapacity benefit if they are disabled.

Im confused, enlighten me please GD

Did you build the road you use to get to work? What about its maintenance? Education, do you honestly think what you paid covers all the costs over, what, ~15 years? What about law enforcement, the military that protects the country, the diplomants who negotiate for the country all over the world?

The taxes you pay don't cover even a fraction of the benefits you get from living in the UK. They are covered through joint effort made by young or old, dead or living, healthy or sick. In other words, they are covered through socialism.

You get welfare every time you take a breath of fresh air, you get social housing because even if you own a house, the only thing stopping me from taking it from you at gun point is the society built around you and you get benefits every day at work because of the regulations created and enforced for the sole purpose of protecting you.

 

[ubersonic]

You get welfare every time you take a breath of fresh air, you get social housing because even if you own a house, the only thing stopping me from taking it from you at gun point is the society built around you and you get benefits every day at work because of the regulations created and enforced for the sole purpose of protecting you.

That's not socialism, it's civilization.

why exactly is socialism on the rise ? people seem disenfranchised and are complaining about the state of the UK

People are complaining because they believe they are "worldly" because they read things they agree with on the internet, they completely ignore the fact that standards of living are great in this country and they would be worse off in 99% of other country's and just focus on the bad points, they are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

 

[robgmun]

You get welfare every time you take a breath of fresh air.

Not yet, but if Labour has their way then prehaps

 

[ubersonic]

Not yet, but if Labour has there way then prehaps

/drumroll

Take a bow

 

[Zethor]

That's not socialism, it's civilization.

There have been many different civilisations through history but the current British one has democratic socialism at its core.

 

[robgmun]

No, it's capitalism with slight socialist tenancies

 

[Zethor]

No, it's capitalism with slight socialist tenancies

You're talking about the US, which is interesting, considering your political views. The Western/Northern European states, including the UK, are social democracies.

Social democracy is a political ideology that officially has as its goal the establishment of democratic socialism through reformist and gradualist methods.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

 

[robfosters]

Brand is like a real life Wolfie Smith.

POWER TO THE PEOPLE!!!

 

[robgmun]

Brand is like a real life Wolfie Smith.

POWER TO THE PEOPLE!!!

Difference is that Wolfie Smith was portrayed by a real comedian

*On fire tonight!*

 

[Monkeynut]

Turns out the disabled man in the audience is the brother of a UKIP MEP:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/pol...nd-on-Question-Time-is-Ukip-MEPs-brother.html

 

[Mynight]

Shame. To be fair though he had a good point even if he was a plant.

I can't believe that blue haired thing, what a catch.

 

[dunker]

oh noes ukip might be a bit dodgy they are all well dodgy!

 

[D.P.]

Joke of a party!

 

[phill1978]

What i found the most interesting was the complete unfettered admittance that immigration was an 'experiment' and is only half way through !?! know body has mentioned that here .. its an astounding thing and really goes to show how there is a sinister plan to destroy nationalism and the nation state.

Think about it if you build a European union and marginalize every person to be an 'EU citizen' , give them an ID card and a free pass to roam and be tracked ( as merkel wants) then you have effectively divided and conquered and entire continent with your fascist single uber state ideas .. because then there will be a rich cream of corporates, bankers and law makers overseeing half a billion 'cattle'

the EU end game appears to be the rise of soft fascism.


(( btw im not a ukiper or any other party, just a bloke. ))

 

[phill1978]

Did you build the road you use to get to work? What about its maintenance? Education, do you honestly think what you paid covers all the costs over, what, ~15 years? What about law enforcement, the military that protects the country, the diplomants who negotiate for the country all over the world?

The taxes you pay don't cover even a fraction of the benefits you get from living in the UK. They are covered through joint effort made by young or old, dead or living, healthy or sick. In other words, they are covered through socialism.

You get welfare every time you take a breath of fresh air, you get social housing because even if you own a house, the only thing stopping me from taking it from you at gun point is the society built around you and you get benefits every day at work because of the regulations created and enforced for the sole purpose of protecting you.

what, Your describing human work effort output as socialism. Most of those things above can be regulated by the state with 3rd party oversight bodies and then part-privatized or fully.

(( Note: By privatized I don't mean Globalized, ))

 

[v0n]

its an astounding thing and really goes to show how there is a sinister plan to destroy nationalism and the nation state.

Think about it if you build a European union and marginalize every person to be an 'EU citizen' , give them an ID card and a free pass to roam and be tracked ( as merkel wants) then you have effectively divided and conquered and entire continent with your fascist ideas .. because then there will be a rich cream of corporates, bankers and law makers overseeing half a billion 'cattle'

the EU end game is the rise of soft fascism.

You can say that about any union. You are coming from one, it should be easier to understand - "if you build a union and marginalise every person to be 'British citizen' instead of Welsh or English" etc, right?. European Union doesn't stop you from being British any more than the Union of Kingdoms does from being Northern Irish or Scottish.

I wouldn't call either union 'fascist' (soft or otherwise) btw, because for it to be fascist, there would have to be agenda of integral nationalism that the wide syndicalism serves. The higher purpose. Since at the moment no country emerged as sole ruler, recipient or beneficiary of the EU syndication (in fact, the most screwed and poor countries tend to be the beneficiaries, whereas the strong ones, like Germany just keep on sponsoring everyone) and national divisions are actively celebrated, I think it's safe to presume this is as close to utopian galactic democracy as we are going to get in our lifetime rather than the evil galactic empire.

 

[phill1978]

snip

I respectfully disagree. ( im not particularly jingoistic, i prefer individualism so im just being observational )

The EU will eventually stop you from having a UK identity in a technical sense, it would seem that having a European ID / (birth certificate) and Laws decentralised from the UK and also eventually should it come to full fruition a EU currency across the board id say that, on top of free roaming across borders and a EU army then that is a compelling argument for what has already dangerously so, gone too far to a single autonomous uber state.

This is the end point of any integration

integral nationalism

because even though there is good intention human nature will screw things up. its a bad idea to put all of your eggs in one basket.

There is no European utopia, its a lie not because 'Europe', but because there is no such thing as utopia.

 

[Caged]

what, Your describing human work effort output as socialism. Most of those things above can be regulated by the state with 3rd party oversight bodies and then part-privatized or fully.

(( Note: By privatized I don't mean Globalized, this could be hard coded in law for UK owned utilities to be run and owned by UK companies to maintain the protection and sovereignty of the nation, right now they have been sold off to the highest bidder which is slightly treasonous ? ))

I think you've missed the point. Transport infrastructure projects drive economic activity in the areas affected by that project, it's not ever going to be an area a private company would want to get too involved in because the tolls that would have to be charged to make a road profitable wouldn't attract much custom.

It's the same with people expecting the railways to cover the entire costs of their operation from ticket sales.

I respectfully disagree. ( im not particularly jingoistic, i prefer individualism so im just being observational )

The EU will eventually stop you from having a UK identity in a technical sense, it would seem that having a European ID / (birth certificate) and Laws decentralised from the UK and also eventually should it come to full fruition a EU currency across the board id say that, on top of free roaming across borders and a EU army then that is a compelling argument for what has already dangerously so, gone too far to a single autonomous uber state.

This is the end point of any integration because even though there is good intention human nature will screw things up. its a bad idea to put all of your eggs in one basket.

There is no European utopia, its a lie not because 'Europe', but because there is no such thing as utopia.

Why is you drawing your artificial line around the United Kingdom any different than drawing it around Europe? All your arguments against EU integration could be made against governing at a UK level instead of a county level, the difference being that you're used to the current state.

 

[phill1978]

I think you've missed the point. Transport infrastructure projects drive economic activity in the areas affected by that project, it's not ever going to be an area a private company would want to get too involved in because the tolls that would have to be charged to make a road profitable wouldn't attract much custom.

It's the same with people expecting the railways to cover the entire costs of their operation from ticket sales.

what so what your saying is private companies don’t want a slice of road charging or road or rail development projects ? Not least the ensuing contract to maintain and charge for services and reduce government subsidies and favour on any new contract ?

the difference being that you're used to the current state.

I agree, Im used to it yes and I think its better this way, I don’t see the end game of EU integration forging a path to a better lifestyle for me, I have no political party bias

 

[Caged]

what so what your saying is private companies don’t want a slice of road charging or road or rail development projects ? Not least the ensuing contract to maintain and charge for services and reduce government subsidies and favour on any new contract ?

I'm sure they do want a slice of it, after it's been built with public money, subsidised with public money, and when it all gets too much they can hand it back to the state.

It's daft to expect a transport infrastructure project to turn a profit, they are done as investments into society as a whole.