Audi A4 Opinions

Matt-Page · 10 Jun 2015 at 23:13

Hi,

My dad is very keen on looking at some Audi A4 Special Editions. Wiki tells me these are the B7 and he's looking at the 2007 ones.

I'll be going along with him to view some and would like to know of peoples opinions on them, and any known faults? I've done a bit of googling which says they 'normally' drink a bit of oil, and can go through PCV valves and coil packs.

Is there anything else I should know about or look for? What are they like to own and drive?

Thanks.

xs2man · 10 Jun 2015 at 23:41

Nice enough. They are essentially a facelifted B6 though. And the Seat Exeo is essentially a facelifted B7, so my money would rather go on one of them to be honest.

Audi don't do fuel economy well in diesel engines, in my experience. I have had terrible fuel economy out pretty much every diesel Audi I've had (although my 2003 A3 2.0 TDI was the best, my 2009 and 2012 2.0 TDI's were awful), so if he's looking for a diesel, I wouldn't bother. Their petrol engines are nice enough though, if a little oil hungry.

paradigm · 11 Jun 2015 at 07:09

xs2man said:
Nice enough. They are essentially a facelifted B6 though. And the Seat Exeo is essentially a facelifted B7, so my money would rather go on one of them to be honest.

This, really. No point in buying the last of the last dregs of the B7 (B8 came in 2008) when you'll end up with what is essentially a 2001 car with a shiny grille.

Either up the budget and get a B8, or lower the budget and get an earlier B7 or B6. Alternatively, as said, look at the Exeo for a B7 with a newer plate

xs2man said:
Audi don't do fuel economy well in diesel engines, in my experience. I have had terrible fuel economy out pretty much every diesel Audi I've had (although my 2003 A3 2.0 TDI was the best, my 2009 and 2012 2.0 TDI's were awful), so if he's looking for a diesel, I wouldn't bother. Their petrol engines are nice enough though, if a little oil hungry.

Disagree almost 100% with everything here. Only last week did I drive from Barnstaple to Manchester (extra urban) and averaged 70.6MPG. Just drove to work (5 miles across town) and averaged 53.2MPG. The car has averaged 56MPG over it's 26,000 mile life so far.

On top of that, the 2.0 TFSI engine is an oil burning pig.

{SAS}TB · 11 Jun 2015 at 09:44

Also disagree with the diesel efficiency

I have had two 2.0 TDI A6 both of which were 50 odd MPG and my current 3.0 A5 is averaging 45 MPG with a 70 mile / day commute with a mix of back country roads, motorway (some stop start) and urban - very impressed

oh, and IB4Fox - the dashboard / console will be from the ice age

so best off buying an old BMW

Housey · 11 Jun 2015 at 10:57

Had 2 B7's, RS4 for me, 2L TDi S-Line for the wife, both well gone now. They were like 2 different cars, worlds apart. To drive the TDi was bloody awful if you enjoy driving. The steering makes a corpse seem alive, the ride will remove fillings in the first mile and the gearbox and brakes provide a level of nothingness only surpassed by an air sandwich. The interior was OK, but today will feel dated, the seats were OK and the reliability for ours in the 3 years she had it was faultless. But they really are in the category of 'some car' and bought I believe because of badge, being German or for some, because they believe they are 90% of an RS4 in all but power. On that last point they could not be further from the truth.

If dad wants 'some car' that looks nice, is OK to be in, is reliable (based on my experience) and perhaps gives him a good feeling when he parks it up or gets stuck in traffic with people around him looking at his wheels he is all set. If he wants something that does all that but is also fun, fast, frugal and invigorating, he could chose a number of better cars probably starting with a 3 series, even a Skoda VRS, frankly.

[TW]Fox · 11 Jun 2015 at 11:18

{SAS}TB said:
oh, and IB4Fox - the dashboard / console will be from the ice age so best off buying an old BMW

Actually best off buying an A6, its a generation ahead and doesn't have a 15 year old interior

EddScott · 11 Jun 2015 at 13:50

Housey said:
They were like 2 different cars

See this has always been at the back of my mind when looking at B7 RS4s. I'm not saying they are the same car but when I look at the interior of an RS4 other than the seats and a few other bits it looks the same as the interior of my B7 (A4 Avant TDI170) I've never driven an RS4 so I'm yet to be convinced it's worth doubling everything (insurance, fuel, tax etc etc)

I'm tending to look more at B8 Avant TDIs.

As for my experiences, mines a 170TDI so had its injectors and the loom changed FOC from Audi. The dealership didn't do the job properly so it ended up costing about £500 to put it right - as an indie garage did the rectification work, Audi didn't want to know. The oil filter wasn't changed (probably from new) not sure who missed it, I never thought to look but it clogged bad, made the turbo suck its oil harder and eventually blew the seals on the turbo. £300 recon or £800 for refurb item. I went with the refurb item (probably not the right move but its the choice I made) Its had the DPF, EGR and EGR cooler removed. The straight pipe in place of the DPF has made the car sound quite deep and to me not completely unpleasant and the turbo spool noise is quite noticeable. It also gives a little wastgate chatter now and again (it pleases me, it may not be for you) average MPG is low to mid 40s so nothing stunning. I'm quite happy with it really

xs2man · 11 Jun 2015 at 14:37

paradigm said:
Disagree almost 100% with everything here. Only last week did I drive from Barnstaple to Manchester (extra urban) and averaged 70.6MPG. Just drove to work (5 miles across town) and averaged 53.2MPG. The car has averaged 56MPG over it's 26,000 mile life so far.

Yours is an A3 though isn't it? Slightly different engine.

I'm only telling from experience. I have had terrible economy out of my A4 2.0 TDI's. I'm not a particularly "fuel thirsty" type of driver, but neither do I drive miss daisy.

But look at the evidence from the likes of Fuelly.com

http://www.fuelly.com/car/audi/a4/2012?engineconfig_id=13154&bodystyleconfig_id=&submodel_id=

Based on data from 10 vehicles, 227 fuel-ups and 96,469 miles of driving, the 2012 Audi A4 Diesel L4 gets a combined average of 34.05 MPG with a 0.64 MPG margin of error.

Based on data from 13 vehicles, 433 fuel-ups and 189,661 miles of driving, the 2013 Audi A4 Diesel L4 gets a combined average of 34.53 MPG with a 0.70 MPG margin of error.

And from the group that includes my old A4 Quattro...

Based on data from 5 vehicles, 112 fuel-ups and 43,023 miles of driving, the 2012 Audi A4 Quattro Diesel L4 gets a combined average of 33.81 MPG with a 0.91 MPG margin of error.

Sure, the occasional motor may do better, or worse. But overall, you can't really argue with 28 vehicles, being tracked over 330,000 miles averaging at best mid 30's mpg from the 2.0 Diesel. Or can you?

You could look at the data from a 2007 diesel since that is more relevant to the OP of course...

Based on data from 7 vehicles, 364 fuel-ups and 166,463 miles of driving, the 2007 Audi A4 gets a combined average of 35.37 MPG with a 0.33 MPG margin of error.

But compare that to the petrol...

Based on data from 9 vehicles, 300 fuel-ups and 84,451 miles of driving, the 2007 Audi A4 gets a combined average of 22.49 MPG with a 0.48 MPG margin of error.

[TW]Fox · 11 Jun 2015 at 14:40

People doing bigger longer trips regularly tend to favour diesel. This skews the averages and stops them being comparable. You can see this in your own stats, despite only containing 2 additional cars the diesel stats cover double the total miles!

paradigm · 11 Jun 2015 at 14:42

xs2man said:
Yours is an A3 though isn't it? Slightly different engine.

No, an A4.

Jez · 11 Jun 2015 at 14:44

xs2man, those quotes are US MPG, very different to UK MPG.

Change the display units between UK & US and that text does not change. The average mentioned in the text is clearly incorrect if you check the UK stats.

To use your own link to Fuelly.com xs2man, the average UK MPG for that A4 I4 Diesel sample is 41MPG

That doesnt seem bad to me as an average with some of the users seemingly driving like nutcases dragging the average down?

Antony101 · 11 Jun 2015 at 14:47

I absolutely thrash my 1.6 TDI around and struggle to get less than 50MPG even on short runs.

Yeah, it isn't an A4 and it isn't a 2.0 TDI but I'm sure there is a reason every taxi driver in the country drives an Octavia TDI?

xs2man · 11 Jun 2015 at 15:10

Jez said:
xs2man, those quotes are US MPG, very different to UK MPG.

Change the display units between UK & US and that text does not change. The average mentioned in the text is clearly incorrect if you check the UK stats.

I'm terribly sorry. I can change them now, in order.

40.89234496
41.46880093
40.60411698
42.47759887
27.00936383

Still hardly spectacular from 2.0 Diesels...

Jez · 11 Jun 2015 at 15:11

The average over the entire sample is 41MPG

That doesnt seem bad to me as an average with some of the users seemingly driving like nutcases dragging the average down, youd never get an average over a sample like this of anything like that with petrol!

Housey · 11 Jun 2015 at 15:33

EddScott said:
See this has always been at the back of my mind when looking at B7 RS4s. I'm not saying they are the same car but when I look at the interior of an RS4 other than the seats and a few other bits it looks the same as the interior of my B7 (A4 Avant TDI170) I've never driven an RS4 so I'm yet to be convinced it's worth doubling everything (insurance, fuel, tax etc etc)

I'm tending to look more at B8 Avant TDIs.

As for my experiences, mines a 170TDI so had its injectors and the loom changed FOC from Audi. The dealership didn't do the job properly so it ended up costing about £500 to put it right - as an indie garage did the rectification work, Audi didn't want to know. The oil filter wasn't changed (probably from new) not sure who missed it, I never thought to look but it clogged bad, made the turbo suck its oil harder and eventually blew the seals on the turbo. £300 recon or £800 for refurb item. I went with the refurb item (probably not the right move but its the choice I made) Its had the DPF, EGR and EGR cooler removed. The straight pipe in place of the DPF has made the car sound quite deep and to me not completely unpleasant and the turbo spool noise is quite noticeable. It also gives a little wastgate chatter now and again (it pleases me, it may not be for you) average MPG is low to mid 40s so nothing stunning. I'm quite happy with it really

You need to drive an RS4, it is a different league altogether. It understeers but only when past 90%, but its steering, brakes and gearbox all work really well (relative to other super saloons) and it obviously goes a lot better. It also has the best ride and traction compromise of any of the super saloons so if you are looking at one seek sorted and working dampers, not after market KW's which compromise some of its strong bits.

xs2man · 11 Jun 2015 at 15:35

No, the petrol is the bottom one, the 27 mpg.

I think it's pretty obvious from many of my posts on this board that I am a fan of diesel engines. Well, more specifically old VAG engines (1.9 TDI PD's) and newer BMW engines (like my 530d). I totally see the advantage with a diesel engine.

However, I stand by my conviction that modern Audi diesels are not nearly as good as their competition. If you look at comparable stats on fuelly, the 320d (comparable to the A4 2.0 TDI) shows easily between 45-50 mpg averages (UK MPG). Why Audi can't do a 2 litre diesel I don't know, but they simply aren't as efficient as the BMW. And this is almost entirely the reason I now drive a BMW 5 series rather than an A6.

From Fox...

People doing bigger longer trips regularly tend to favour diesel. This skews the averages and stops them being comparable. You can see this in your own stats, despite only containing 2 additional cars the diesel stats cover double the total miles!

Only the last set of stats there was from a Petrol, so it was 35 diesels vs 9 petrol motors there. But it's all still comparable.

paradigm · 11 Jun 2015 at 16:07

I will once again point you back at my figures above for a 2.0tdi A4

xs2man · 11 Jun 2015 at 16:15

I will once again point you to my statement that

Sure, the occasional motor may do better, or worse. But overall, you can't really argue with 28 vehicles, being tracked over 330,000 miles averaging at best low 40's(*) mpg from the 2.0 Diesel. Or can you?

* I have edited that bit of the quote to allow for the UK rather than US MPG figure.

I know of MANY people running relatively new VAG diesels as I am still quite active on a few local VAG forums. I know NO-ONE who is happy with the fuel economy of their VAG diesel.

EddScott · 11 Jun 2015 at 16:32

Housey said:
You need to drive an RS4, it is a different league altogether. It understeers but only when past 90%, but its steering, brakes and gearbox all work really well (relative to other super saloons) and it obviously goes a lot better. It also has the best ride and traction compromise of any of the super saloons so if you are looking at one seek sorted and working dampers, not after market KW's which compromise some of its strong bits.

I think I'm going to have to have a go in one. The guy I take my A4 to now has one (he races a Saff Cossie

) so might ask for a ride/drive.

Antony101 · 11 Jun 2015 at 18:08

xs2man said:
I will once again point you to my statement that

* I have edited that bit of the quote to allow for the UK rather than US MPG figure.

I know of MANY people running relatively new VAG diesels as I am still quite active on a few local VAG forums. I know NO-ONE who is happy with the fuel economy of their VAG diesel.

I am.