Breaking News: Hostages taken in Sydney

woppy101 said:
Religion is the root cause of all evil
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This had nothing to do with religion - this had to do with one completely insane person doing bad stuff. If he didn't have religion to use as an excuse he would've found a million other excuses to do the same things. It's simply ignorant to think otherwise.

#Illridewithyou (you should learn from that)
 
SteveOBHave said:
This had nothing to do with religion - this had to do with one completely insane person doing bad stuff. If he didn't have religion to use as an excuse he would've found a million other excuses to do the same things. It's simply ignorant to think otherwise.

#Illridewithyou (you should learn from that)
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Except if he hadn't been raised with this religion with these be life's and attitudes especially towards women it's unlikely he would have been the person he is today and did the things he did.


And for gods sake can people please stop blaming people's bad actions on mental illness it's a bad enough to stigma attached to it already that makes it hard for people to get help without idiots like you adding to it by blaming the actions of a perfectly sane person on the vague idea that he's mentally ill.
 
SteveOBHave said:
This had nothing to do with religion - this had to do with one completely insane person doing bad stuff. If he didn't have religion to use as an excuse he would've found a million other excuses to do the same things. It's simply ignorant to think otherwise.

#Illridewithyou (you should learn from that)
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BS

While he is might be a nutter too(we don't know yet). to claim this had nothing to do with religion is utter nonsense and is the same apologist rhetoric that ignores the issues we have today with fundamentalist Islam. We do know he is a 'cleric' and an Islamist... Islam is the main driver so far, no mental illness has been confirmed yet.
 
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Tefal said:
Except if he hadn't been raised with this religion with these be life's and attitudes especially towards women it's unlikely he would have been the person he is today and did the things he did.


And for gods sake can people please stop blaming people's bad actions on mental illness it's a bad enough to stigma attached to it already that makes it hard for people to get help without idiots like you adding to it by blaming the actions of a perfectly sane person on the vague idea that he's mentally ill.
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Because there aren't examples all around the world of people mistreating women in complete absence of religion. So you think that he was entirely rational and operating with a reasonable level of mental capacity? I'm not sure that there is another way to describe someone that walks into a chocolate shop and holds the customers hostage. Seems insane to me...

Sorry Tefal but I think you're off target here mate.
 
Didn't he force the hostages to hold up a flag to the windows praising Allah? Or perhaps it was Arabic for 'I'll ride with you'?
 
SteveOBHave said:
This had nothing to do with religion - this had to do with one completely insane person doing bad stuff. If he didn't have religion to use as an excuse he would've found a million other excuses to do the same things. It's simply ignorant to think otherwise.

#Illridewithyou (you should learn from that)
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Do we even know his motives? of course it's over religion and wars.

The fact that there were islamic flags, the fact that he has a history of attacking polititions, sending abusing letters to families of Austrailian Soliders who died in Afghan.



Just last week Monis – who had more than 14,000 "likes" on social networking site Facebook - branded Australians who supported the United States and its foreign policy "racist and terrorist" on his Facebook page, which late on Monday night was taken down.
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"Shame on Team Australia and shame on those racist and terrorist Australians who support the governments of America and its allies including Australia."

The Facebook page bills itself as a "counter terrorism" page and states "it is 'Team Islam' against Australian oppression and terrorism."

He went on to congratulate Muslims who had "chosen 'Team Islam'".


He has a history of extremist behaviour




He sure as hell wasnt in there for a cup of coffee, and sure as hell wasnt in there to rob some money, he had his motives.
 
Von Smallhausen said:
Very sad that innocent lives were lost. Something has forced the hand of the security forces or they'd have dug in for the duration/negotiation etc.

To do this in the name of religion is sickening.
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Judging by some of the footage shown by ABC it appears the security forces suddenly run and stack up in a hurry by one of the exits after more hostages manage to escape.

It's likely (this is pure speculation of course) that the gunman decided to open fire in anger on the remaining hostages. :(
 
SteveOBHave said:
This had nothing to do with religion - this had to do with one completely insane person doing bad stuff. If he didn't have religion to use as an excuse he would've found a million other excuses to do the same things. It's simply ignorant to think otherwise.

#Illridewithyou (you should learn from that)
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SteveOBHave said:
Because there aren't examples all around the world of people mistreating women in complete absence of religion. So you think that he was entirely rational and operating with a reasonable level of mental capacity? I'm not sure that there is another way to describe someone that walks into a chocolate shop and holds the customers hostage. Seems insane to me...

Sorry Tefal but I think you're off target here mate.
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Nah you're off target if you assume that people who commit acts like this are mentally ill. You don't seem to be aware that perfectly sane, intelligent people take hostages, blow themselves up etc... in the name of Islam without needing to be mentally ill to do so... You've actually denied that this has anything to do with Islam.
 
Soviet said:
Judging by some of the footage shown by ABC it appears the security forces suddenly run and stack up in a hurry by one of the exits after more hostages manage to escape.

It's likely (this is pure speculation of course) that the gunman decided to open fire in anger on the remaining hostages. :(
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I said this before it even happened

DJMK4 said:
Although this is good for the ones that are escaping, I can only imagine that this is going to possibly reflect negativly for those still in there. Lets hope not
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DJMK4 said:
Do we even know his motives? of course it's over religion and wars.

The fact that there were islamic flags, the fact that he has a history of attacking polititions, sending abusing letters to families of Austrailian Soliders who died in Afghan.

Just last week Monis – who had more than 14,000 "likes" on social networking site Facebook - branded Australians who supported the United States and its foreign policy "racist and terrorist" on his Facebook page, which late on Monday night was taken down.
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"Shame on Team Australia and shame on those racist and terrorist Australians who support the governments of America and its allies including Australia."

The Facebook page bills itself as a "counter terrorism" page and states "it is 'Team Islam' against Australian oppression and terrorism."

He went on to congratulate Muslims who had "chosen 'Team Islam'".

He has a history of extremist behaviour

He sure as hell wasnt in there for a cup of coffee, and sure as hell wasnt in there to rob some money.
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Is religion his justification - sure - are his actions and crimes able to be distilled down to his religion being the driver? I don't believe so. Are all Muslims crazy and capable of mistreating women and violence? Again I don't believe so. Dude was a nutter, plain and simple, coming out swinging with the BLAME ISLAM bat makes no sense.
 
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