Battery Technology - where is it ?!?!

[Keyboards'Fear]

http://news.sky.com/story/1459847/the-mobile-battery-that-charges-in-one-minute

Scientists have developed a battery that could allow a mobile phone to be charged and ready for use in one minute.

We have developed a rechargeable aluminium battery that may replace existing storage devices, such as alkaline batteries, which are bad for the environment, and lithium-ion batteries, which occasionally burst into flames.

Perhaps not only for phone usage, who knows. But it looks interesting.
Article doesn't actually say how long the charge will last, and how much it's going to cost

 

[DaleTheWhale]

Just read the above myself and thought of this thread.

Does seem interesting, but depends how genuine their claims are, facts are a bit limited at the moment considering what they claim they could achieve in the future.

 

[arknor]

http://news.sky.com/story/1459847/the-mobile-battery-that-charges-in-one-minute



Perhaps not only for phone usage, who knows. But it looks interesting.
Article doesn't actually say how long the charge will last, and how much it's going to cost

according to the comments where someone claims to be quoting the press release it's a 2volt battery which is the highest achieved ever with aluminium batteries

 

[Keyboards'Fear]

Ah yea, thanks for that, wasn't there when I saw the article.

Otherwise, our battery has everything else you'd dream that a battery should have: inexpensive electrodes, good safety, high-speed charging, flexibility and long cycle life. I see this as a new battery in its early days. It's quite exciting.

So it could be cheap to. Still though, early days. Hopefully they can do more with it but as you know with these things it will probably be a couple of years before we hear anything else

 

[anything I don't mind]

This is a good book, http://www.amazon.com/The-Battery-Portable-Technological-Revolution/dp/0061442941 Explains the history of the battery.

 

[BigglesPiP]

In recent years I've worked with Li-Ion (LiPo is the same damn thing by the way), LiFePO4 and LiMNCo. Lithium based cells are advancing pretty aggressively, though not always in the direction of power or energy density. We want safer cells that have as poor a discharge profile (steep) as possible for our application.

 

[Angilion]

Just read the above myself and thought of this thread.

Does seem interesting, but depends how genuine their claims are, facts are a bit limited at the moment considering what they claim they could achieve in the future.

Well, their paper on it has passed peer review and has been published in Nature. A summary is free - the full paper is available to subscribers or for a one-off fee of US$32.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nature14340.html

So it's been examined by some scientists and will be examined by others. That very strongly implies that their claims are genuine because they would quickly be exposed if they weren't even if peer review had missed something major.

The key breakthrough, apparently, is the cathode. That's been the thing that has made aluminium-based batteries useless - the cathode disintegrated quickly and limited the voltage to impractically low levels even for the few dozen charge cycles it lasted for. The cathode they're using has been run through thousands of charge cycles and remains useful for ~7500 (which is far better than existing Li-ion batteries). No doubt that's under perfect conditions, but it implies a very practical lifespan even in normal conditions.

The super-duper cathode material? Graphite foam. Which can be mass-produced at a viable cost with existing technology from a cheap and plentiful material. It's used in some commercial products already (for its thermal conductivity, not for anything to do with batteries). And the anode is aluminium metal (probably actually an alloy) - also mass-produced at a viable cost from a cheap and plentiful material.

So what's the electrolyte made from? It's an ionic electrolyte and chlorine is mentioned. Previous aluminium ion batteries have used 3-ethyl-1methylimidazolium chloride as the electrolyte, so it seems plausible that this one does too. That can also be mass-produced at a viable cost from cheap and plentiful materials - you can already buy the stuff retail.

There's a long way from a working lab prototype to a commercial product, though given the resources being poured into battery research and the number of different approaches being tried it seems very likely to me that at least a few of them will prove practical for a commercial product some time within the next 5 years.

 

[Angilion]

I found something only very slightly related while looking around, but I found it interesting. There's an electrically powered bell that has been running almost continuously since 1840 on the original (quite small) batteries without any recharging.

It's not an example of alien technology suppressed by the Secret Conspiracy It's a bell with an extraordinarily low power requirement and a battery that's extremely stable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_Electric_Bell

 

[silversurfer]

Thats impressive, not the bell so much but that the battery doesnt corrode. Theres good reasons we dont use these batteries more widely I guess

 

[BigglesPiP]

Theres good reasons we dont use these batteries more widely I guess

Because the energy density, power density, packaging, charging, power per weight and energy per weight characteristics are all utterly terrible.

It can run a minuscule device for a long time in a nice environment though.

There's also a good reason you don't see this in your local Merc dealer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benz_Patent-Motorwagen

 

[silversurfer]

Yep I know of Ms Benz which was a feat at the time but I dont think it kept on working. I guess that battery type would have to be massive to match a normal AA

The voyager satellite they sent out 40 years ago, still works I think. from wiki

Voyager 1's mission is expected to continue until around 2025, when its radioisotope thermoelectric generators will no longer supply enough power to operate any of its scientific instruments.

 

[Glaucus]

Voyager hasn't got a battery though. It's an RTG. As your quote says.
Uses the heat from radioactive decay.

 

[silversurfer]

Yes thats sad, I was hoping it'd go forever like the star trek movie
What about the Mars Landers, again I guess no battery but could they last

reusing batteries

 

[Glaucus]

Curiosity is also RTG.

 

[Energize]

Yes thats sad, I was hoping it'd go forever like the star trek movie
What about the Mars Landers, again I guess no battery but could they last

reusing batteries

This is the kind of battery I am considering for my e-bike, 18650's instead of lipo packs.

 

[Aod]

Thats impressive, not the bell so much but that the battery doesnt corrode.

From what I recall, they don't corrode because the battery piles were assembled and then completely coated in molten sulphur which then solidified, encasing them entirely and protecting them from atmosphere.

This is the kind of battery I am considering for my e-bike, 18650's instead of lipo packs.

The image for the video is horrifying, dozens and dozens of mixed cells, brands, capacities, without a very sophisticated balancer/management circuit, it a big fire waiting to happen.

The light blue and purple cells look like different models of Samsung, the bright-green ones are Sony (absolutely terrible cells btw). The Teal ones are probably Panasonic.

Big Li-Po cells are so cheap these days you'd be mad to use anything else.

 

[Energize]

The image for the video is horrifying, dozens and dozens of mixed cells, brands, capacities, without a very sophisticated balancer/management circuit, it a big fire waiting to happen.

The light blue and purple cells look like different models of Samsung, the bright-green ones are Sony (absolutely terrible cells btw). The Teal ones are probably Panasonic.

Big Li-Po cells are so cheap these days you'd be mad to use anything else.

I agree that video is scary however if you use all the same, decent brand cells it's safe. In fact if you look here, some commercial ebike batteries use 18650's.

http://www.wooshbikes.co.uk/?batteries

 

[Aod]

Oh absolutely. I believe that Tesla Motors cars use 18650-format cells. No idea why though.

My point being that high-quality LiPo cells offer a better energy-to-weight ratio and can have substantially higher charge/discharge current handling capabilities.

 

[IceShock]

When it comes to batterys, Id settle for a 10,000 MAH 18650 battery which has a built in voltage adjuster from say 5v to 3v and what ever you set it at, it will perform at.

oh and for it to have etleast a 100A limit.

No such thing will probably ever exist, but would be great if it did.

 

[Aod]

Well I'd settle for a smartphone that can run Windows 10 and Android 5 depending on my mood, with triple the processing power of my current desktop, a 4k display and a battery life of a year.

Of course, it's completely impossible at this time, but that's what I'd settle for