Buying house with reported rising damp?

Sirrel Squirrel · 16 Jun 2015 at 11:58

What would you do in this situation, the survey has reported some damp issues on a house I'm buying and a separate damp report has reported failure of the DPC and quoted £1600 to rectify. There's another problem with the chimney which needs repointing and new lead flashing. So in total I'm looking at about £2500 to get the repairs done.

At the moment I'm insisting that the current owners get the problem fixed as I'm concerned that when the damp proofing work goes ahead and they strip the walls back and look at the joists that they are going to find rot or other problems.

The current owners are saying they have no money left but I don't see why I should be footing the bill and I'd be much happier if the work was done before exchange in case there is any rot or damage to the joists.

I'm thinking as a compromise I could sort the chimney once moved in but they need to get the damp sorted. Would you agree or should they be paying the lot? The sale price is £700k so really £2500 shouldn't even be worth arguing about.

covenantuk · 16 Jun 2015 at 12:42

You can't force them to do it, and £2500 is obviously worth arguing about because you're doing precisely that.

If you've had a full survey then it should have found any further damage arising from the damp issue. If you haven't then you're taking a £700k gamble anyway so why worry about this?

In your position I wouldn't want them to do it. If they agree it's likely they'll just find the cheapest quote for the job and cover up any further damage anyway - is that what you want?

In their position I'd be doing the exact same thing. I'd agree a reduction in price equal to the cost of repair and tell you to accept the faults or find somewhere else.

Burned_Alive · 16 Jun 2015 at 13:06

Personally i'd walk away. On a £700k property, why havent they already sorted this?

R B Customs · 16 Jun 2015 at 13:13

just thinking outside of the box here, and as I don't know any further details this might be pointless; but are you aware of the 'rising damp' scam? might be worth having a bit of a read up on it as it essentially doesn't exist, and is far more likely to be the result of condensation due to poor or no ventilation, or other water ingress. this very much depends on the age, construction, glazing and other external factors.

It often gets flagged up in surveys and nearly always results in a 2 or 3k bill for DPC injections and refinishing of walls and plaster up to 1m height.

That being said, it may well be 'damp'; there may well be water ingress causing damp - but you mentioned repairs to DPC being needed and that's usually a bit of a red flag so I'd do some investigation yourself.

covenantuk · 16 Jun 2015 at 13:24

Burned_Alive said:
Personally i'd walk away. On a £700k property, why havent they already sorted this?

Probably because there's no apparent signs that anything's wrong? It's very common for a survey to flag an issue with no outward symptoms.

PapaLazaru · 16 Jun 2015 at 13:29

R B Customs said:
but are you aware of the 'rising damp' scam? might be worth having a bit of a read up on it as it essentially doesn't exist

Of course it exists. You think that the 1875 Public Health Act which required some form of damp proof course to be built into a property has been one big 140 year old scam?

Leave a brick in an inch of water for a few weeks and tell me it does not exist.

Anyway OP, if it was me, I would probably try and knock off £5k to cover yourself, it's not even 1% of the sale price. How old is the house btw?

R B Customs · 16 Jun 2015 at 14:01

PapaLazaru said:
Of course it exists. You think that the 1875 Public Health Act which required some form of damp proof course to be built into a property has been one big 140 year old scam?

Leave a brick in an inch of water for a few weeks and tell me it does not exist.

Anyway OP, if it was me, I would probably try and knock off £5k to cover yourself, it's not even 1% of the sale price. How old is the house btw?

Did you get sold DPC injections or something? All I'm saying is have a look into it, as there is a genuine case for people getting scammed out of money towards completion of a house sale when all parties have already invested money into the sale for something that had been made up. the requirement of a DPC and whether on a whole 'rising damp' exists or not is not really what I'm debating here; more of a case of is the OP's vendor getting stung and potentially loosing the sale? and is the OP loosing sleep over what might be a none-issue.

There's still a lot of unknowns, especially age, construction, condition and glazing.

This is a pretty good watch if you're interested. It features an Edwardian house which tend to be an easy target.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XORucdJ5zQw

I'm just fascinated by what seems to be a very easy trick to play so late in the stages of the house sale; the work almost always goes through and the vendor never sees the outcome and the buyer knows no different. It's usually down to a bit of mould, condensation or prodding around with a mosture probe (lol) resulting in thousands of pounds worth of work. I'm not pedaling a conspiracy theory here; I just assumed we would all be aware of this by now?

Sirrel Squirrel · 16 Jun 2015 at 14:06

Thanks for the advice, there's another damping company going in today to survey so will see if they come back with something similar.

When we looked at the house there weren't any obvious signs of damp but the Home Buyer's survey and first damp proofing guy found high levels of moisture in the same areas and both suggested rising damp/failure of the DPC.

The house was built in the 30s and generally in the area these are well built. The house has been extended so the concern is that the extension has caused these issues.

Haggisman · 16 Jun 2015 at 14:15

R B Customs said:
Did you get sold DPC injections or something? All I'm saying is have a look into it, as there is a genuine case for people getting scammed out of money towards completion of a house sale when all parties have already invested money into the sale for something that had been made up. the requirement of a DPC and whether on a whole 'rising damp' exists or not is not really what I'm debating here; more of a case of is the OP's vendor getting stung and potentially loosing the sale? and is the OP loosing sleep over what might be a none-issue.

There's still a lot of unknowns, especially age, construction, condition and glazing.

This is a pretty good watch if you're interested. It features an Edwardian house which tend to be an easy target.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XORucdJ5zQw

I'm just fascinated by what seems to be a very easy trick to play so late in the stages of the house sale; the work almost always goes through and the vendor never sees the outcome and the buyer knows no different. It's usually down to a bit of mould, condensation or prodding around with a mosture probe (lol) resulting in thousands of pounds worth of work. I'm not pedaling a conspiracy theory here; I just assumed we would all be aware of this by now?

I'm curious as to how this is a "scam" as such.

Unless you're suggesting the surveyor is in cahoots with every single damp proofing company in the vicinity, and has an arrangement to take a cut from whichever one the buyer or seller happen to go with?

I'm not suggesting that "rising damp" is reported by surveyors in cases where it doesn't exist, but it's more likely that the surveyor is simply being extra careful to cover their back.

Better to highlight a potential issue when it may be nothing, than to ignore a potential issue which does actually turn out to be something major, and for it to come back and bite them.

m4cc45 · 16 Jun 2015 at 14:48

Personally, if damp is ever seen, I'd walk away. I've had friends who have had horror stories with it. One replaced the DPC and then didn't redecorate so when he moved in it was a right mess with walls being un-even, etc.

If they're saying £2500 is too much then it sounds like they know other stuff is wrong and once you start digging it may become far more expensive.

If you are absolutely insistent that you want the house then you can go back to them with a revised offer (I'd say £10k-15k less) because it's such a risk that this may not be the end of the problems.

M.

Burned_Alive · 16 Jun 2015 at 15:33

m4cc45 said:
Personally, if damp is ever seen, I'd walk away. I've had friends who have had horror stories with it. One replaced the DPC and then didn't redecorate so when he moved in it was a right mess with walls being un-even, etc.

If they're saying £2500 is too much then it sounds like they know other stuff is wrong and once you start digging it may become far more expensive.

If you are absolutely insistent that you want the house then you can go back to them with a revised offer (I'd say £10k-15k less) because it's such a risk that this may not be the end of the problems.

M.

Exactly my point as well.

covenantuk · 16 Jun 2015 at 16:00

They're not saying £2500 is too much. They're saying they don't want to to it. Neither would I.

This is a £700k house. Amend your offer by £10k or walk away, why stress about trying to get them to fix it?

Quartz · 16 Jun 2015 at 16:07

Just walk. Who knows what else you'll uncover?

Millwall.FC · 16 Jun 2015 at 16:12

Haggisman said:
I'm curious as to how this is a "scam" as such.

Unless you're suggesting the surveyor is in cahoots with every single damp proofing company in the vicinity, and has an arrangement to take a cut from whichever one the buyer or seller happen to go with?

I'm not suggesting that "rising damp" is reported by surveyors in cases where it doesn't exist, but it's more likely that the surveyor is simply being extra careful to cover their back.

Better to highlight a potential issue when it may be nothing, than to ignore a potential issue which does actually turn out to be something major, and for it to come back and bite them.

They turn up to the property use only one questionable method in my opinion to declare you have damp to cover their back, the big damp proof companies then come in using the findings of the survey to bump their prices up and makes a fortune. Every cause of damp has a reason such as poor ventilation, broken gutter etc your better off spending the money on the cause rather than a chemical injected into your wall.

Terminal_Boy · 16 Jun 2015 at 16:26

Burned_Alive said:
Personally i'd walk away. On a £700k property, why havent they already sorted this?

A very good question. Why would anyone let such a valuable property get into such a state?

DiG · 16 Jun 2015 at 16:53

Millwall.FC said:
They turn up to the property use only one questionable method in my opinion to declare you have damp to cover their back, the big damp proof companies then come in using the findings of the survey to bump their prices up and makes a fortune. Every cause of damp has a reason such as poor ventilation, broken gutter etc your better off spending the money on the cause rather than a chemical injected into your wall.

I think the problem is that rising damp clearly does exist, otherwise DPCs wouldn't be installed. But I think your right to say that damp is diagnosed as rising damp when actually its something different, condensation etc. It's much easier to sell a chemical DPC as there is a good profit margin in it, compared to fixing the problem which might just be a bit of silicon or something

Sirrel Squirrel · 16 Jun 2015 at 17:01

covenantuk said:
They're not saying £2500 is too much. They're saying they don't want to to it. Neither would I.

This is a £700k house. Amend your offer by £10k or walk away, why stress about trying to get them to fix it?

They aren't willing to fix it or accept a lower offer so I'm a bit stuck really other than just walking away. I'm going to wait for the 2nd damp report and go from there.

On their defence they didn't know the damp was there as it can't be seen just by looking at the internal walls.

dbmzk1 · 16 Jun 2015 at 17:07

That amount of money on a house worth that is nothing, it's not like you can't afford to put it right even if it's worse than initially thought. If the house is right, go for it.

Kuros · 17 Jun 2015 at 18:00

I'd personally leave it, at this point. No reduction on the price means you're shouldering the risk of it being worse and they'll be effectively washing their hands of it.

PlacidCasual · 17 Jun 2015 at 19:59

We bought a 100 year old solid wall stone house. The survey came back damp, recommend investgate. The issue was the house had been un heated for 18 months and there were no issues with rising damp, ventilation or leaks.
Previous house 1850's brick solid wall house surveyor sticks a moisture meter against the wall, possible damp you should investigate. Lived there 4 years no damp, no leaks, the house had just been cold for a while.
Surveyors will tell you of every little indication they find for indemnity resons, you have to be careful about what is a geniune issue and whats bum covering. Apparently the 150 yar old house we bought suffered from wood worm despite the fact wood worm only affects green wood and the holes had been there 150 years in all likelihood.

I would want to know why they thought the DPC had failed what was the route of the moisture and other than a moisture meter what evidence of damp is there. Mould could easily be a ventilation issue, salt deposits might be a little more worrisome.

I'm not a qualified surveyor, structural engineer or similar so feel free to ignore me.