Burnsy / police question (air rifles)

I wouldn't be impressed if I saw a neighbour with one of these, too many people shoot at cats for giggles.
Swap 'cat' for 'child' and you can see the potential for innocently hacking someone to death (for giggles, natch)

But you could play the swap what-if game all day long.

Swap 'pencil' for 'grenade' and you can see the potential for... etc.

Some people abuse things, doesn't mean everyone does.
 
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Technically, given that he cannot control ricochets 100% of the time he could be breaking the law if any of his pellets pass beyond his boundary but it would be exceptionally hard to prove.

I have heard of people being spoken to about anti-social behaviour in regard to using air-rifles in back gardens, depending on their behaviour.

Also, the MET Police say:

It is also an offence to discharge a firearm, including an airgun, within 50 feet of the centre of any highway. This includes roads, bridle-paths or public footpaths. The offence is complete if a member of the public is injured, endangered or even just alarmed by the incident.

If anyone walking past his house can see into his back garden and be 'alarmed' he is breaking the law. Likewise if anyone under 14yrs of age is using it without the supervision of someone 21 or above, they are breaking the law.

Personally, I have no issues with people plinking in their garden as long as they are doing so responsibly. However, if you get a tool with an air-rifle things can go wrong. If you feel threatened or endangered by your neighbours behaviour the council may see it as grounds to seek an ASBO. Has he threatened you or any of your family / visitors?

I advise you show a bit of restraint if he has not done anything to directly threaten or endanger you. Even if the guy is a bit of an oddball, he may not really be doing anything wrong so it might be a bit harsh to seek an ASBO against him.

Edit - just read you say he already has an ASBO. Could be grounds for further action I guess, depending on what the ASBO is for.
 
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Yes, I know what it technically states. Will that help you if you decide you don't want to listen to the MET Police if they come and knock on your door?

The key word there is interrupted. It is very open to interpretation.

Well what matters is the law, or as Burnsy pointed out, case law. So yes, the law would help me if I wasn't breaking it.

The line the Met have provided is very poorly worded.

Notice how the law states the user of the highway, and the Mets wording doesn't...
 
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Is it rented accommodation op? You need the landowners permission to shoot on land, and if it's council then there's no way he'll have permission to shoot there. Might be worth looking into perhaps?
 
Well what matters is the law, or as Burnsy pointed out, case law. So yes, the law would help me if I wasn't breaking it.

The line the Met have provided is very poorly worded.

Notice how the law states the user of the highway, and the Mets wording doesn't...

The MET's wording is trying to simplify the below. Essentially a footway is part of a highway but not a highway in its own right. I think given the lack of statutory definitions of a highway, any decent lawyer would argue that a pathway alongside a road is part of the highway and therefore if anyone on it is injured, endangered or interrupted there has been a breach in the law.

I am sure I have read of instances where people have been fined over these kinds of incidents, but I dont really have the time to try and dig up case law now.

I fully appreciate you are trying to make an important distinction between advice by the Police and actual law, but given the below definitions and terminology, I do not feel the MET are far wide of the mark.


Highway classification

Common law has established that a highway is a defined route over which "the public at large" can pass and repass as frequently as they wish, without hindrance and without charge. The use must be as of right and not on sufferance or by licence. There is no clear statutory definition of a highway.

A highway can be established at common law or created by statute. For more information, see Practice notes, Establishing highways at common law and Highway creation by statute.

Highway is open to everyone. This is the essence of highway. It means that technically it is unnecessary to refer to public highway. There is no such thing as a private highway. A highway can be privately maintainable, but the public's rights of passage over it are the same as if it were a publicly maintainable highway of the same class.

The common law defined three categories of highway:

Footpath.

Bridleway.

Carriageway.

Legislation has supplemented these terms, using a variety of terminology over the years, some of which is now obsolete. A vast array of expressions can be encountered when dealing with highways. These are explained below.
All-purpose highway

The term all-purpose highway is not legally defined. It is used to refer to highway which can be used by all classes of traffic including:

All motor vehicles.

Vehicles drawn by animals.

Pedal cycles.

Animals being ridden, led or driven.

Ancient highway

The term ancient highway is not legally defined. The expression ancient highway is used to refer to a road that was dedicated to public use as a highway before 31 August 1835, the date the Highway Act 1835 was passed. Dedication could either be express or implied from public use. Express dedication had to be accompanied by public use of the way. For more information, see Practice note, Ancient highways.
Bridleway

A bridleway is a way over which the public have rights of way on foot, bicycle and on horseback, or when leading horses. Some bridleways include a right to drive other types of animal along the way. A cyclist must give way to a pedestrian and anyone on horseback. There is a statutory definition of bridleway in both section 329 of the HA 1980 and section 66 of the WCA 1981, but neither definition refers to cyclists, whose right to use a bridleway is derived from section 30 of the CA 1968.
Byway open to all traffic (BOAT)

A BOAT is a special category of highway, which is recorded on definitive maps. It is a highway which carries vehicular and all other rights but which the public use primarily for the same purpose as a footpath or bridleway (section 66, WCA 1981).
Carriageway

A carriageway is a way which comprises all or part of a highway over which the public has a right of way for the passage of vehicles and which is not a cycle track (section 329, HA 1980). This is the fullest public right. At common law the public's rights extended to the full width of the carriageway, but statute has placed restrictions on the public's use of some kinds of carriageway, for example, motorways. Statute has also introduced footways. A footway limits the width of the highway which is a carriageway.
Classified road

A classified road is a highway or proposed highway which is a classified road in accordance with section 12 of the HA 1980 (section 329, HA 1980). Under section 12, a road which was designated as a classified road under any previous legislation continues to be regarded as a classified road in respect of any corresponding provision of the HA 1980. In addition, the Secretary of State for Transport has the power, after consultation with a highway authority, to designate a highway as a classified road.

Before 1 April 1975 the designation classified road was financially important. Under the Ministry of Transport Act 1919, a road could be classified as the Minister for Transport considered appropriate for the purposes of receiving funds for its construction and maintenance. The LGA 1966 changed the basis of funding by introducing the designation of principal road and the LGA 1974 brought an end to classification for financial purposes. The designation classified road is therefore of relatively little significance today. The purposes for which the term is used are mostly connected to the exercise of stopping up or diversion powers.

Part 1 of Schedule 1 to the IA 2015 was commenced on 5 March 2015 (see Legal update, Remaining provisions of the Infrastructure Act 2015 dealing with strategic highways companies commenced. Part 1 contains amendments to the HA 1980 to allow one or more strategic highways companies to become highway authorities instead of, or alongside, the Secretary of State. In April 2015, Highways England replaced the Highways Agency with regard to the operation, maintenance and improvement of the strategic road network in England. However, the Secretary of State for Transport retains order making powers on the classification of a highway.
County road

The term county road was created by the LGA 1929 and is now obsolete. Under the LGA 1929, county councils acquired maintenance responsibility for all roads for which the county was (or became by virtue of the LGA 1929) the highway authority. Many of these roads had been known as main roads, but were renamed county roads. In practice this meant all roads in rural districts and all main roads or classified roads in urban districts. The term county road ceased to have significance following the LGA 1972.
Cycle track

A cycle track is a way forming all or part of a highway, over which the public has a right of way on pedal cycle, and usually (but not always) a right of way on foot. A pedal cycle which is a motor vehicle within the RTA 1988 (this means a pedal cycle which is mechanically propelled and intended or adapted for use on a road) may not use a cycle track. A highway authority has power under the CTA 1984 to convert a footpath into a cycle track and power under section 65 of the HA 1980 to construct a cycle track in or next to a carriageway, so that the cycle track becomes part of the highway. A cycle track is always publicly maintainable.
Cycleway

The term cycleway is not legally defined. It tends to be used to refer to a cycle track which forms part of a carriageway.
Footpath

A footpath is a way over which the public has a right of way on foot only and which is not a footway (section 66, WCA 1981).
Footway

A footway is a pavement or path running alongside a road over which the public has a right of way on foot only. A footway forms part of the highway but is not a highway in its own right. A footway is usually created by a highway authority under section 66 of the HA 1980. Section 66 imposes a duty on a highway authority to create a footway at the side of publicly maintainable highway if the highway authority thinks it is necessary or desirable for pedestrian safety.
GLA road

Under the Greater London Authority Act 1999, Transport for London is the highway authority for a network of important roads, formerly trunk roads. A road can be designated as a GLA road by order under the GLA Roads Designation Order (SI 2000/1117) and the GLA Roads Designation (Amendment) Order (SI 2000/1230). The London Mayor has a duty to keep those roads designated under review (section 14B, HA 1980). London highway which is not a GLA road is the responsibility of the London borough or the City of London.

London borough councils must notify Transport for London before exercising their powers under the HA 1980 or the RTRA 1984 in a manner which could affect a GLA road. If Transport for London object, the GLA's authority must be obtained (section 301A, HA 1980 and section 121B, RTRA 1984).
Green Lane

The term green lane is not legally defined. It describes an unsurfaced track which is usually of very long standing use. It may be a footpath, bridleway or carriageway, or have no public rights of way at all.
Greenway

The term greenway is not legally defined. It describes a route which has been designed for recreational walkers and cyclists to enjoy. It can be rural or urban and so far as possible follows a way which is free of motorised vehicles. A greenway will often follow the line of a disused railway, canal towpath, forest lane or BOAT.
Made-up carriageway

A carriageway which is surfaced either by being metalled (that is, laid with stone or tarmac) or in some other way which makes it suitable for the passage of vehicles (section 329, HA 1980).
Main road

Main road is an obsolete term from a highway law perspective. The Courts of Quarter Sessions (the old courts which traditionally met four times a year in each county or county borough) and county councils were able to declare a road as a main road and it could also mean a road built by a county council with money from central government under now repealed legislation. The significance of the designation was that maintenance was shared between the county council and the highway authority. On 1 April 1930, every road outside London that was a main road became a county road.
Metropolitan Road

Some roads in the Greater London area were denoted a metropolitan road under section 17 of the LGA 1963. A metropolitan road was the responsibility of the GLC as the highway authority. The LGA 1985, which abolished the GLC, brought an end to metropolitan roads and most became trunk roads.
Motorway

A motorway is a type of special road which is restricted to certain kinds of motorised traffic. Pedestrians, horse riders and cyclists are prohibited from using a motorway. Traffic Regulation Orders can be used to impose additional restrictions on the public's rights.
Permissive path

A permissive path is a path which the landowner permits to be used and which is not highway. Permission may be given to the public at large or a specific category of user and can be withdrawn. For an example of a permissive path agreement, see Standard document, Permissive path agreement.
Principal road

The term principal road was introduced by the LGA 1966 for financial purposes. A principal road was a route which was sufficiently important to the national highway network for central government involvement in its planning. The term ceased to be financially relevant following the LGA 1974. The designation remains for other purposes as under section 12(4) of the HA 1980, a principal road is treated as a Classified road.
Public path

A public path is defined as a highway which is either a footpath or a bridleway (section 66, WCA 1981). The expression public path was in common use before being defined in the WCA 1981. Therefore it should not be assumed that its use is always intended to reflect the statutory meaning, particularly if the use predates the WCA 1981.
Public right of way

To a large extent, the phrase public right of way is interchangeable with highway, but public right of way tends to be used to refer to the minor ways required to be shown on a definitive map, so Footpath, Bridleway, Restricted byway and Byway open to all traffic (BOAT).
Quiet road

The Transport Act 2000 gave a highway authority power to designate a minor rural road, typically an Unclassified road, as a quiet road and make speed and use orders in relation to it. The purpose of a quiet road is to preserve the character of the countryside and pay special attention to the needs of road users other than motorists so that other users feel safer when using country roads. Measures such as lower speed limits and discreet road signs are used to encourage motorists to travel more slowly and be considerate to other users. A quiet road is not a means of addressing a known safety issue on a stretch of road nor of tackling speeding problems. The Quiet Lanes and Home Zones (England) Regulations 2006 (SI 2006/2082) contain detailed guidance on how a highway authority can exercise its powers to designate a quiet road.
Restricted byway

A restricted byway is a highway over which the public has a right of way on foot, bicycle, horseback, when leading a horse, and with a non-mechanically propelled vehicle. Any way which was shown on a definitive map as a Road used as a public path (RUPP) at the commencement of section 47 of CROWA 2000 (2 May 2006 in England and 11 May 2006 in Wales) was reclassified as a restricted byway. A restricted byway is treated as a carriageway for the purposes of the HA 1980 (sections 47 and 48(4), CROWA 2000).
Road

A road is defined by statute as any highway or other road to which the public has access and includes bridges over which a road passes (section 142, RTRA 1984 and section 192, RTA 1988).
Road to which the public has access

A road to which the public has access is a road which the public has the landowner's permission to use. The permission can be express or implied and is capable of being withdrawn. As the use is permissive the road is not a highway, but it can fall within some road traffic legislation (such as the RTRA 1984) so that statutory controls on driving vehicles apply. There must be evidence of public use, as opposed to use purely by invitees of the landowner.
Road used as a public path (RUPP)

RUPP is becoming an obsolete term. A RUPP is a way which the public used mainly for the purposes for which footpaths and bridleways were used. It was unclear whether a motor vehicle could be used on this category of road. RUPPs were recorded on definitive maps between 1949 and 2006. The CA 1968 required a highway authority to reclassify all RUPPs within its area as either a BOAT, a Footpath or a Bridleway. Not all highway authorities were able to complete this task, due to the volume of RUPPS involved. CROWA 2000 reclassified all RUPPs as Restricted byway, which means mechanically propelled vehicles cannot use them.
Special road

A special road is a type of carriageway and is reserved for certain classes of traffic. Special roads are created either pursuant to a scheme under section 16 of the HA 1980 or by a development consent order under the Planning Act 2008. A special road can be constructed along the route of an existing highway which is transferred into the scheme or it can be constructed along a new route. Different rules apply in a special road to statutory undertakers laying their apparatus, the traffic which may use the road and extinguishment and diversion powers. A motorway is a special road which can only be used by certain motor vehicles.
Strategic road in London

A road designated as a strategic road in London by the Secretary of State for Transport or the GLA under sections 60 and 61 of the Traffic Management Act 2004. The designation restricts the powers of the London borough council over the road in the same way as the borough council's powers are restricted over GLA roads.
Street

A street is defined as:

" the whole or any part of the following, irrespective of whether it is a thoroughfare, (a) any highway, road, lane, footway, alley or passage; (b) any square or court; and (c) any land laid out as a way whether it is for the time being formed as a way or not"

(section 48, NRSWA 1991).
Toll road

Historically, either by Royal grant or statute a way could be dedicated as highway subject to the right to charge a toll. Sections 6 to 17 of the NRSWA 1991 contain provisions for tolls to be charged for special roads.
Trunk road

A trunk road is a highway forming part of the national system of routes for through traffic (traffic which does not want to stop at the location) for which the Secretary of State for Transport is the highway authority. As with a special road, trunk road status means different statutory powers apply to statutory undertakers, extinguishment and diversion orders and maintenance responsibilities.
Unadopted highway

Unadopted highway is highway which is not maintainable at the public expense. Highway which is not publicly maintainable may be privately maintainable or maintainable by no-one. The fact that a highway is privately maintainable does not mean the person responsible for maintenance enjoys enhanced rights over it which are greater than those of the public. For example, residents of an estate accessed by a privately maintainable highway (as distinct from a private road) are not entitled to erect automatic security gates at the estate entrance or put speed humps on the highway surface.
Unclassified road

A road which is not a classified road.
Walkway

A walkway is a type of footpath which passes "in, through or under" a building (section 35, HA 1980). A walkway is created by agreement with the landowner and can be dedicated subject to limitations and conditions on its use. The agreement can provide for the maintenance, cleaning, lighting, drainage and support of the walkway. A walkway is most commonly found in a modern shopping centre, where the walkway can be closed at night.
Way

The term way is not legally defined. It denotes a route which people use and can be used to refer to a route which is public, private or permissive. It is a useful term to use when the status of a route is unknown.
 
The MET's wording is trying to simplify the below. Essentially a footway is part of a highway but not a highway in its own right. I think given the lack of statutory definitions of a highway, any decent lawyer would argue that a pathway alongside a road is part of the highway and therefore if anyone on it is injured, endangered or interrupted there has been a breach in the law.

I am sure I have read of instances where people have been fined over these kinds of incidents, but I dont really have the time to try and dig up case law now.

I fully appreciate you are trying to make an important distinction between advice by the Police and actual law, but given the below definitions and terminology, I do not feel the MET are far wide of the mark.

No, I wasn't arguing that they left out the definition of highway, they didn't include the word at all. Their wording implies the person does not even need to be on a highway.

Essentially, you can shoot within 15 meters of a highway, as long as no one is impacted on that highway, or perhaps if no one is on that highway. In the example of the OP, you couldn't complain from your garden because that isn't a highway.
 
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You'll be fine with an Air rifle mate as long as you exercise some common sense and don't walk around with it in public. I've shot multiple Air rifles in big gardens and on fields and never had any issues.
 
No, I wasn't arguing that they left out the definition of highway, they didn't include the word at all. Their wording implies the person does not even need to be on a highway.

Essentially, you can shoot within 15 meters of a highway, as long as no one is impacted on that highway, or perhaps if no one is on that highway. In the example of the OP, you couldn't complain from your garden because that isn't a highway.

Indeed, which is why I said there may be grounds for the council to seek an ASBO if the OP has been threatened or endangered by his neighbour whilst he is using his air rifle.

Regarding the highway situation, I agree but I think it is an attemt to provide enough ambiguity to make people stop and think about their actions.

Generally air gun enthusiasts are a minority and generally neighbours feel nervous when someone in the next garden is out with a gun taking shots at targets. I have been questioned over it before by neighbours and out of respect refrained from doing it whilst they were about. One of my neighbours popped around and specifically asked me if I would stop because he said "one could come over the fence" (his kids were playing).The guy the OP describes sounds like he gives the hobby a bad name, and that can only be a bad thing.

But my overall point is not to go jumping in two feet first against neighbours who do shoot in their gardens if they are trying to do it responsibly.
 
You'll be fine with an Air rifle mate as long as you exercise some common sense and don't walk around with it in public. I've shot multiple Air rifles in big gardens and on fields and never had any issues.

If you were shooting on private fields without express permission of the landowner you were committing Armed Trespass (Trespassing on private land with an air weapon is up to 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine).

If the fields were a public place, you had no reasonable grounds to be in possession of an air rifle you could have been done for carrying an air-weapon in a public place which I think is up to 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.
 
If you were shooting on private fields without express permission of the landowner you were committing Armed Trespass (Trespassing on private land with an air weapon is up to 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine).

If the fields were a public place, you had no reasonable grounds to be in possession of an air rifle you could have been done for carrying an air-weapon in a public place which I think is up to 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.

Yeah but in the real world no one actually enforces those laws, especially where we live (a small town in West Yorkshire with large areas of woodlands and fields), as long as you're not hurting anyone or causing trouble
 
Yeah but in the real world no one actually enforces those laws, especially where we live (a small town in West Yorkshire with large areas of woodlands and fields), as long as you're not hurting anyone or causing trouble

Fair enough - to each their own.

I don't think I would want to risk a member of Joe Public or the Ramblers Association reporting me though, lol :p
 
On the subject of vermin. Do grey squirrels count?

Yes, but Red's dont for obvious reasons. They have to be posing a problem though for you to shoot Greys under the general license as vermin. Can't just shoot them because they pass through your garden and you think it would be good sport!
 
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