Intelligent sat-nav, is there such a thing?

Orionaut

Orionaut

Orionaut

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Does anybody manufacture an "intelligent" sat nav?

The sort of thing I am thinking of is one that, for instance, might be programmed to recognise that when I select "Shortest distance" I might actually prefer travelling an extra mile or two along the by-pass rather than spending 20 minutes grinding through the town centre, or that when I select "Shortest Time" I wouldn't want to spend an extra 30 miles on the motorway to shave 4 minutes off the "A" road route.

That sort of thing.
 
OP probably follows it when it tells him to go down train tracks or off a cliff :p
 
SamuraiTortoise said:
OP probably follows it when it tells him to go down train tracks or off a cliff :p
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Dont be daft. :D

The problem is that the sensible choice isn't necessarily "Shortest Distance" Vs "Shortest time"

This isn't a problem on familiar routes where I am only using the sat nav for locating the final destination, but on unfamiliar journeys it can make quite a difference.

A sat nav that showed "Both" choices on route selection would be an improvement (Do any do this) rather than having to go into menus to switch defaults etc to see the properties of the choices

If "I" can see that driving an extra 30 miles to save 4 minutes is daft, then surely it would be possible to program an algorithm to do so. One might even be able to set ones own preferences of impatience vs economy.

Of course, I could always go back to using maps and plan my own route, but then that kind of defeats the object doesnt it.
 
I actually understand what the OP is after.

I don't want to go through London, but neither do I want to skirt around the M25 - I wan't a happy medium, and it doesn't seem to offer me that unless I actively choose a waypoint which forces the calculation to be a mixture of both.

I guess OP what you're after is something that analyses the traffic - I believe those sat navs can give you more balanced routes - but of course you have to pay for subscription and I'm not sure how good they are. I think some do some on fuel usage so you can do a mixture of short distance vs average fuel use - so travelling extra 30 miles for 4 minutes may not offset stop start in slower roads.... it's hard for the Sat Nav to tell unless it knows you car and your MPG.

I often use Google maps navigation and it does sometimes pop up with "quicker route available" based on the traffic.

However I think your desired solution does not actively exist at the moment.
 
BMW's sat nav has an "Efficient" option (as well as the usual "Fast", "Short") which sounds a lot like what OP wants. It also offers several variations per option, so you can use your own knowledge to choose the best route.

Only problem is.. it only comes in a BMW.
 
I had a sat nav unit years ago, some cheap thing that wasn't all that good, but as well as being able to choose "Shortest" or "Fastest" routing options, there was "Most Economical", which might favour a slightly longer route on a major rather than the shortest. Similarly, it might choose a shorter more direct route even if its slightly slower.

Sounds like this is the kind of thing you're after. But to be honest, the fastest route is generally going to be the most economic anyway, so I'm not sure it made any huge savings.
 
Freefaller said:
I actually understand what the OP is after.

I don't want to go through London, but neither do I want to skirt around the M25 - I wan't a happy medium, and it doesn't seem to offer me that unless I actively choose a waypoint which forces the calculation to be a mixture of both.
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Set it to "Fastest route" but "avoid motorways"?

Hopefully that would restrict it to finding major routes such as the south/north circular instead of the M25.
 
Engram said:
BMW's sat nav has an "Efficient" option (as well as the usual "Fast", "Short") which sounds a lot like what OP wants. It also offers several variations per option, so you can use your own knowledge to choose the best route.

Only problem is.. it only comes in a BMW.
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That does sound like a sensible option to have.

Conscript said:
I had a sat nav unit years ago, some cheap thing that wasn't all that good, but as well as being able to choose "Shortest" or "Fastest" routing options, there was "Most Economical", which might favour a slightly longer route on a major rather than the shortest. Similarly, it might choose a shorter more direct route even if its slightly slower.

Sounds like this is the kind of thing you're after. But to be honest, the fastest route is generally going to be the most economic anyway, so I'm not sure it made any huge savings.
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Agreed - but sometimes the feeling of having to drive an extra 30miles just for 4min saving seems daft, but you're right I guess generally it's likely to be more economical that way.

Conscript said:
Set it to "Fastest route" but "avoid motorways"?

Hopefully that would restrict it to finding major routes such as the south/north circular instead of the M25.
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Good point - I guess that is a good compromise.
 
Google maps app automatically updates based on traffic now, quite often see it bring up other routes and tells you that would be 5mins slower etc. If based on traffic another route would be quicker it automatically moves onto that.
 
google maps gives you options too. When you come to a T junction it will recommend which way, but if going the other way is possible it show it with a(+4 minutes) above the route as option if you want to go that way.

I'd recommend at least trying google maps on a smart phone before buying a satnav.
 
In copilot i can select preferred roads, so for instance if on shortest route i don't want to actually go down b roads i set b roads to a lower preference and it will use A roads unless they add a substantial distance.
 
Fr0dders said:
google maps gives you options too. When you come to a T junction it will recommend which way, but if going the other way is possible it show it with a(+4 minutes) above the route as option if you want to go that way.

I'd recommend at least trying google maps on a smart phone before buying a satnav.
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Usually it will tell you these things when you've just passed the junction in question though :p
 
I guess something like Navigon's MyRoutes might be what you're after:

One of the vital duties of NAVIGON's navigation devices is to determine the best possible route. The new navigators being presented at CeBIT 2009 even give recommendations based on the personal driving style of the user. This intelligent feature, which is used in all new NAVIGON devices and brings a really personal note to navigation, is called MyRoutes.

Route planning that considers individual driving styles, the day of the week and the time of day: with the MyRoutes feature, NAVIGON is the first manufacturer to include personalised route guidance in its new range of projects. This feature is pre-installed in all devices of the new product range, which will be presented at CeBIT 2009. The activation of MyRoutes allows navigation devices to take the personal driving style of the user into account when recommending routes. Route recommendations are based on the personal driving behaviour of the user, the day of the week, and the time of day. MyRoutes always shows the best possible route for the driver on the basis of his or her driving behaviour and by means of an optical "MyRoute" indicator. In addition to this recommended route, up to two alternatives are displayed.
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http://www.prnewswire.co.uk/news-re...igation-with-a-learning-effect-153789045.html

Navigon have an Android and iPhone app that does this. It kind of works - offering relatively efficient routes. Navigon's TTS voice directions are nothing short of superb too. It is really expensive as navigation apps go though and has no free trial.

However I much prefer something with Tomtom's traffic (which coveres a lot more minor roads). Navigon uses TMC table based live traffic, which doesn't usually include any congestion on anything smaller than an A Road. After using more navigation apps than I care to remember, I now use Route 66 Navigate. My own preference is for a less congested route and Route 66 does a better job of using Tomtom's traffic data than Tomtom's own app or PNDs. Its dynamic routing algorithm is fantastic: if set to automatic it continually scans for the fastest route on the fly. Route 66 Navigate has a 30 day free trial for Android or iPhone, including traffic.

Navigon's traffic is basically the same as you'd get on a Garmin PND (Garmin own Navigon). Its advantage over Tomtom is they do get more road closure info for minor A Roads than Tomtom for Local Authority controlled roads. Tomtom's traffic has superb closure info for the Strategic Road Network (HA Controlled Motorways and major A Roads). They also get info from Transport for London but for minor A Roads downwards in other parts of the country, coverage can be a bit random. Tomtoms coverage of traffic speeds (both live and historic) is by far the most complete on the market although Google is staring to get close. Either the Tomtom app or Route 66 are far more user friendly than Google Maps for traffic redirection on the fly.

Edit: Both Route 66 and Navigon offer up to 3 routes when you're setting off. In either case, if you have traffic redirection set to automatic, traffic jams or closures detected will quickly over-rule your inital choice.

I'm not really a fan of Co-Pilot due to its limited traffic info but if you want the maximum level of control for what type of roads you prefer it really is very versatile. It's easy the most flexible in terms of tailoring the general routing to suit yourself but has no learning function.

Regarding more local traffic closure info with Route 66, it has a roadblock feature. I usually leave the car radio automatic traffic on and if I hear of a closure on my route I stop and block the road in the app. It will then find a way round. From time to time I keep badgering Tomtom to try and get them to include more closure info for local authority controlled roads. I've seen some improvement from them but it's been slow. You can report temporary closures to Tomtom though via their Mapshare Reporter website and for most A roads it can automatically add the closure to Tomtom traffic (which is used by Tomtom apps, Route 66 and Sygic) by automatically checking against live traffic flow. For B Roads downwards you've usually got to wait a few days for TT staff to look at it before it gets added to live traffic.
 
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Freefaller said:
I don't want to go through London, but neither do I want to skirt around the M25 - I wan't a happy medium, and it doesn't seem to offer me that unless I actively choose a waypoint which forces the calculation to be a mixture of both.
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1/. Select 'Avoid Motorways'
2/. Go through the route in the summary and have it avoid those stretches you dislike.

My very old SatNav can do this, so no reason why modern ones can't.

IMO, the 'intelligent' aspect of SatNav is in how the users applies it. It is an aid to navigation. Nothing more.
 
Yes Conscript pointed out http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=27723800&postcount=9

However, that does require fiddling with settings - besides I'm trying to interpret what the OP wants. Of course you can deselect and avoid parts of routes, but I think the OP is after something more automated, and if you don't know the area you may not know whether or not you are actually doing anything useful.

I think there's an app called Waze which is community based mapping offering good "rat runs" as well as live traffic conditions or issues spotted allowing the software to intelligently route around problems without doing a massive detour. The problem with basic sat nav settings is that often it tries to force you to go back on a road you're not interested in driving along and so you have to stop, look up the road, familiarise yourself with the area and then ignore the sat nav - which is daft, or manually enter way points, which is also a bore.

Personally I still rely on maps more than Sat nav. I still have sat nav on, but I prefer to familiarise myself with the roads so that if I feel I have a better route I can do it rather than having to manually enter all the waypoints.
 
If you set it up, Garmin EcoRoute does something reasonably clever in terms of giving the fastest route that gives the optimum fuel economy.
 
Waze is generally good at giving the most sensible route, and rerouting you if traffic's heavy etc.
 
The biggest improvement in better routing I noticed was jumping up to Tomtom HD traffic and their latest units..

In the early days of using several Garmin models and trying Google Maps etc, I always found the routing wasn't that clever and local knowledge would win everytime as the sat nav never chose that balanced mix of shortest route/time while avoiding congestion etc, and TMC based traffic was always that bit too patchy and often 5 minutes too late!

But the Tomtom GO6000 and now the in-built Tomtom NB1 in my CX5 have both got HD traffic and I have been really impressed with the more intelligent routing, in fact it's helped me find more freely flowing routes in rush hour that I didn't know even with local knowledge, I've not had to mess with routing options at all, it seems to pick the right mix of roads for me..

I do wonder what sat-nav's and issues people who stick to paper maps have had, since I can't imagine ever using a paper map again, you get no sense of traffic flow etc, so it's all down to local knowledge, since traffic and lifetime map updates have come along, I am one of those that think it's amazing how much technology can help even my mum get from A-B efficiently and with the least stress.
 
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