Protect and Serve . . . yeah right !

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:22

balky12 said:
Maybe not. You are probably right. But then this is a problem with the judical review process.

Wider than that, but not to say I do not agree.

The police operating in that area should be made aware (of which they are as far as I know), and should more expecting of erratic and aggressive behaviour.

The police made the wrong call, an unarmed, man was executed by them in a very avoidable situation where they were not only in control of the situation but outnumbered the victim.

I think it is a bigger problem with the police force in America, not just the way these cases are dealt with.

spoffle · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:23

stulid said:
Its all speculation still that he had mental heath issues. Nothing concrete or proven which is the important part.

Could have been of sound body and mind but just homeless.

You asked for a source. You were given a source, you misunderstood what source meant, now you are moving the goal posts.

opstrat · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:25

at no point do i hear police shout drop the weapon. from the bbc video the reporter says "police can be heard shouting" then you here shouting then the reporter cuts them off again. i heard **** all.

and while we are arguing over what a credible source is. the reporter says in the video "what appears to be" even he is not sure what police said and is basing his whole report on this crap mobile phone video.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:26

stulid said:
Its all speculation still that he had mental heath issues. Nothing concrete or proven which is the important part.

Could have been of sound body and mind but just homeless.

Yes he could, but according to the source I have provided you with (which quotes two other sources, of which use first hand sources for their information) he suffered from mental health issues.

You understand what a source is and how it works now?

balky12 · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:26

Tummy said:
Wider than that, but not to say I do not agree.

The police operating in that area should be made aware (of which they are as far as I know), and should more expecting of erratic and aggressive behaviour.

The police made the wrong call, an unarmed, man was executed by them in a very avoidable situation where they were not only in control of the situation but outnumbered the victim.

I think it is a bigger problem with the police force in America, not just the way these cases are dealt with.

I don't disagree with you. It does happen all too frequently but the Americans have made their bed so to speak.

It's hard for them because if they try another approached in another scenario, and it goes horribly wrong with officers and or members of public dying, they will be screamed at for not using deadly force, and I bet you a lot of that camp will be made up fo people who are quick to moan that the police are too trigger happy.

It's all very tragic, but it is a completely different world the US.

stulid · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:27

opstrat said:
at no point do i hear police shout drop the weapon. from the bbc video the reporter says "police can be heard shouting" then you here shouting then the reporter cuts them off again. i heard **** all.

Turn the volume up then as I counted at least 4 times it is said.

If you watching the same video its 20seconds in.

cheesyboy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:30

balky12 said:
I don't disagree with you. It does happen all too frequently but the Americans have made their bed so to speak.

It's hard for them because if they try another approached in another scenario, and it goes horribly wrong with officers and or members of public dying, they will be screamed at for not using deadly force, and I bet you a lot of that camp will be made up fo people who are quick to moan that the police are too trigger happy.

I strongly disagree. I bet that wouldn't be the case at all.

Do those same people call for the UK police to be armed whenever we have a serious incident? no, they don't.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:31

The Officer shouting;

rookie with less than a year's experience in the field

Kate Mather, Joel Rubin, Gale Holland, LA Times, Video of LAPD killing turns harsh light on skid row, http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-skid-row-shooting-20150303-story.html#page=1 Accessed 03/03/2015

The Officers responding were also part of a 'trained' team;

Beck said the officers involved were part of the Safer Cities Initiative — an LAPD task force specifically focused on skid row — and "are specially trained on dealing with homeless people and mental illness issues." Some, he said, had undergone the department's "most extensive mental illness training," which he described as a 36-hour course.

Kate Mather, Joel Rubin, Gale Holland, LA Times, Video of LAPD killing turns harsh light on skid row, http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-skid-row-shooting-20150303-story.html#page=1 Accessed 03/03/2015

balky12 · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:33

cheesyboy said:
I strongly disagree. I bet that wouldn't be the case at all.

Do those same people call for the UK police to be armed whenever we have a serious incident? no, they don't.

You aren't really comparing apples with apples; and you have to leave the UK well alone.

A lot of people just don't like authority and the police. Whenever they do something that can be argued against, they will take that side.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:34

balky12 said:
You aren't really comparing apples with apples; and you have to leave the UK well alone.

A lot of people just don't like authority and the police. Whenever they do something that can be argued against, they will take that side.

I agree with both parts, however I am not sure that this is happening in this case, I think more people are annoyed about an unarmed man being executed in the middle of the day by four police officers.

opstrat · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:34

right. ive watched the full video on YouTube without the voice over from the bbc.

the black officer on the far left is shouting hes going from my gun. you can see him wrestling at his side, when the man is shot you can see him jump away and try to secure his weapon.

at the start the person shouting "drop the weapon" is the other officer shouting drop my stick. over and over.

Sliver · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:37

balky12 said:
A lot of people just don't like authority and the police. Whenever they do something that can be argued against, they will take that side.

As true as that may be, it's really irrelevant to the discussion here. No unwarranted criticism of the police has been promulgated here as far as I can tell. This shooting is contentious because it seems very likely, in fact obvious, that excessive force was used and a man died needlessly. So the criticism the police in this instance are receiving is in my opinion entirely justified.

balky12 · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:38

Tummy said:
I agree with both parts, however I am not sure that this is happening in this case, I think more people are annoyed about an unarmed man being executed in the middle of the day by four police officers.

Oh yes. That wasn't specifically for this case, it's just a generic view.

stulid · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:43

opstrat said:
right. ive watched the full video on YouTube without the voice over from the bbc.

the black officer on the far left is shouting hes going from my gun. you can see him wrestling at his side, when the man is shot you can see him jump away and try to secure his weapon.

at the start the person shouting "drop the weapon" is the other officer shouting drop my stick. over and over.

I can hear "drop the gun" from the officer 4-5 times.

The wording on the ******** video also uses those words.

Two officers pull one person away. The other officers, who are farther from the camera, surround a man.

“Drop the gun,” officers shout several times with their own guns drawn. About five shots can be heard on the video.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:45

The officer shouting was a 'rookie' with less than a years experience.

stulid · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:51

Tummy said:
The officer shouting was a 'rookie' with less than a years experience.

And?

I would imagine he knows what a gun looks like, even more so his own.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:55

His ability to recognise a gun is not in question. His ability to judge the situation considering he has less than a years experience, is in question. His ability to react in the situation is in question.

It would appear he, and the other officers made the wrong call.

Amnesia · 3 Mar 2015 at 15:55

stulid said:
And?

I would imagine he knows what a gun looks like, even more so his own.

he knows what a gun looks like ?

Surely his inexperience would be the highlight of that post

stulid · 3 Mar 2015 at 16:00

Tummy said:
His ability to recognise a gun is not in question. His ability to judge the situation considering he has less than a years experience, is in question. His ability to react in the situation is in question.

It would appear he, and the other officers made the wrong call.

The other officers, the ones that shot the man were not rookies? One was a

supervisor, a sergeant

So I would think he had certainly more than 1 years experience.

It seems from the wording that the officer with less than 1years experience didn't fire any of the shots, the others did and one was a supervisor/sergeant.

Tummy · 3 Mar 2015 at 16:05

stulid said:
The other officers, the ones that shot the man were not rookies? One was a So I would think he had certainly more than 1 years experience.

It seems from the wording that the officer with less than 1years experience didn't fire any of the shots, the others did and one was a supervisor/sergeant.

No. As has been posted already, the officer whom shouted about the gun, was the 'rookie' officer.

Police officers rely upon each other in these situations, you as a team are only as good as your weakest member.